F-35 UAE 2017

Program progress, politics, orders, and speculation
  • Author
  • Message
Offline
User avatar

neptune

Elite 2K

Elite 2K

  • Posts: 2896
  • Joined: 24 Oct 2008, 00:03
  • Location: Houston

Unread post06 Nov 2017, 23:00

https://www.defensenews.com/digital-sho ... f-35-jets/

Trump could let the UAE buy F-35 jets

By: Barbara Opall-Rome

WASHINGTON ―
As part of a larger U.S. strategy for enhanced strategic cooperation with the United Arab Emirates, the Trump administration has agreed to consider a long-standing request by Abu Dhabi to enter into preliminary talks on future procurement of the F-35 joint strike fighter. While no decision has been made, the willingness to consider extending a classified briefing to the UAE as the first significant step toward acquisition of the fifth-generation stealth fighter signals a departure from policy enforced under former President Barack Obama. The Obama administration had consistently rebuffed Emirati requests for the briefing dating back to 2011, citing Washington’s commitment to preserve Israel’s so-called Qualitative Military Edge, or QME. In interviews, Gulf experts and industry executives insist the Trump administration fully intends to uphold congressionally mandated commitments to the QME, which aim to provide Israel the weaponry and assistance it needs to unilaterally defend itself against any combination of regional foes. At the same time, Washington wants to build on an expanded U.S.-UAE Defense Cooperation Agreement unveiled in May during Crown Prince and Deputy Supreme Commander Mohammed bin Zayed Al Nahyan’s meetings with Trump and Defense Secretary Jim Mattis in the U.S. capital. “The Trump team has agreed to consider the request. It’s not a ‘yes’ yet, but I’m pretty sure it’s going to happen once the dust settles,” a former Pentagon official told Defense News. He was referring to the ongoing dispute between the UAE, Saudi Arabia and Bahrain with Qatar ― a rift the administration needs to amend before it can effectively implement Trump’s new strategy for countering nuclear and non-nuclear threats from Iran. Experts cite a convergence of events that support extending preliminary F-35 program access to the UAE, the only Arab country to have participated in six U.S.-led coalition missions since the 1991 Gulf War and which hosts thousands of Americans deployed with the U.S. Air Force’s 380th Air Expeditionary Wing. Firstly, unlike Saudi Arabia, which is some 20 kilometers from Israel’s Red Sea town of Eilat, the UAE does not share a maritime or land border with Israel. And unlike Saudi Arabia or other Gulf Cooperation Council states, the UAE Air Force has openly participated with the Israeli Air Force in international exercises, the latest in March in Greece with the Italian and Hellenic air forces and in annual U.S. Air Force Red Flag drills in Nevada. Considering the common threat from Iran, and the time it would take for Abu Dhabi to negotiate a contract with Washington, let alone begin to take first deliveries, sources note that Israel will have enjoyed more than a decade of exclusivity as the only Air Force in the region to operate the F-35.

Israel’s Ministry of Defense declined public comment on the potential easing of F-35 restrictions for Abu Dhabi, citing sensitivities. Privately, however, sources said Israel is unlikely to object if initial steps are limited only to the UAE, and will not trigger wider approval for other GCC states. “The two countries are not allies; not even friends. But under currently conceivable scenarios, if anyone thinks that the UAE will use this airplane to attack Israel, he or she is not living in reality,” said Shoshana Bryen, senior director at the Washington-based Jewish Policy Center. Danny Sebright, president of the U.S.-U.A.E. Business Council, said Abu Dhabi has been frustrated by U.S. policy governing technology transfer to the region. “The way our policy works now is Israel versus all other Arab countries. But they have no negative intentions toward the Israelis and don’t see themselves going to war with them. And as such, they don’t want decisions being held up based on how other Arab countries may affect Israel’s QME.”

