Pressure increases on [Canada] to stay or leave F-35 program

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spazsinbad

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Unread post14 Jan 2019, 20:13

Eurofighter Typhoon to bid to replace Canadian CF-18 fleet
14 Jan 2019 Garrett Reim

"Eurofighter intends to pitch its Typhoon aircraft to replace the Royal Canadian Air Force’s fleet of Boeing CF-18A/B Hornet fighters. Eurofighter, a joint venture among Airbus, BAE Systems and Leonardo, was assumed to be one of the bidders in the competition to replace the RCAF’s fighter fleet with 88 advanced jets, but it hadn’t yet publicly acknowledged its desire to play for the contract. Simon Jacques, head of Airbus defense and space in Canada, said at a company event in Montreal that his firm intends to submit a proposal for the Typhoon.

“We are very engaged,” he says. “We want to propose the Typhoon, the most advanced new generation [wut?] multi, swing-role fighter on the market today."

In October, RCAF issued a draft request for proposal to replace its aging CF-18A/B fleet. Ottawa listed five suppliers eligible to compete: Dassault Aviation, maker of the Rafale; Saab, maker of the JAS 39 Gripen; Airbus Defense – on behalf of the Eurofighter joint venture, maker of the Typhoon; Lockheed Martin, maker of the F-16 and F-35; and Boeing, maker of the F/A-18 Super Hornet and F-15E Strike Eagle. Only those five will be allowed to submit proposals…."

Source: https://www.flightglobal.com/news/artic ... 18-455004/
RAN FAA A4G Skyhawk 1970s: https://www.faaaa.asn.au/spazsinbad-a4g/ AND https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCwqC_s6gcCVvG7NOge3qfAQ/
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hb_pencil

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Unread post14 Jan 2019, 20:34

ricnunes wrote:
hb_pencil wrote:
ricnunes wrote:So I cannot see how the F-35 won't get to compete.


Then you don't have a understanding of the basic issues involved in this process.

https://www.ic.gc.ca/eic/site/086.nsf/eng/00006.html



LOL, in where does your link states that the F-35 won't get to compete :doh:


If you can't figure out its relevance, then I don't know what to say. I've left enough bread crumbs here for you to figure it out, and I'm not going to spell it out any further.

I think enough people on here can attest to the fact that I have brought unique knowledge and perspective to this discussion for the past seven years. Insulting me isn't your smartest move.


ricnunes wrote:
hb_pencil wrote:
ricnunes wrote:But lets be realistic here:
- The only two real contenders/competitors are the F-35 and the Super Hornet.

We all know where Boeing and its Super Hornet is with the Canadian competition (with the Bombardier issue and all - which will only get worse with the planned Boeing/Embraer partnership) so that leaves the F-35 as the only potential winner, this IMO of course.


Not a relevant consideration to this procurement.


Really?? Since when being NORAD compliant, 5 Eye's compliant or resuming being compliant with US Forces (namely USAF) stopped being a requirement?? Care to post a source which implicitly says this?? (and not some odd site which doesn't say anything like the one you posted before)


Did I (or you in what I highlighted) refer to any of those factors? You talked about the "bombardier issue n'all", which is what I was referring to not being a factor.
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ricnunes

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Unread post14 Jan 2019, 20:50

hb_pencil wrote:If you can't figure out its relevance, then I don't know what to say. I've left enough bread crumbs here for you to figure it out, and I'm not going to spell it out any further.


Perhaps, you should enlighten me then...

hb_pencil wrote:I think enough people on here can attest to the fact that I have brought unique knowledge and perspective to this discussion for the past seven years. Insulting me isn't your smartest move.


Really?? Where did I insult you??

And by the way, where did I say that you didn't bring knowledge here in the past? However you seem you point out the F-35 won't get to compete in Canada while everything points out that it will.
You still haven't provide any evidence or IMO a logical line of reasoning to why you hint that the F-35 maybe won't compete in Canada (when again everything points otherwise).
Resuming your post/comment/argument have been "evasive" or "illusive" at best (IMO, this is the closest to being an "insult" here but here I digress) .

So again, please indulge me...
A 4th/4.5th gen fighter aircraft stands about as much chance against a F-35 as a guns-only Sabre has against a Viper.
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XanderCrews

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Unread post14 Jan 2019, 21:41

hb_pencil wrote:
Just you wait. This government is really that inept.



No surprise
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ricnunes

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Unread post14 Jan 2019, 23:08

XanderCrews wrote:
hb_pencil wrote:
Just you wait. This government is really that inept.



No surprise


Yes, no argue there. That's a FACT!

But saying that the F-35 won't be able or allowed to compete is too far fetched (IMO, of course and for what's worth).
A 4th/4.5th gen fighter aircraft stands about as much chance against a F-35 as a guns-only Sabre has against a Viper.
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lipovitand

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Unread post15 Jan 2019, 02:01

What is the chance for Gripen? :mrgreen: Somebody wrote about it on BF4C for their paper. I really hope the govt is smart enough not to get it.
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Unread post15 Jan 2019, 03:28

Out of curiosity. I searched 'exclude' the f-35, in this topic. It came out that page 55 back in 2015 was it's first use. Not much has changed.
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spazsinbad

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Unread post15 Jan 2019, 04:09

Page 14 this thread JSF* got a guernsey from XANDERCREWS in 2014 but I'm not certain about why I found this.

viewtopic.php?f=58&t=24027&p=269378&hilit=JSF%2A#p269378

Then there is 2013 JOINT STRIKE FIGHTER phrase found in the first post of this thread (page 1) & I'm still clueless why.

viewtopic.php?f=58&t=24027&p=252665&hilit=Joint+Strike+Fighter#p252665

This is the page 55 EXCLUDE use BTW: viewtopic.php?f=58&t=24027&p=303201&hilit=exclude#p303201
RAN FAA A4G Skyhawk 1970s: https://www.faaaa.asn.au/spazsinbad-a4g/ AND https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCwqC_s6gcCVvG7NOge3qfAQ/
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ricnunes

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Unread post15 Jan 2019, 11:43

lipovitand wrote:What is the chance for Gripen? :mrgreen: Somebody wrote about it on BF4C for their paper. I really hope the govt is smart enough not to get it.


