F-35 High Energy Laser

F-35 Armament, fuel tanks, internal and external hardpoints, loadouts, and other stores.
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Unread post15 Apr 2015, 17:33

If the laser is in a pod, it can be run by a RAT, or a JFS alike.
Plenty of options.
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Unread post15 Apr 2015, 19:30

..so.....can 150KW power an a/c HEL, etc. ??? ....yes or no.....inquiring minds want to know??


No. The requirements for a 100KW output HEL, would be 1.2 MW. Lockheed has an internal plan on how to generate that power using the space within the lift-fan and the shaft. Smaller DEW's, and DIRCMS with 10-20KW power requirements would require less overall power. Pure defensive DIRCM's already operate on helos and other aircraft.

From the Hausmann Paper

As indicated earlier (Table 2), the JSF HEL will require approximately 1.2 MW of power to operate and cool, divided between the HEL itself ( ~771 kW ) and the thermal management system ( ~200 kW ). It is important to remember that this assumes a SSL wall-plug efficiency of 10%. AFRL/DE recently reported commercial fiber SSL wall-plug efficiency of 30%, with expectations that 40% could be achieved in the future.26 SSL efficiency improvement would result in a marked reduction in both power generation and thermal management requirements.

Thermal management will be covered in detail in Chapter 5. The question at hand is whether this power generation requirement can be met with current or projected power generation technology within the volume allocated in the LSF airframe. To meet the power generation requirements for tomorrow’s directed energy weapons, AFRL’s Propulsion Directorate is actively investigating the technologies needed to manufacture lightweight, high power generators and energy storage media.

Power Generation Proposals

The Joint Strike Fighter has a unique design feature that will simplify the power generation problem. The existing design for the Short TakeOff Vertical Land (STOVL) version of the JSF already has a mechanical shaft coming off the engine to power the lift fan. The LSF would use the lift fan shaft to rotate the generator(s) powering the HEL.28 With approximately 27,000 shaft horsepower of mechanical power available from the lift fan shaft, potential limitations with power generation will reside with the generators themselves.

Generators exist today that are capable of producing the power required by the HEL; the problem is the weight of those generators. The LSF weight budget for the HEL generator is ~145 lbs. Presently, 1 MW class generators weigh around 1000 lbs, almost an order of magnitude higher weight than currently allocated for the LSF.30 Powering a SSL will require development of lighter weight power generation technologies and careful assessments of the tradeoffs between power production capacity, weight, volume, and longevity in order to optimize the power generation system. AFRL/PRP has spent several years developing a lightweight, low duty cycle generator, and will soon be testing a 1 MW class generator that weighs approximately 200 lbs, close to the target weight for the LSF project.

The first set of issues to consider are power production capacity, weight, and volume. Then LSF SSL will have a duty cycle32 under 100% because of thermal management issues. That means the power generation system does not need to be capable of continuously delivering the power required to operate the laser. A smaller generator could be employed, coupled with batteries and/or capacitors. The generator(s), batteries, and/or capacitors would operate the laser, then the generator would recharge the energy storage system during the laser down times. This concept has the advantage of requiring a smaller generator, albeit at the expense of the weight and volume of an energy storage system.33 There is currently widespread government and industry interest in developing smaller and more efficient energy storage systems. Some examples of this interest include the auto industries pursuit of all electric or hybrid electric-gas vehicles, as well as the US Navy’s all-electric ship program. The combination of industry and government interest should ensure adequate research funding for this technology challenge.

The other key issue is longevity. More precisely, one challenge with reducing the weight of a generator while still producing the same power output is maintaining or increasing the amount of time the generator will function before it fails. Lockheed Martin engineers feel they could obtain generators capable of providing the required power while still fitting within the weight and volume allocation for the LSF today. Using existing generator technology to obtain higher power output would adversely impact generator longevity.



if yes, will it fit (dimensionally) within the existing stealthy gun pod??


