Greece, Romania, and Poland.

Program progress, politics, orders, and speculation
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SpudmanWP

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Unread post28 May 2019, 16:35

Finally... Poland can kick German butt for a change ;)
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Corsair1963

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Unread post29 May 2019, 01:15

krieger22 wrote:https://twitter.com/mblaszczak/status/1133260909894340608?s=21

The Polish Defense Minister has stated that they have sent a request for quotation regarding the purchase of 32 F-35As along with a logistics and training package




Poland Sends a Letter Of Request Concerning the F-35 Making A Step Forward In Its Effort To Acquire The Stealth Jet

The Polish MoD announced that it has sent a LOR (Letter Of Request) today, concerning the procurement of the Lockheed’s offering. Warsaw is willing to acquire the 5th generation stealth aircraft in its effort to modernize the Polish Air Force’s inventory.

The potential procurement includes 32 examples of the F-35A CTOL (Conventional Take Off and Landing) variant along with a training and logistics package. Błaszczak emphasized the fact that the acquisition is aimed at replacement of the older MiG-29 and Su-22 airframes. The Polish Air Force currently operates the aforesaid types, alongside 48 F-16 Block 52+ jets. The F-35 is to provide the Polish military aviation with an ability to work in an A2/AD bubble, that is expected to be formed should a potential conflict break out considering the geopolitical circumstances in which Poland currently finds itself.

Let us recall the fact that the MoD requested that the Harpia next generation MRCA (Multi-Role Combat Aircraft) program shall be accelerated back in November last year. The decision was fuelled by the fact that Polish Fulcrums have been involved in a couple of incidents and accidents recently which motivated the MoD to expedite the process. Lockheed Martin, according to TVN BiŚ, also assures that potential industrial input could also be provided, should Poland decide to proceed with the acquisition. TVN BiŚ also reports that Lockheed Martin’s Richard Edwards, Executive Vice President, Lockheed Martin International, declared that the jets could be delivered and reach IOC (Initial Operational Capability) status by 2024..............


https://theaviationist.com/2019/05/28/p ... Q1RFjxn5f4
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zerion

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Unread post13 Jun 2019, 01:26

Spain’s military still has eyes for the F-35 despite European fighter push

MADRID – The Spanish navy and air force are still interested in the American F-35 fighter jet, even though the government is about to join a Franco-German program to develop a new European plane.

The two services are in the beginning stages of an analysis in which the Lockheed Martin-made aircraft is emerging as a key contender, officials told reporters on the sidelines of the FEINDEF defense expo here in late May...

https://www.defensenews.com/global/euro ... hter-push/
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Unread post13 Jun 2019, 04:40

zerion wrote:
Spain’s military still has eyes for the F-35 despite European fighter push

MADRID – The Spanish navy and air force are still interested in the American F-35 fighter jet, even though the government is about to join a Franco-German program to develop a new European plane.

The two services are in the beginning stages of an analysis in which the Lockheed Martin-made aircraft is emerging as a key contender, officials told reporters on the sidelines of the FEINDEF defense expo here in late May...

https://www.defensenews.com/global/euro ... hter-push/



Clearly, the F-35B is the only viable option for the Spanish Navy. Which, should make the F-35A even more attractive to the Spanish Air Force. Especially, combined with the latters low price. Yet, I doubt France and Germany would be to happy.
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doge

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Unread post04 Jul 2019, 10:11

From Romania, practically, it seems the statement "wants to F-35" was issued. 8)
(Language is all Romanian. I went through google translation.)
https://www.defenseromania.ro/le-romani ... 97681.html
Leş: Romania wants to buy F-35s
Tudor Curtifan / 03 Jul 2019 / 12:46
Minister Gabriel Leş held a press conference shortly after.
The Defense Minister spoke about the possibility of purchasing the F-35s of the fifth generation by our country.

F-35 for Romania, not earlier than 2028
Asked if Romania is thinking about the F-35 , Les answered without hesitation: " Yes, definitely, yes!" . The Minister of Defense added that our country will concretely discuss this with the strategic partner.

" It's a capability that we have in mind. We're caught in this program. If all things go well, we can discuss such a capability from 2028 onwards , "Gabriel Leş said.

Asked if a squadron could be discussed, he said that such information is technical issues that can only be explained after discussions on costs and other data, but Romania is interested in the F-35.

Launched in the early 1990s, the F-35 is the most expensive of US military weapons programs with a total estimated cost of nearly $ 400 billion for the Pentagon, with a target of nearly 2,500 units to be produced in the coming decades.

