Pressure increases on [Canada] to stay or leave F-35 program

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ricnunes

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Unread post14 Jan 2019, 20:50

hb_pencil wrote:If you can't figure out its relevance, then I don't know what to say. I've left enough bread crumbs here for you to figure it out, and I'm not going to spell it out any further.


Perhaps, you should enlighten me then...

hb_pencil wrote:I think enough people on here can attest to the fact that I have brought unique knowledge and perspective to this discussion for the past seven years. Insulting me isn't your smartest move.


Really?? Where did I insult you??

And by the way, where did I say that you didn't bring knowledge here in the past? However you seem you point out the F-35 won't get to compete in Canada while everything points out that it will.
You still haven't provide any evidence or IMO a logical line of reasoning to why you hint that the F-35 maybe won't compete in Canada (when again everything points otherwise).
Resuming your post/comment/argument have been "evasive" or "illusive" at best (IMO, this is the closest to being an "insult" here but here I digress) .

So again, please indulge me...
“Active stealth” is what the ignorant nay sayers call ECM and pretend like it’s new.
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XanderCrews

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Unread post14 Jan 2019, 21:41

hb_pencil wrote:
Just you wait. This government is really that inept.



No surprise
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ricnunes

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Unread post14 Jan 2019, 23:08

XanderCrews wrote:
hb_pencil wrote:
Just you wait. This government is really that inept.



No surprise


Yes, no argue there. That's a FACT!

But saying that the F-35 won't be able or allowed to compete is too far fetched (IMO, of course and for what's worth).
“Active stealth” is what the ignorant nay sayers call ECM and pretend like it’s new.
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optimist

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Unread post15 Jan 2019, 03:28

Out of curiosity. I searched 'exclude' the f-35, in this topic. It came out that page 55 back in 2015 was it's first use. Not much has changed.
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spazsinbad

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Unread post15 Jan 2019, 04:09

Page 14 this thread JSF* got a guernsey from XANDERCREWS in 2014 but I'm not certain about why I found this.

viewtopic.php?f=58&t=24027&p=269378&hilit=JSF%2A#p269378

Then there is 2013 JOINT STRIKE FIGHTER phrase found in the first post of this thread (page 1) & I'm still clueless why.

viewtopic.php?f=58&t=24027&p=252665&hilit=Joint+Strike+Fighter#p252665

This is the page 55 EXCLUDE use BTW: viewtopic.php?f=58&t=24027&p=303201&hilit=exclude#p303201
A4G Skyhawk: www.faaaa.asn.au/spazsinbad-a4g/ & www.youtube.com/channel/UCwqC_s6gcCVvG7NOge3qfAQ/videos?view_as=subscriber
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ricnunes

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Unread post15 Jan 2019, 11:43

lipovitand wrote:What is the chance for Gripen? :mrgreen: Somebody wrote about it on BF4C for their paper. I really hope the govt is smart enough not to get it.


I would say next to zero :mrgreen:

During the last government and before that government decided to sole source the F-35 (which was later reversed) there was a consultation which involved the same companies and aircraft (LM/F-35, Boeing/Super Hornet, Dassault/Rafale, Airbus/Typhoon, Saab/Gripen) and at that time Saab removed itself from that same "consultation".
I believe it's a matter of time for Saab doing the same as Dassault - removing itself from the Canadian competition.

What I really, really struggle to understand is how a (ridiculous) site such as BF4C is able to get some major attention over the web, namely here in a serious site which is F-16.net :?
“Active stealth” is what the ignorant nay sayers call ECM and pretend like it’s new.
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Unread post15 Jan 2019, 13:53

Canada's government is less inept than people want to believe.

China has been counter-culturating the West since way before the Boxer Rebellion. The influence is presently at a peak. The West likes to believe in its cultural superiority and has itself waned only out of interior discord.

When the natural tide swings back Canada will reassert its natural order and get fully behind the F-35A. Sooner than many believe.
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ricnunes

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Unread post15 Jan 2019, 22:09

lipovitand wrote:Ohhh man, you ever been to their FB group? holy smokes man, its almost full of people who bought the Gripen. Its funny posting stuff about F35 and get some insane reactions lol


NO, I haven't and I don't intend to because if I do then in the day when I'll arrive at the "gates of death" I know that I will look in hindsight and regret each and every second of my life that I wasted in watching and reading what was vomited in such site :wink:
“Active stealth” is what the ignorant nay sayers call ECM and pretend like it’s new.
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ricnunes

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Unread post16 Jan 2019, 00:09

lipovitand wrote:Lucky you. I fell into the trap. I thought it was going to be meaningful discussion, but instead its just sunshine and unicorn (Gripen). I lost soo many brain cell trying to persuade...never again.