They never proposed to mount a laser on the F-35 gun pod. A podded laser solution that is significantly less than that of the F-35's 100KW optimum solution has been presented in the academic paper. That takes it to 40KW output power, fitted into a self-contained pod for the Super Hornet. ATGI already markets their HIRAT as something that can support DEW's.
Last edited by bring_it_on on 15 Apr 2015, 20:38, edited 1 time in total.
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Unread post15 Apr 2015, 20:09

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Unread post15 Apr 2015, 23:41

It's to be expected that any specifics remain vague for a purpose. HELLADS technology is going to reduce space and weight requirements by a factor of 10 to facilitate integration into tactical platforms. Same goes for power management, cooling, use of adaptive optics, etc. all secret squirrel stuff.
"When a fifth-generation fighter meets a fourth-generation fighter—the [latter] dies,”
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Unread post17 Apr 2015, 19:53

Tactical Laser Weapon Module Can Laserify Almost Anything



http://spectrum.ieee.org/tech-talk/aero ... t-anything
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Unread post17 Apr 2015, 21:20

It‘s all starting to come together. The General Atomics team appear to have exceeded the DARPA‘s original HELLADS design objectives ie. 150kW output in a 3cu.M volume weighing 750kg. Once Boeing's beam control system is bolted on to the front end, this is going to be one serious piece of kit.


http://www.naval-technology.com/news/ne ... vy-4515515

Boeing to build precision laser system for US Navy
19 February 2015

The US Navy has awarded a contract to Boeing to design and develop a beam control system to improve accuracy for laser weapons integrated on navy vessels.
As part of the $29.5m agreement, Boeing will design a solid-state, laser technology-based high-power beam control subsystem prototype that is compatible with high-energy lasers (HEL).
Boeing said it will be attuned with systems being designed by other companies for the Office of Naval Research's (ONR) solid-state laser technology maturation programme.
"Boeing innovations in beam control and directed-energy technologies are keys to understanding laser weapon system configurations."
Capitalising on the company's work with the US Army's high-energy laser mobile demonstrator (HEL MD), the beam control system will mainly focus and hold a laser on a moving aim-point that is at a distance sufficient to immobilise the target.
Boeing Directed Energy and Strategic Systems vice-president Peggy Morse said: "Boeing innovations in beam control and directed-energy technologies are keys to understanding laser weapon system configurations that could yield a capability for the navy in their maritime environment."
Last year, Boeing demonstrated the HEL MD system at Eglin Air Force Base in Florida, US. It acquired, tracked and destroyed targets in windy and foggy conditions.
In addition, vital technical statistics were accumulated on energy systems within a maritime environment and then shared by the ONR with the army and Boeing.
HEL MD successfully disabled mortars and unmanned aerial vehicles during recent testing.
"When a fifth-generation fighter meets a fourth-generation fighter—the [latter] dies,”
CSAF Gen. Mark Welsh
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Unread post20 Apr 2015, 05:30

Who can read this article(i'm not the member) , and do me a favor to post the context ....


http://aviationweek.com/technology/gene ... -now-ready
General Atomics: Third-Gen Electric Laser Weapon Now Ready
Apr 20, 2015
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Unread post20 Apr 2015, 06:22

Essentially General Atomics have come out with a new laser system:

- It's less than 2 or 3m^3 and contains a laser module, liquid cooling and batteries. It does not include a beam director. (As a ballpark / estimate, it's probably 3.0 x 0.8 x 0.8m)

- Stock standard, it operates at 75kW laser output, but by adding a second lasing module, it can be boosted to 150kW without increasing it's size (75kW is just a sort of 'sweet spot' when it comes to power and 'magazine' size). In the image attached, the green boxes are batteries, the the system next to it is the liquid cooling and in the black part beyond, there is a space with only half of it filled, with one of the lasing modules, at the end is something else, probably avionics.

- It runs off lithium-ion battery packs, allowing for at least 30 seconds of firing with the 75kW version. The batteries can be recharged in-flight by the aircraft's generators.