Its supporters praise its stealth technology, which allows it to pass undetected radar, supersonic speed, agility and sensors that give the pilot unparalleled access to a wide range of information.

https://www.aviatiamagazin.com/aviatie- ... oane-f-35/
Minister of Defense announces that Romania will buy F-35s
Lancer 3 Jul 2019
Defense Minister Gabriel Les announced that Romania is interested in V-F-35 Lightning II, and in less than a decade will try to acquire them.

The Romanian official said the F-35 is included in the Air Force endowment program and says the cost difference between a new Lightning II and a new F-16, the latest generation, is very low.

"We want this capability and we are caught in this program. However, the F-35s, as a price, within an arming program are close to the F16's new price, "Gabriel Leş told The Truth .

According to sources, the acquisition of the F-35 is considered starting in 2028, but it is not known whether there is any analysis of the number of devices and the overall cost of such a contract.

Until the F's 35, Gabriel Les announces for the second consecutive year that Romania will buy another five F-16 AM / BM fighters at the second hand to complete Squadron 53.

https://adevarul.ro/news/eveniment/surs ... index.html
The Ministry of Defense supplies the F-35 Air Force
July 3, 2019, 12:50
The National Defense Ministry decided on Wednesday to enter the state-of-the-art F-35 aircraft hunting airplane program. The Minister of Defense confirmed that Romania wants this capability and is caught in this program.
UPDATE
Minister of Defense Gabriel Leş confirmed the interest of the Ministry of Defense for the acquisition of the most modern combat plane in the world. "We want this capability and we are caught up in this program. However, the F-35s, as a price, within an arming program are close to the price of the new F16 planes," said Gabriel Leş. In addition, Defense Minister Gabriel Leş announced that another five F16 planes will be bought, which are in the same configuration as the 12 already acquired so that there will eventually be an operational operational capability for this squadron.

"The MApN has decided to enter the F-35 airplane delivery program," said the MApN sources for "Adevărul". "From 2028 we will begin to equip the Air Force with these hunting avions. "Said the cited sources. In April, vice-admiral Mathias Winter, head of the Pentagon's F-35 office, told a Camra Representative's commission that "future potential customers in the field of military sales abroad include Singapore, Greece, Romania, Spain and Poland." Last year, Belgium announced that it chose the F-35 to the detriment of Eurofighter Typhoon to renew its F-16 fleet, a 4 billion-dollar business ($ 4.55 billion). The price of an F-35 starts at $ 100 million. The US group also offers offset: suppliers of parts from these countries will produce not only the devices that will be delivered to the national armed forces but for the whole F-35 program. In addition to the US headquarters, Lockheed Martin has set up F-35s in Italy, Turkey and Japan. Other US allies seeking to acquire the invisible F-35 aircraft are Finland, Switzerland and the Saudi Arabia.
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Unread post04 Jul 2019, 14:30

I would think that by 2028 (hell, right now) a new F-35 would cost as much as a new build F-16 - possibly less. I can see the Poles def going for it, the Romanians too. Greece, tough to say. They're going to need something to answer to whatever Turkey ends up flying, and the F-35 will be the cheapest/best option.

Singapore will order too, just a matter of how many of each. Great time to hold LM stock, or I imagine be working there...
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Unread post29 Aug 2019, 23:33

How Poland plans to land an F-35 deal and ‘Fort Trump’
29 Aug 2019 Jaroslaw Adamowski

"WARSAW, Poland — By 2026, the Polish Ministry of Defence plans to allocate about 185 billion zloty (U.S. $47 billion) toward acquiring new weapons and military equipment, with fifth-generation fighter jets a top priority....

...Warsaw’s potential acquisition of fifth-gen fighters is one of the top modernization projects in the pipeline. In May, Polish Defense Minister Mariusz Blaszczak said the ministry sent a letter of request to the U.S. regarding Warsaw’s plan to acquire 32 F-35A aircraft....

...Negotiations for the jets are taking place as Warsaw is seeking a permanent U.S. military presence in Poland, dubbed “Fort Trump.” Warsaw offered to allocate at least $2 billion toward the project under which the U.S. would build a military base in the country. On June 12, Polish President Andrzej Duda met with U.S. President Donald Trump in Washington to discuss the initiative and ink a joint declaration on defense cooperation regarding U.S. force posture in Poland....