In a recent interview, Sebright said Washington should consider UAE’s requests based on the merits of its long-standing partnership with the U.S. and its contribution to regional stability. He said the new 15-year Defense Cooperation Agreement is meant to be an indefinite umbrella agreement that should ultimately cover the F-35 and other front-line American weaponry as well as joint research and development, more special operations cooperation, and other bilateral initiatives. In a 13-page report published by the U.S.-U.A.E. Business Council last month, Sebright listed a broad spectrum of areas ― from counterterrorism to Afghanistan reconstruction efforts ― in which Abu Dhabi has materially contributed to U.S. security and its interests in and far beyond the Arabian Gulf. He noted that the UAE is one of the largest customers of the U.S. Foreign Military Sales program and ranks among the top 15 defense spenders in the world. “U.S.-UAE basing agreements, joint training and weapons sales are not merely for show. ... The UAE has become not just a consumer of security, but also a provider of security in the Gulf region and the wider Middle East,” Sebright said. Nevertheless, he warned that U.S. restrictions may force Abu Dhabi to turning to non-Western countries for major military systems. Earlier this year, the UAE and Russia signed a letter of intent to jointly develop a fifth-generation fighter based on the MiG-29, while Moscow announced UAE interest in potential procurement of the Sukhoi Su-35. “Whether or not this transpires can be viewed as a reflection of the UAE’s frustration with the US acquisition process,” Sebright wrote. He said Abu Dhabi’s unmet F-35 request “is not an isolated case.” He cited the UAE’s purchase of Chinese UAVs as a supplement to a U.S. acquisition of unarmed Predator drones, the catalyst being Washington’s refusal to approve strike-capable systems. “The UAE is not only a consumer of US security, but a provider for US security. ... While they may be willing to consider non-Western suppliers, it is important to emphasize that it continues to demonstrate a strong preference for US [weaponry] … which comes with US training and support and further reinforces the bilateral defense and security relationship that is so important” to both countries, the report concludes. Simon Henderson, director of the Washington Institute’s Gulf and Energy Policy Program, suggested that Saudi Arabia could dispel concerns regarding its intentions toward Israel by publicly participating in U.S.-led exercises aimed at regional defense. “The US would consider selling F-35s to the Saudis if the Saudis were not a threat to Israel. And an indication they are not a threat to Israel would be for Saudi Arabia and Israel to take part in the same third-party air exercises,” Henderson said.
:)
Offline

nutshell

Senior member

Senior member

  • Posts: 484
  • Joined: 04 May 2016, 13:37

Unread post07 Nov 2017, 01:02

The Sheiks going to play pokemon with every military jet available in the market.

Gotta buy'em all!

Jokes aside; should we really trust any arab country?
Offline
User avatar

spazsinbad

Elite 5K

Elite 5K

  • Posts: 24623
  • Joined: 05 May 2009, 21:31
  • Location: ɐıןɐɹʇsn∀¯\_(ツ)_/¯
  • Warnings: -2

Unread post07 Nov 2017, 01:10

Same post earlier by 'zerion' - beats me why there has to be two of everything:

viewtopic.php?f=58&t=27006&p=380261&hilit=Emirates#p380261
A4G Skyhawk: www.faaaa.asn.au/spazsinbad-a4g/ & www.youtube.com/channel/UCwqC_s6gcCVvG7NOge3qfAQ/videos?view_as=subscriber
Offline

Corsair1963

Elite 5K

Elite 5K

  • Posts: 6852
  • Joined: 19 Dec 2005, 04:14

Unread post07 Nov 2017, 04:05

Question here is if the US does sell F-35's to the UAE. Then how is it not going to sell them to the other Gulf States??? (i.e. Bahrain, Iraq, Kuwait, Oman, Qatar, and Saudi Arabia)


Yet, if it does refuse to sell the F-35 to any or all of the aforementioned. Will that in turn open the door to China to sell them the J-20 and/or J-31???
Offline
User avatar

zerion

Forum Veteran

Forum Veteran

  • Posts: 688
  • Joined: 25 Jan 2014, 01:47
  • Location: Everywhere like such as...

Unread post10 Nov 2017, 18:09

I guess the question is does the UAE deserve a dedicated thread at this point? Maybe, things are looking like they will get some F-35s, but should we just keep all gulf states info to one thread?

US Air Force official confirms rumors of F-35 talks with UAE
https://www.defensenews.com/digital-sho ... -with-uae/

Corsair1963 wrote:Question here is if the US does sell F-35's to the UAE. Then how is it not going to sell them to the other Gulf States??? (i.e. Bahrain, Iraq, Kuwait, Oman, Qatar, and Saudi Arabia)


Carrots. For instance basic human rights need to be recognized and you can't be funding terrorism.
Offline
User avatar

neptune

Elite 2K

Elite 2K

  • Posts: 2896
  • Joined: 24 Oct 2008, 00:03
  • Location: Houston

Unread post10 Nov 2017, 20:07

zerion wrote:I guess the question is does the UAE deserve a dedicated thread at this point? Maybe, things are looking like they will get some F-35s, but should we just keep all gulf states info to one thread?