- Unlike previous systems, it doesn't use fiber lasers. They believe they're where fiber lasers will be in 5 years with their ??? diode technology. They believe that due to this level of maturity, their system is affordable today (no price is mentioned, but it's small enough that it shouldn't cost that much).

- General Atomics intends to use a 150kW version of this laser as the Predator-C Avenger's armament (if one is ever sold).
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Unread post20 Apr 2015, 06:47

Dragon029 wrote:Essentially General Atomics have come out with a new laser system:

- It's less than 2 or 3m^3 and contains a laser module, liquid cooling and batteries. It does not include a beam director. (As a ballpark / estimate, it's probably 3.0 x 0.8 x 0.8m)

- Stock standard, it operates at 75kW laser output, but by adding a second lasing module, it can be boosted to 150kW without increasing it's size (75kW is just a sort of 'sweet spot' when it comes to power and 'magazine' size). In the image attached, the green boxes are batteries, the the system next to it is the liquid cooling and in the black part beyond, there is a space with only half of it filled, with one of the lasing modules, at the end is something else, probably avionics.

- It runs off lithium-ion battery packs, allowing for at least 30 seconds of firing with the 75kW version. The batteries can be recharged in-flight by the aircraft's generators.

- Unlike previous systems, it doesn't use fiber lasers. They believe they're where fiber lasers will be in 5 years with their ??? diode technology. They believe that due to this level of maturity, their system is affordable today (no price is mentioned, but it's small enough that it shouldn't cost that much).

- General Atomics intends to use a 150kW version of this laser as the Predator-C Avenger's armament (if one is ever sold).


"- Stock standard, it operates at 75kW laser output, but by adding a second lasing module, it can be boosted to 150kW without increasing it's size (75kW is just a sort of 'sweet spot' when it comes to power and 'magazine' size). In the image attached, the green boxes are batteries, the the system next to it is the liquid cooling and in the black part beyond, there is a space with only half of it filled, with one of the lasing modules, at the end is something else, probably avionics.

- It runs off lithium-ion battery packs, allowing for at least 30 seconds of firing with the 75kW version. The batteries can be recharged in-flight by the aircraft's generators."




where these information details come from...?
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Unread post20 Apr 2015, 06:55

taog wrote:
where these information details come from...?


"- Stock standard, it operates at 75kW laser output, but by adding a second lasing module, it can be boosted to 150kW without increasing it's size (75kW is just a sort of 'sweet spot' when it comes to power and 'magazine' size). In the image attached, the green boxes are batteries, the the system next to it is the liquid cooling and in the black part beyond, there is a space with only half of it filled, with one of the lasing modules, at the end is something else, probably avionics.


The size is from another article (they stated 2 cubic meters but that might be a bit low)) and an estimate comparing it's size to the humans nearby in photos. The identification of components is just intuitive based on what the image shows (the black section with the laser modules is labelled in the image subtitle, the system with red and blue piping is obviously the cooling system, the green segment would have to be the batteries due to their volume requirement).

- It runs off lithium-ion battery packs, allowing for at least 30 seconds of firing with the 75kW version. The batteries can be recharged in-flight by the aircraft's generators."


Excerpts from the article:

"The module includes high-power-density lithium-ion batteries, liquid cooling for the laser and batteries, one or more laser unit cells and optics to clean up and stabilize the beam before it enters the platform-specific beam-director telescope, says Davis."

"The unit cell is a laser oscillator that produces a single 75-kw beam. Modules can be ganged together to produce a 150- or 300-kw beam. There is no beam-combining, Davis says, as there is in systems that use multiple lower-power fiber lasers."

Image
"Mockup shows one 75-kw laser unit cell (gold), although the tactical module has room for two, for a 150-kw laser weapon."

""In the independent unit-cell tests, beam quality was measured over a range of operating power and run time, which is limited only by the “magazine depth” of the battery system. “Beam quality was constant throughout the entire run of greater than 30 sec.,” says GA-ASI."
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Unread post20 Apr 2015, 07:08

Dragon029 wrote:
taog wrote:
where these information details come from...?