...Trump is scheduled to visit Poland from Aug. 31-Sept. 1. The topics of a stronger U.S. troop presence in the country, as well as a potential F-35 sale, are expected to come up. But F-35 acquisition negotiations will likely be separate from Fort Trump discussions, as the logistics and technical aspects of a troop deployment deal are nearing a conclusion, according to Tomasz Smura, the director of the research office at the Warsaw-based Casimir Pulaski Foundation.

“If Poland decides to buy the F-35, this will open an array of new possibilities before the Polish Air Force in the upcoming decades. This aircraft offers stealth and interoperability capacities that are currently not available to the Polish military,” Smura told Defense News. “However, there are also some critical voices on this potential purchase. Some analysts doubt whether we should introduce a second type of fighter instead of expanding Poland’s fleet of 48 F-16s. This number of modern fighter jets doesn’t match Poland’s military needs and the country’s size. Other analysts add that we’re simply not ready to fully use the capacities offered by the F-35, and that further F-16s would suffice to match the current state of development of the air forces of our eastern neighbors.”

Despite the country’s rising defense expenditure, some observers also doubt Poland’s capacity to finance the F-35 acquisition alongside other ambitious military procurements, such as the Wisla air defense program...."

Source: https://www.defensenews.com/digital-sho ... ort-trump/
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Unread post30 Aug 2019, 04:30

spazsinbad wrote:
“However, there are also some critical voices on this potential purchase. Some analysts doubt whether we should introduce a second type of fighter instead of expanding Poland’s fleet of 48 F-16s. This number of modern fighter jets doesn’t match Poland’s military needs and the country’s size. Other analysts add that we’re simply not ready to fully use the capacities offered by the F-35, and that further F-16s would suffice to match the current state of development of the air forces of our eastern neighbors.”
Source: https://www.defensenews.com/digital-sho ... ort-trump/


"Current" state of development? The aircraft could serve for the next ~40 years once delivered!

Wouldn't give 2-cents for those 'analysts'.
Accel + Alt + VLO + DAS + MDF + Radial Distance = LIFE . . . Always choose Stealth
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Unread post30 Aug 2019, 11:17

On the other hand it's very reasonable to admit that F-35 requires heavy investment into C&C, comms, analysis capability or some potential is squandered. But it would still be the best even at "F-16 infrastructure levels".
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Unread post30 Aug 2019, 12:38

magitsu wrote:On the other hand it's very reasonable to admit that F-35 requires heavy investment into C&C, comms, analysis capability or some potential is squandered. But it would still be the best even at "F-16 infrastructure levels".


By the time they order, build, train and deliver, then reach IOC and FOC they have most of a decade too upgrade their systems.
Accel + Alt + VLO + DAS + MDF + Radial Distance = LIFE . . . Always choose Stealth
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Unread post31 Aug 2019, 14:41

mixelflick wrote:I would think that by 2028 (hell, right now) a new F-35 would cost as much as a new build F-16 - possibly less. I can see the Poles def going for it, the Romanians too. Greece, tough to say. They're going to need something to answer to whatever Turkey ends up flying, and the F-35 will be the cheapest/best option.

Singapore will order too, just a matter of how many of each. Great time to hold LM stock, or I imagine be working there...


I bought it at $88/share, my biggest winner by far. Not only that, they pay a dividend! I'm dripping in a Roth, so thank God
LM keeps racking up sales...
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Unread post03 Sep 2019, 06:03

F-35: The Right Choice for Poland

(Source: Lockheed Martin; issued Aug 30, 2019)


The F-35A is the best value solution for replacing Poland’s existing MiG-29 and Su-22 jets in the Polish fleet, and is available today to meet the needs of the Polish Air Force now and into the future.

Lockheed Martin is a trusted partner for Poland, for Europe and NATO and we’re invested in supporting the long-term strategic priorities of the Polish Ministry of Defense. In addition to providing Poland with a mature, 5th Generation weapon system, acquisition of the F-35 will bring supply chain and technology transfer opportunities to Poland.

The F-35 will reinforce Poland’s defense leadership in Central Europe and ensure the Polish Air Force’s offensive and defensive capabilities continue to outpace advancing threats.

With unparalleled stealth, advanced sensors, supersonic speed, weapons capacity and increased range, the F-35 is the most advanced, survivable and connected fighter jet ever built.

With advanced threats in close proximity, Poland’s defense and security requires a low observable stealth aircraft to ensure survivability and mission effectiveness. The F-35’s unique mix of stealth and sensor technology can enable the Polish Air Force to covertly patrol, monitor and conduct surveillance without being detected.