US Air Force official confirms rumors of F-35 talks with UAE
https://www.defensenews.com/digital-sho ... -with-uae/

Corsair1963 wrote:Question here is if the US does sell F-35's to the UAE. Then how is it not going to sell them to the other Gulf States??? (i.e. Bahrain, Iraq, Kuwait, Oman, Qatar, and Saudi Arabia)


Carrots. For instance basic human rights need to be recognized and you can't be funding terrorism.
i

....lol, if there is no activity, it will sink to the level of whale execrement! Gulf away to your hearts content!
:)
Offline
User avatar

neptune

Elite 2K

Elite 2K

  • Posts: 2896
  • Joined: 24 Oct 2008, 00:03
  • Location: Houston

Unread post10 Nov 2017, 20:09

zerion wrote:I guess the question is does the UAE deserve a dedicated thread at this point? Maybe, things are looking like they will get some F-35s, but should we just keep all gulf states info to one thread?

US Air Force official confirms rumors of F-35 talks with UAE
https://www.defensenews.com/digital-sho ... -with-uae/

Corsair1963 wrote:Question here is if the US does sell F-35's to the UAE. Then how is it not going to sell them to the other Gulf States??? (i.e. Bahrain, Iraq, Kuwait, Oman, Qatar, and Saudi Arabia)


Carrots. For instance basic human rights need to be recognized and you can't be funding terrorism.
i

....lol, if there is no activity, it will sink to the level of whale execrement! Gulf away to your hearts content!
:)
Offline
User avatar

neptune

Elite 2K

Elite 2K

  • Posts: 2896
  • Joined: 24 Oct 2008, 00:03
  • Location: Houston

Unread post10 Nov 2017, 22:03

https://www.defensenews.com/digital-sho ... -with-uae/

US Air Force official confirms rumors of F-35 talks with UAE

By: Valerie Insinna

DUBAI — The U.S. Defense Department has begun talks with the United Arab Emirates about a potential sale of F-35 joint strike fighters, the U.S. Air Force’s number-two general said Friday. The statements, made by Air Force Vice Chief of Staff Stephen Wilson during a roundtable with reporters ahead of Dubai Airshow, confirm an earlier report by Defense News. The story cited sources close to the talks that claimed President Donald Trump’s administration was considering delivering a classified briefing on the jet’s capabilities to UAE officials. “Specifically with the F-35, you look at all of our partner nations now and as we look at their requirements. Here in the Gulf, they share many of the same adversaries and many of the same challenges, so discussions are ongoing now with the administration on partner nations that may require them,” Wilson said, adding later that UAE is one of the countries currently discussing the matter with the United States. “Any time you go through that, there’s a process to do that, so they’ve started the process. And with that, any discussions bilaterally between nations is held close. So further things on that will have to come from the UAE,” he continued. Wilson would not confirm when a classified briefing could occur, saying “that is part of the discussions and the process going forward.” If a deal moves through, the UAE would become the first Gulf nation to acquire the F-35, which is manufactured by Lockheed Martin. However, it could potentially face several barriers that may dash hopes of a sale. First and foremost is potential objections from Israel over a perceived erosion of its qualitative military edge.

However, sources had told Defense News that Israel is unlikely to raise alarms over a deal with the UAE, unless the United States also decides to start up negotiations with other Gulf countries. Others argued that it may take a decade to work out a contract with the UAE and for Lockheed to deliver its first F-35 — more than enough time for the United States to meet its commitments to preserve Israel’s military edge in the Middle East. Wilson acknowledged that the United States will have to work with U.S. partners to ensure a sale to UAE doesn’t raise security concerns. “That’s part of all the things we’re going to look at going forward,” he told reporters.

Another potential roadblock could be the UAE’s dealings with Russia. At IDEX earlier this year, Russia and the UAE signed a memorandum of understanding to co-develop a fifth generation fighter, which would be produced by Russian defense industry heavyweight Rostec and based on the MiG-29 fighter aircraft. Asked whether that partnership could deter the United States from allowing a foreign military sale of the F-35 to the UAE, Wilson declined to comment.
:)

....nothing floats forever!
:wink:
Offline
User avatar

spazsinbad

Elite 5K

Elite 5K

  • Posts: 24623
  • Joined: 05 May 2009, 21:31
  • Location: ɐıןɐɹʇsn∀¯\_(ツ)_/¯
  • Warnings: -2

Unread post05 Jul 2018, 05:19

EXCLUSIVE: Israel hosted UAE military delegation to review F-35s, sources say
04 Jul 2018 i24NEWS

"The Israeli Air Force recently hosted a military delegation from the United Arab Emirates to review operations of the advanced US-made F-35 fighter jets, i24NEWS has learned. An American delegation was also present at the time of the UAE visit, sources told i24NEWS. The extraordinary visit comes as the UAE seeks to purchase its own fleet of the advanced F-35 fighter jets, built by US defense giant Lockheed Martin, and amid reports of a burgeoning Israeli-Gulf alliance against Iran....