I would say next to zero :mrgreen:

During the last government and before that government decided to sole source the F-35 (which was later reversed) there was a consultation which involved the same companies and aircraft (LM/F-35, Boeing/Super Hornet, Dassault/Rafale, Airbus/Typhoon, Saab/Gripen) and at that time Saab removed itself from that same "consultation".
I believe it's a matter of time for Saab doing the same as Dassault - removing itself from the Canadian competition.

What I really, really struggle to understand is how a (ridiculous) site such as BF4C is able to get some major attention over the web, namely here in a serious site which is F-16.net :?
A 4th/4.5th gen fighter aircraft stands about as much chance against a F-35 as a guns-only Sabre has against a Viper.
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Unread post15 Jan 2019, 13:53

Canada's government is less inept than people want to believe.

China has been counter-culturating the West since way before the Boxer Rebellion. The influence is presently at a peak. The West likes to believe in its cultural superiority and has itself waned only out of interior discord.

When the natural tide swings back Canada will reassert its natural order and get fully behind the F-35A. Sooner than many believe.
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Unread post15 Jan 2019, 20:55

ricnunes wrote:
lipovitand wrote:What is the chance for Gripen? :mrgreen: Somebody wrote about it on BF4C for their paper. I really hope the govt is smart enough not to get it.


I would say next to zero :mrgreen:

During the last government and before that government decided to sole source the F-35 (which was later reversed) there was a consultation which involved the same companies and aircraft (LM/F-35, Boeing/Super Hornet, Dassault/Rafale, Airbus/Typhoon, Saab/Gripen) and at that time Saab removed itself from that same "consultation".
I believe it's a matter of time for Saab doing the same as Dassault - removing itself from the Canadian competition.


Did some digging on the Saab Gripen, I guess I can sort of see that people will buy its marketing hype...and then I find them to be a hypocrite like claiming its "combat proven".... :mrgreen:

What I really, really struggle to understand is how a (ridiculous) site such as BF4C is able to get some major attention over the web, namely here in a serious site which is F-16.net :?


Ohhh man, you ever been to their FB group? holy smokes man, its almost full of people who bought the Gripen. Its funny posting stuff about F35 and get some insane reactions lol
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ricnunes

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Unread post15 Jan 2019, 22:09

lipovitand wrote:Ohhh man, you ever been to their FB group? holy smokes man, its almost full of people who bought the Gripen. Its funny posting stuff about F35 and get some insane reactions lol


NO, I haven't and I don't intend to because if I do then in the day when I'll arrive at the "gates of death" I know that I will look in hindsight and regret each and every second of my life that I wasted in watching and reading what was vomited in such site :wink:
A 4th/4.5th gen fighter aircraft stands about as much chance against a F-35 as a guns-only Sabre has against a Viper.
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Unread post15 Jan 2019, 23:24

ricnunes wrote:
lipovitand wrote:Ohhh man, you ever been to their FB group? holy smokes man, its almost full of people who bought the Gripen. Its funny posting stuff about F35 and get some insane reactions lol


NO, I haven't and I don't intend to because if I do then in the day when I'll arrive at the "gates of death" I know that I will look in hindsight and regret each and every second of my life that I wasted in watching and reading what was vomited in such site :wink:


Lucky you. I fell into the trap. I thought it was going to be meaningful discussion, but instead its just sunshine and unicorn (Gripen). I lost soo many brain cell trying to persuade...never again.
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ricnunes

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Unread post16 Jan 2019, 00:09

lipovitand wrote:Lucky you. I fell into the trap. I thought it was going to be meaningful discussion, but instead its just sunshine and unicorn (Gripen). I lost soo many brain cell trying to persuade...never again.


Well, all I can say is that I feel sorry for you lost brain cells. But look at the bright side, there are studies that claim that the weakest brain cells are the ones that die sooner and that losing these weaker brain cells may indeed help to improve the overall performance of the brain. :mrgreen:
A 4th/4.5th gen fighter aircraft stands about as much chance against a F-35 as a guns-only Sabre has against a Viper.
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Unread post26 Jan 2019, 13:14

https://www.theglobeandmail.com/politic ... mpetition/

Canada to keep paying for F-35 development as fighter-jet competition ramps up


In an interview with The Canadian Press, the Department of National Defence’s head of military procurement says there are no plans for Canada to quit as one of nine partner countries in the F-35 stealth fighter program until after the Trudeau government completes the competition to determine which fighter jet will replace Canada’s aging fleet of CF-18s.

“We’re committed to staying there (in the program) until we understand where the competition will bring us,” said Patrick Finn, assistant deputy minister of material at National Defence.
"When a fifth-generation fighter meets a fourth-generation fighter—the [latter] dies,”
CSAF Gen. Mark Welsh
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