The F-35 has an operational mission radius greater than 700 nautical miles in low observable configurations and internal fuel capacity of nearly 19,000 pounds. When the mission doesn't require low observability, the F-35 can carry more than 18,000 pounds of ordnance.

Additionally, Poland will benefit from a planned modernization program that will be funded by the full F-35 enterprise and will continue to enhance the aircraft’s weapons capacity, electronic warfare suite, sensor capability and more.

The F-35 is the European aircraft of choice for replacing heritage fleets and offers unmatched interoperability with NATO and other allied assets while ensuring the Polish Air Force’s role as a fully interoperable, integrated member of NATO and coalition operations.

The advanced sensors of the F-35 will enhance situational awareness for the entire Polish Armed Forces and strengthen Poland’s capability to fulfill their NATO Baltic air policing mission.

The current Polish F-16 pilots will benefit from having the F-35 join the Polish Air Force fleet and those who transition will benefit from common training, equipment and tactics with other NATO countries. There is also increased opportunity for joint training exercises, which we have seen demonstrated at Red Flag, Trident Juncture and more.

The F-35 will deliver a key discriminator for Poland and its Allies for decades to come.

At less than $80 million USD, the F-35 truly is a 5th Generation aircraft at equal to or less than the price of legacy 4th Generation aircraft. With smart acquisition strategies, strong government-industry partnership and a relentless focus on cost reduction, the F-35 enterprise successfully reduced procurement costs.

Polish industrial opportunities fall into two main categories: Direct Supply Chain and Technology Transfer.

F-35 Supply Chain opportunities to support:
-- F-35 Production of more than 3,000 aircraft
-- Fleet-wide F-35 sustainment for more than 30 years
-- Modernization of in-country manufacturing expertise through participation in the most advanced 5thGen Fighter

Technology Transfer opportunities associated with:
-- Sustainment of Polish F-35, F-16, and C-130s
-- Enhancing training of pilot and maintenance personnel
-- Advancement of Space Technologies
-- Cooperation in Research & Development
-- Advancement of UAS and drone technologies

Final details on Polish industry’s involvement in the F-35 program and other associated benefits will be disclosed as we move through the acquisition process. On the F-35 program, companies are evaluated on a best-value basis and Polish industry will be given opportunities to participate in the production and sustainment of the F-35.

http://www.defense-aerospace.com/articl ... 80%99.html
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Unread post03 Sep 2019, 16:24

Lockheed makes its pitch to Polish industry in exchange for F-35 deal
03 Sep 2019 Jaroslaw Adamowski

"KIELCE, Poland — American defense company Lockheed Martin is vying for a contract to supply 32 F-35 fighter jets to Poland by offering to deliver new-generation Block 4 versions and ensuring that selected components for the jets are produced by Polish manufacturers.

“If Poland decides to buy the F-35, it will receive Block 4 aircraft. This version will include a new computer, additional weapons and systems, and it will be able to be fitted with six missiles instead of four,” Greg Ulmer, the vice president and general manager responsible for the F-35 program at Lockheed Martin, told Defense News at the MSPO defense industry show. The company official said Polish defense industry players are already part of the aircraft’s global supply chain, and deliver components for F-35s.

“So far, we’ve delivered 425 F-35s, and we’re on track to deliver 131 this year. In 2018, we delivered 91 fighters; and in 2017, 66 fighters. The peak in deliveries is expected to come in 2024,” Ulmer said. “By 2030, we expect there will be 500 F-35s in Europe. Once Polish companies are approved as our supplier partners, they could make parts not only for the Polish aircraft, but also for those supplied to other countries, such as the U.S. or Japan.”..."

Source: https://www.defensenews.com/industry/20 ... f-35-deal/
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Unread post04 Sep 2019, 02:24

It will be so funny to watch Poland get their F-35s before Canada :)
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Unread post04 Sep 2019, 19:44

https://www.flightglobal.com/news/artic ... nd-460644/

I find this part interesting...
While only small parts of the F-35, such as landing gear, ammunition and F135 engine components are currently being produced in Poland, Ulmer says there is room to expand Polish industrial involvement.

"We are constantly looking for supply chain and there are some opportunities for new partners with cheaper costs and better quality [of products]," he says. "Technology transfer opportunities are associated with sustainment of Polish air force F-16s, F-35s and C-130s, enhancing training of pilots and maintainers, advancement in space technologies, co-operation in research and development and advancement in UAS [unmanned air systems] technology


Could this mean that Poland could potentially be a contributor/partner is the JSF Program, essentially replacing Turkey?
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