Pressure increases on [Canada] to stay or leave F-35 program

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wolfpak

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Unread post05 Sep 2019, 16:02

Grant it that L-M no-biding is improbable but they do have justification in Canada's demands for large offsets. If I were L-M and both Saab and Boeing no-bid the contract I'd add 15% to the bid just because I could. Sometimes you need to "educate" your customer. In the private sector this happens although the cost of ill will in a situation like this would probably prevent it.
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ricnunes

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Unread post05 Sep 2019, 16:09

wolfpak wrote:Grant it that L-M no-biding is improbable but they do have justification in Canada's demands for large offsets. If I were L-M and both Saab and Boeing no-bid the contract I'd add 15% to the bid just because I could. Sometimes you need to "educate" your customer. In the private sector this happens although the cost of ill will in a situation like this would probably prevent it.


The thing is that Canada already "shrank"/reduced its demands for "large offsets".
Actually this is one of the reasons/excuses that the Eurofighter consortium gave in order to justify leaving the Canadian competition.
Offset are only 20% of the overall score in the Canadian competition. The other factors/score are 60% for capability which is not only based on air patrolling over Canada but also emphasis on coalition air-to-ground strikes abroad (which the F-35 should win hands down and by far) and 20% for cost (which the F-35 should also win).
A 4th/4.5th gen fighter aircraft stands about as much chance against a F-35 as a guns-only Sabre has against a Viper.
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armedupdate

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Unread post12 Sep 2019, 23:52

Can I see the requirements PDF?
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ricnunes

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Unread post13 Sep 2019, 21:24

The Canadian Future Fighter Capability Project - Request for Proposals (RFP) has been released on the 23rd of July of this year and below there's an official Canadian government webpage stating the requirements and associated points/score regarding the fighter competition:

https://www.canada.ca/en/public-service ... ition.html

In the link above, you can read the following:
All bidders will be subject to the same evaluation criteria, and proposals will be rigorously assessed on elements of technical merit (60%), cost (20%) and economic benefits (20%).
A 4th/4.5th gen fighter aircraft stands about as much chance against a F-35 as a guns-only Sabre has against a Viper.
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Corsair1963

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Unread post16 Sep 2019, 00:35

ricnunes wrote:

All bidders will be subject to the same evaluation criteria, and proposals will be rigorously assessed on elements of technical merit (60%), cost (20%) and economic benefits (20%).
[/quote]


Sounds very favorable for the F-35.... :wink:
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ricnunes

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Unread post16 Sep 2019, 10:47

Corsair1963 wrote:Sounds very favorable for the F-35.... :wink:


Absolutely!
Hence why the Europeans are "abandoning the ship" (Canadian fighter competition) "like rats" :wink:

And as such, I'll continue to eagerly wait for Saab for follow the other European companies and also abandon the Canadian competition.
A 4th/4.5th gen fighter aircraft stands about as much chance against a F-35 as a guns-only Sabre has against a Viper.
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pushoksti

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Unread post16 Sep 2019, 19:03

ricnunes wrote:
And as such, I'll continue to eagerly wait for Saab for follow the other European companies and also abandon the Canadian competition.


It will be a glorious day when all the Canadian SAAB nut swingers cry out in terror and suddenly silenced.
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XanderCrews

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Unread post16 Sep 2019, 20:23

pushoksti wrote:
ricnunes wrote:
And as such, I'll continue to eagerly wait for Saab for follow the other European companies and also abandon the Canadian competition.


It will be a glorious day when all the Canadian SAAB nut swingers cry out in terror and suddenly silenced.


theyre getting pretty testy as it is i can see. Downright nasty at BF4C.

Someone posted this there:

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XanderCrews

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Unread post16 Sep 2019, 20:28

Clearly defined combat missions based on those currently flown by the CF-18.
Mission profiles that demand capabilities far beyond what the CF-18 can perform should be discarded. As outlined above, the Gripen can replace the CF18 on virtually all missions.



:lmao: :lmao: :lmao: :lmao: :lmao: :lmao: :lmao:

Anything better than CF-18 is bad. Gripen isn't so it should win?? :|

https://prism.ucalgary.ca/bitstream/han ... sAllowed=y
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ricnunes

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Unread post16 Sep 2019, 20:29

pushoksti wrote:
ricnunes wrote:
And as such, I'll continue to eagerly wait for Saab for follow the other European companies and also abandon the Canadian competition.


It will be a glorious day when all the Canadian SAAB nut swingers cry out in terror and suddenly silenced.


Yes, it will! :mrgreen:
A 4th/4.5th gen fighter aircraft stands about as much chance against a F-35 as a guns-only Sabre has against a Viper.
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XanderCrews

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Unread post16 Sep 2019, 20:33

ricnunes wrote:
pushoksti wrote:
ricnunes wrote:
And as such, I'll continue to eagerly wait for Saab for follow the other European companies and also abandon the Canadian competition.


It will be a glorious day when all the Canadian SAAB nut swingers cry out in terror and suddenly silenced.


Yes, it will! :mrgreen:



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ricnunes

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Unread post16 Sep 2019, 20:39

XanderCrews wrote:
Clearly defined combat missions based on those currently flown by the CF-18.
Mission profiles that demand capabilities far beyond what the CF-18 can perform should be discarded. As outlined above, the Gripen can replace the CF18 on virtually all missions.



:lmao: :lmao: :lmao: :lmao: :lmao: :lmao: :lmao:

Anything better than CF-18 is bad. Gripen isn't so it should win?? :|

https://prism.ucalgary.ca/bitstream/han ... sAllowed=y


LOL, so pathetic! :doh:

The fact is if the CF-18 was to be equipped with the same electronics/sensors - and technically it could since it's a bigger plane than the Gripen E - the CF-18 would be a better and more capable fighter aircraft than the Gripen E.
And also because the CF-18 is bigger it could technically be equipped with better electronics/sensors compared to the Gripen E which would make the CF-18 a much better fighter aircraft.

The fact that for someone like Brazil who operates and which current fighter aircraft is the F-5 Tiger II, moving to the Gripen E will seem like moving forwards.
But for a country like Canada which operates legacy F/A-18 Hornets (a.k.a. in Canada as the CF-18) to suddenly replace those CF-18 by the Gripen E would be going several steps back!
A 4th/4.5th gen fighter aircraft stands about as much chance against a F-35 as a guns-only Sabre has against a Viper.
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XanderCrews

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Unread post16 Sep 2019, 21:42

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spazsinbad

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Unread post16 Sep 2019, 22:32

:shock: :devil: Heheh. WALKING THE PLANK takes on NEW Meaning for da Gripen (do they do KEEL HAULS?). :roll: :shock:
RAN FAA A4G Skyhawk 1970s: https://www.faaaa.asn.au/spazsinbad-a4g/ AND https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCwqC_s6gcCVvG7NOge3qfAQ/
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XanderCrews

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Unread post16 Sep 2019, 23:20

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