Well, all I can say is that I feel sorry for you lost brain cells. But look at the bright side, there are studies that claim that the weakest brain cells are the ones that die sooner and that losing these weaker brain cells may indeed help to improve the overall performance of the brain. :mrgreen:
“Active stealth” is what the ignorant nay sayers call ECM and pretend like it’s new.
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popcorn

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Unread post26 Jan 2019, 13:14

https://www.theglobeandmail.com/politic ... mpetition/

Canada to keep paying for F-35 development as fighter-jet competition ramps up


In an interview with The Canadian Press, the Department of National Defence’s head of military procurement says there are no plans for Canada to quit as one of nine partner countries in the F-35 stealth fighter program until after the Trudeau government completes the competition to determine which fighter jet will replace Canada’s aging fleet of CF-18s.

“We’re committed to staying there (in the program) until we understand where the competition will bring us,” said Patrick Finn, assistant deputy minister of material at National Defence.
"When a fifth-generation fighter meets a fourth-generation fighter—the [latter] dies,”
CSAF Gen. Mark Welsh
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hythelday

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Unread post26 Jan 2019, 13:20

popcorn wrote:https://www.theglobeandmail.com/politics/article-canada-to-keep-paying-for-f-35-development-as-fighter-jet-competition/

Canada to keep paying for F-35 development as fighter-jet competition ramps up


In an interview with The Canadian Press, the Department of National Defence’s head of military procurement says there are no plans for Canada to quit as one of nine partner countries in the F-35 stealth fighter program until after the Trudeau government completes the competition to determine which fighter jet will replace Canada’s aging fleet of CF-18s.

“We’re committed to staying there (in the program) until we understand where the competition will bring us,” said Patrick Finn, assistant deputy minister of material at National Defence.


What a surprise... not.

So RCAF will get Block 4+ F-35s (which is good), at the expense of losing several years of 5th gen experience and a big middle finger to the force. Any financial gains from cheaper FRP F-35s will be negated by the expenses of stop-gap F/A-18 purchase. All in all, they could have done much worse.
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Unread post27 Jan 2019, 12:29

Sounds to me that they are slowly coming to the realization that the F-35 was what was needed all along. Only Trudeau stuck his foot in his mouth and painted himself into a corner. This is his way of exiting said corner, albeit too late and at the expense of the Royal Canadian Air Force, it's commanders, pilots and mission...
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hb_pencil

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Unread post27 Jan 2019, 19:57

I was wondering when someone would post this.

hythelday wrote:
popcorn wrote:https://www.theglobeandmail.com/politics/article-canada-to-keep-paying-for-f-35-development-as-fighter-jet-competition/

Canada to keep paying for F-35 development as fighter-jet competition ramps up


In an interview with The Canadian Press, the Department of National Defence’s head of military procurement says there are no plans for Canada to quit as one of nine partner countries in the F-35 stealth fighter program until after the Trudeau government completes the competition to determine which fighter jet will replace Canada’s aging fleet of CF-18s.

“We’re committed to staying there (in the program) until we understand where the competition will bring us,” said Patrick Finn, assistant deputy minister of material at National Defence.


What a surprise... not.

So RCAF will get Block 4+ F-35s (which is good), at the expense of losing several years of 5th gen experience and a big middle finger to the force. Any financial gains from cheaper FRP F-35s will be negated by the expenses of stop-gap F/A-18 purchase. All in all, they could have done much worse.


This was a major surprise actually... in previous years this basically got barely mention at all, and its in May that the payment is due.

https://globalnews.ca/news/4243206/cana ... 4-million/

This time around its January (months before the money was due), and we have Pat Finn, ADM Mat going out to Lee Berthiume, making statements about increasing the flexibility in the competition and specifically citing other departments (not DND) ability to do so. There's a lot more going on here than meets the eye.
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hythelday

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Unread post27 Jan 2019, 23:54

hb_pencil wrote:I was wondering when someone would post this [...]

This was a major surprise actually


I hedged my bets when "interim" SH deal fell through, either after Justin's money counters (I remember those 18 planes came at a ridiculous price) or military people talked some sense into him.

How to have a pie and eat it too? The pie being campaign promise to stop F-35 purchase. Answer: don't brake the promise... during that particular term. Between them saying that "actually our Hornets don't need replacement for another 5 years", purchasing ozzy Hornets instead of Supers and him tweeting about LM creating canadian jobs it was IMO quite clear to me - stall tactics until next term. If he gets re-elected he'll be able to pull a Trump and congratulate himself on the fact F-35 are now cheaper and more capable, despite the fact that the force needed new fighters years prior.
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ricnunes

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Unread post28 Jan 2019, 00:03

hythelday wrote:I hedged my bets when "interim" SH deal fell through, either after Justin's money counters (I remember those 18 planes came at a ridiculous price) or military people talked some sense into him.

How to have a pie and eat it too? The pie being campaign promise to stop F-35 purchase. Answer: don't brake the promise... during that particular term. Between them saying that "actually our Hornets don't need replacement for another 5 years", purchasing ozzy Hornets instead of Supers and him tweeting about LM creating canadian jobs it was IMO quite clear to me - stall tactics until next term. If he gets re-elected he'll be able to pull a Trump and congratulate himself on the fact F-35 are now cheaper and more capable, despite the fact that the force needed new fighters years prior.


I absolutely and fully agree! This is actually what I've saying for quite some time :wink:
“Active stealth” is what the ignorant nay sayers call ECM and pretend like it’s new.
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