"- Stock standard, it operates at 75kW laser output, but by adding a second lasing module, it can be boosted to 150kW without increasing it's size (75kW is just a sort of 'sweet spot' when it comes to power and 'magazine' size). In the image attached, the green boxes are batteries, the the system next to it is the liquid cooling and in the black part beyond, there is a space with only half of it filled, with one of the lasing modules, at the end is something else, probably avionics.


The size is from another article (they stated 2 cubic meters but that might be a bit low)) and an estimate comparing it's size to the humans nearby in photos. The identification of components is just intuitive based on what the image shows (the black section with the laser modules is labelled in the image subtitle, the system with red and blue piping is obviously the cooling system, the green segment would have to be the batteries due to their volume requirement).

- It runs off lithium-ion battery packs, allowing for at least 30 seconds of firing with the 75kW version. The batteries can be recharged in-flight by the aircraft's generators."


Excerpts from the article:

"The module includes high-power-density lithium-ion batteries, liquid cooling for the laser and batteries, one or more laser unit cells and optics to clean up and stabilize the beam before it enters the platform-specific beam-director telescope, says Davis."

"The unit cell is a laser oscillator that produces a single 75-kw beam. Modules can be ganged together to produce a 150- or 300-kw beam. There is no beam-combining, Davis says, as there is in systems that use multiple lower-power fiber lasers."

Image
"Mockup shows one 75-kw laser unit cell (gold), although the tactical module has room for two, for a 150-kw laser weapon."

""In the independent unit-cell tests, beam quality was measured over a range of operating power and run time, which is limited only by the “magazine depth” of the battery system. “Beam quality was constant throughout the entire run of greater than 30 sec.,” says GA-ASI."


can you give me or post the whole article that you mention...("Excerpts from the article....")?plz and thx , Orz .


btw , i just read :"You don't even need to connect the module to an outside power source; it’s packed with enough lithium-ion batteries to give you some number of shots (although, as with almost every question we asked, General Atomics won’t give us specific numbers, because it’s, well, classified)." from this article(http://spectrum.ieee.org/tech-talk/aerospace/military/tactical-laser-weapon-module-can-laserify-almost-anything), so i am interesting in whether it can be recharge by aircraft's generators....?
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Unread post20 Apr 2015, 07:19

General Atomics: Third-Gen Electric Laser Weapon Now Ready
Apr 20, 2015 Graham Warwick Aviation Week & Space Technology

While fashions in high-energy lasers have changed as technology progresses, from gas to diode and now fiber, General Atomics Aeronautical Systems (GA-ASI) has stayed its course over more than a decade and believes its third generation of electric laser weapon is ready for prime time.

The company has responded to an Office of Naval Research (ONR) solicitation for a 150-kw laser weapon suitable for installation on DDG-51-class destroyers to counter unmanned aircraft and small boats using only ship power and cooling.

Under ONR’s Solid-State Laser Technology Maturation program, the weapon is to be demonstrated in 2018 on the USS Paul Foster, a decommissioned Spruance-class destroyer that now serves as the U.S. Navy’s ship-defense test vessel at Port Hueneme in California.

GA-ASI has proposed its Gen 3 High-Energy Laser (HEL) system, which recently completed independent beam-quality and power testing for the U.S. government. The Gen 3 system is the third generation of electrically pumped laser using the architecture developed for Darpa’s Hellads program.

Image
General Atomics’ third-generation tactical laser weapon module is sized to be carried on its Avenger unmanned aircraft. Credit: Graham Warwick/AW&ST

Under development since 2003, the 150-kw Hellads will be tested this summer at White Sands Missile Range in New Mexico. A smaller, lighter and more efficient Gen 2 system was built and tested in 2010-12 for the Pentagon’s HEL Joint Technology Office (JTO), says Jim Davis, director of laser weapons.

Gen 3 has increased electrical-to-optical efficiency, improved beam quality and further reduced size and weight, says GA-ASI. A mockup of the Tactical Laser Weapon Module was displayed for the first time at the Sea-Air-Space show on April 13-15 in Washington.