...Although the UAE and Israel do not have public relations, reports have hinted at longstanding clandestine ties based on a convergence of a multitude of interests – chief among them stemming mutual foe Iran's expanding influence in the region...."

Source: https://www.i24news.tv/en/news/israel/1 ... view-f-35s
A4G Skyhawk: www.faaaa.asn.au/spazsinbad-a4g/ & www.youtube.com/channel/UCwqC_s6gcCVvG7NOge3qfAQ/videos?view_as=subscriber
Offline

mixelflick

Elite 4K

Elite 4K

  • Posts: 4112
  • Joined: 20 Mar 2010, 10:26
  • Location: Parts Unknown

Unread post05 Jul 2018, 15:21

I love me some Trump, but I think he's being short sighted here. He wants to sell US wares, sure. But if Turkey is dicey how much more so would be arab states?

Let them buy SU-35's or wait in line for the SU-57 (if it ever materializes). I understand there are safeguards on some of the technology, but a single F-35 (and in particular, its engine) is going to be a windfall for Russia/China. In one fell swoop, they'll be neck and neck with us in engine technology.

Not cool, seeing how far ahead we are now..
Offline

nathan77

Enthusiast

Enthusiast

  • Posts: 65
  • Joined: 26 Mar 2015, 07:21

Unread post06 Jul 2018, 08:28

It depends if the UAE is trustworthy in regards to technology transfer. (i.e. more of a risk than Israel which has sold US tech to China in the past). Even with some leakage, it turns out 5th generation manufacturing is still really hard: China services the engines for most of the worlds airlines - and even with Russian engines to learn from they have struggled to build their own 5th generation power-plants.

From my perspective, where selling the F-35 to the UAE does make sense is from an economic perspective. The fewer the buyers for the SU-57, the fewer are manufactured. The fewer are manufactured and the higher the unit-price is and the fewer which Russia can afford to buy for their armed services. And the more F-35's are purchased, likewise the cheaper they become - and the more of them that can be bought by the US and its allies.
Offline
User avatar

zerion

Forum Veteran

Forum Veteran

  • Posts: 688
  • Joined: 25 Jan 2014, 01:47
  • Location: Everywhere like such as...

Unread post08 Jul 2018, 20:13

IDF DENIES UAE DELEGATION VISITED ISRAEL TO STUDY THE F-35

https://m.jpost.com/Israel-News/Israel- ... -35-561913
Offline

Corsair1963

Elite 5K

Elite 5K

  • Posts: 6852
  • Joined: 19 Dec 2005, 04:14

Unread post09 Jul 2018, 03:30

Hardly, surprising if true or not....... :shock:
Offline
User avatar

zerion

Forum Veteran

Forum Veteran

  • Posts: 688
  • Joined: 25 Jan 2014, 01:47
  • Location: Everywhere like such as...

Unread post21 Aug 2020, 01:08

Bibi Said Yes To F-35 Sale To UAE, Eye On Normalized Relations

TEL AVIV: In a dizzying display of the endless complexities of the Middle East, Israeli Prime Minister Bibi Netanyahu approved President Trump’s sale of F-35s to the UAE in return for the emirates opening diplomatic relations with Israel

"Bibi used his open line to the White House to give the OK for this deal," an Israeli source told Breaking D. He did not disclose the F-35 OK to anyone, including Benny Ganz, Israel's defense minister and alternative prime minister...

https://breakingdefense.com/2020/08/bib ... relations/
Offline
User avatar

spazsinbad

Elite 5K

Elite 5K

  • Posts: 24623
  • Joined: 05 May 2009, 21:31
  • Location: ɐıןɐɹʇsn∀¯\_(ツ)_/¯
  • Warnings: -2

Unread post21 Aug 2020, 02:04

spazsinbad wrote:Same post earlier by 'zerion' - beats me why there has to be two of everything:
viewtopic.php?f=58&t=27006&p=380261&hilit=Emirates#p380261

I'm beaten again: viewtopic.php?f=22&t=57267&p=443382#p443382
A4G Skyhawk: www.faaaa.asn.au/spazsinbad-a4g/ & www.youtube.com/channel/UCwqC_s6gcCVvG7NOge3qfAQ/videos?view_as=subscriber
Next

Return to Program and politics

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Google Adsense [Bot] and 10 guests