The module includes high-power-density lithium-ion batteries, liquid cooling for the laser and batteries, one or more laser unit cells and optics to clean up and stabilize the beam before it enters the platform-specific beam-director telescope, says Davis.

The unit cell is a laser oscillator that produces a single 75-kw beam. Modules can be ganged together to produce a 150- or 300-kw beam. There is no beam-combining, Davis says, as there is in systems that use multiple lower-power fiber lasers.

The Pentagon and several other manufacturers have shifted focus to fiber lasers because they are a commercial technology and have higher electrical-to-optical “wallplug” efficiency than diode lasers previously demonstrated at power levels exceeding 100 kw.

Image
Mockup shows one 75-kw laser unit cell (gold), although the tactical module has room for two, for a 150-kw laser weapon. Credit: Graham Warwick/AW&ST

But the Gen 3’s efficiency is at the level of fiber lasers, Davis says, adding that the company has worked for several years to improve beam quality and achieved “excellent quality” in the latest tests. Adaptive optics adjust the beam to compensate for atmospheric distortion.

In the independent unit-cell tests, beam quality was measured over a range of operating power and run time, which is limited only by the “magazine depth” of the battery system. “Beam quality was constant throughout the entire run of greater than 30 sec.,” says GA-ASI.

“Fiber lasers are interesting, but it is a matter of maturity,” says Davis. “We are where fiber may be in five years. We have built several versions of this laser over the last 10 years, and we believe [the Gen 3 system] is affordable as is.”

In addition to the ONR program, GA-ASI is eyeing the U.S. Army’s Boeing High Energy Laser Mobile Demonstrator (HEL MD). Live-fire tests of the HEL MD used a 10-kw industrial fiber laser and the Army intends to upgrade the system to a 60-kw Lockheed Martin fiber laser.

The next step is a 120-kw laser, planned for testing in the early 2020s, and for which GA-ASI plans to propose the Gen 3 system. The Air Force Research Laboratory, meanwhile, is interested in a podded laser weapon, although there is no formal program yet.

Davis says the Gen 3’s size enables an airborne laser module in the 150-kw range to be carried by GA-ASI’s Avenger unmanned aircraft. The UAV has sufficient onboard power to recharge the module’s batteries in flight. “That’s the utility; you don’t need to go back to reload,” Davis says.
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Unread post20 Apr 2015, 08:53

Dragon029 wrote:
General Atomics: Third-Gen Electric Laser Weapon Now Ready
Apr 20, 2015 Graham Warwick Aviation Week & Space Technology

While fashions in high-energy lasers have changed as technology progresses, from gas to diode and now fiber, General Atomics Aeronautical Systems (GA-ASI) has stayed its course over more than a decade and believes its third generation of electric laser weapon is ready for prime time.

The company has responded to an Office of Naval Research (ONR) solicitation for a 150-kw laser weapon suitable for installation on DDG-51-class destroyers to counter unmanned aircraft and small boats using only ship power and cooling.

Under ONR’s Solid-State Laser Technology Maturation program, the weapon is to be demonstrated in 2018 on the USS Paul Foster, a decommissioned Spruance-class destroyer that now serves as the U.S. Navy’s ship-defense test vessel at Port Hueneme in California.

GA-ASI has proposed its Gen 3 High-Energy Laser (HEL) system, which recently completed independent beam-quality and power testing for the U.S. government. The Gen 3 system is the third generation of electrically pumped laser using the architecture developed for Darpa’s Hellads program.

Image
General Atomics’ third-generation tactical laser weapon module is sized to be carried on its Avenger unmanned aircraft. Credit: Graham Warwick/AW&ST

Under development since 2003, the 150-kw Hellads will be tested this summer at White Sands Missile Range in New Mexico. A smaller, lighter and more efficient Gen 2 system was built and tested in 2010-12 for the Pentagon’s HEL Joint Technology Office (JTO), says Jim Davis, director of laser weapons.

Gen 3 has increased electrical-to-optical efficiency, improved beam quality and further reduced size and weight, says GA-ASI. A mockup of the Tactical Laser Weapon Module was displayed for the first time at the Sea-Air-Space show on April 13-15 in Washington.

The module includes high-power-density lithium-ion batteries, liquid cooling for the laser and batteries, one or more laser unit cells and optics to clean up and stabilize the beam before it enters the platform-specific beam-director telescope, says Davis.

The unit cell is a laser oscillator that produces a single 75-kw beam. Modules can be ganged together to produce a 150- or 300-kw beam. There is no beam-combining, Davis says, as there is in systems that use multiple lower-power fiber lasers.

The Pentagon and several other manufacturers have shifted focus to fiber lasers because they are a commercial technology and have higher electrical-to-optical “wallplug” efficiency than diode lasers previously demonstrated at power levels exceeding 100 kw.

Image
Mockup shows one 75-kw laser unit cell (gold), although the tactical module has room for two, for a 150-kw laser weapon. Credit: Graham Warwick/AW&ST

But the Gen 3’s efficiency is at the level of fiber lasers, Davis says, adding that the company has worked for several years to improve beam quality and achieved “excellent quality” in the latest tests. Adaptive optics adjust the beam to compensate for atmospheric distortion.

In the independent unit-cell tests, beam quality was measured over a range of operating power and run time, which is limited only by the “magazine depth” of the battery system. “Beam quality was constant throughout the entire run of greater than 30 sec.,” says GA-ASI.

“Fiber lasers are interesting, but it is a matter of maturity,” says Davis. “We are where fiber may be in five years. We have built several versions of this laser over the last 10 years, and we believe [the Gen 3 system] is affordable as is.”

In addition to the ONR program, GA-ASI is eyeing the U.S. Army’s Boeing High Energy Laser Mobile Demonstrator (HEL MD). Live-fire tests of the HEL MD used a 10-kw industrial fiber laser and the Army intends to upgrade the system to a 60-kw Lockheed Martin fiber laser.

The next step is a 120-kw laser, planned for testing in the early 2020s, and for which GA-ASI plans to propose the Gen 3 system. The Air Force Research Laboratory, meanwhile, is interested in a podded laser weapon, although there is no formal program yet.

Davis says the Gen 3’s size enables an airborne laser module in the 150-kw range to be carried by GA-ASI’s Avenger unmanned aircraft. The UAV has sufficient onboard power to recharge the module’s batteries in flight. “That’s the utility; you don’t need to go back to reload,” Davis says.


wow,thx a lot
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Unread post20 Apr 2015, 09:49

They‘re reporting encouraging progress in Aluminum-ion battery technology.


http://blogs.scientificamerican.com/plu ... n-battery/

The aluminum-ion battery’s fast charging and discharging times give it a decisive advantage over conventional lithium-ion batteries. On a mass basis, a hypothetical one-kilogram aluminum-ion battery could produce approximately 3,000 watts of power—enough to power about two to three typical residential homes, albeit for only a minute or less. On the other hand, a typical one-kilogram lithium-ion battery could only produce about 200-300 watts of power—about a tenth the power capacity of Stanford’s aluminum-ion battery..The Stanford researchers tested how long their battery lasts under different conditions by charging it at a fast one-minute rate, and then discharging it at the same one-minute rate thousands of times over. Across over 7,500 of these fast charge-discharge cycles, the researchers observed essentially no fade in the battery’s capacity.
"When a fifth-generation fighter meets a fourth-generation fighter—the [latter] dies,”
CSAF Gen. Mark Welsh
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Unread post20 Apr 2015, 10:02

That Gen 3 laser module occupies .26 cuM based on this article.
http://news.thomasnet.com/companystory/ ... n-20042920
The recently certified Gen 3 laser assembly is very compact at only 1.3 x 0.4 x 0.5 meters. The system is powered by a compact Lithium-ion battery supply designed to demonstrate a deployable architecture for tactical platforms.
"When a fifth-generation fighter meets a fourth-generation fighter—the [latter] dies,”
CSAF Gen. Mark Welsh
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