Which interceptor can stop SR-71?

snypa777 · by **snypa777** » 11 Sep 2005, 22:17

Just curious..... How about a pac-3 Patriot???????

catisfit · by **catisfit** » 12 Sep 2005, 09:48

snypa777 wrote:Just curious..... How about a pac-3 Patriot???????

I did a technical report recently on missile defence (NMD, 'son of Star Wars'), and in the process of researching that had to look at things like the PAC-3. Of course I was thinking about TBMs and not the SR-71 (:)), but the PAC-3 can intercept a TBM-velocity target at Mach-5 at 12 miles (:roll:). It's a contact missile though (TBMs don't tend to be that maneuverable!), so it might need a proximity head to be sure against the SR-71.

SwedgeII · by **SwedgeII** » 12 Sep 2005, 12:50

http://www.designation-systems.net/dusrm/r-2.html

snypa777 · by **snypa777** » 12 Sep 2005, 22:09

That`s very interesting Catisfit, also remember, the SR-71 wasn`t very maneuverable at Mach-3+ and 85,000 Ft., no manned aircraft is. Against a late series Patriot the SR` might have had to rely on ECM.

Damn Swedge2, didn`t know the Genie could do Mach-3. Mind you a blast radius of 300metres sounds a lot but with a target flying at high Mach numbers it would still have to get pretty close. The SR` could also fly faster than it. There are plenty of Mach-3 AAMs but it is a problem the SR has comfortably dealt with. It would still have to be a very well plotted intercept.

sferrin · by **sferrin** » 13 Sep 2005, 03:57

catisfit wrote:
snypa777 wrote:Just curious..... How about a pac-3 Patriot???????

I did a technical report recently on missile defence (NMD, 'son of Star Wars'), and in the process of researching that had to look at things like the PAC-3. Of course I was thinking about TBMs and not the SR-71 (:)), but the PAC-3 can intercept a TBM-velocity target at Mach-5 at 12 miles (:roll:). It's a contact missile though (TBMs don't tend to be that maneuverable!), so it might need a proximity head to be sure against the SR-71.

And 12 miles even straight up is only what about 65,000 feet? An SM-2 Block IV would probably have a pretty good chance at it though.

catisfit · by **catisfit** » 13 Sep 2005, 11:04

I only quoted what's on FAS. The older Patriots were good for 50 miles or more, but they list the PAC-3 as 12 miles. That's why I put the :roll:

after it. I have nothing to do with the PAC-3 so I can only quote official figures and then suggest that they may or may not be being exactly truthful about them :wink:

habu2 · by **habu2** » 13 Sep 2005, 15:14

Habu wrote:
kubam4a1 wrote:I remind that F-15 armed with AMRAMMs shot down MiG-25RB over Iraq.
So...

soooo....what?
MiG-25s don't cruise at Mach 3.2

and no one else cruises at 85,000 ft :2c:

sferrin · by **sferrin** » 15 Sep 2005, 02:18

catisfit wrote:I only quoted what's on FAS. The older Patriots were good for 50 miles or more, but they list the PAC-3 as 12 miles. That's why I put the after it. I have nothing to do with the PAC-3 so I can only quote official figures and then suggest that they may or may not be being exactly truthful about them

PAC-2s and PAC-3s are completely different missiles. PAC-3 is about a third the size of PAC-2.

Knifeedge · by **Knifeedge** » 26 Sep 2005, 21:23

who deleted my post!!!!?!??!?!?!!?!??! :evil:

overscan · by **overscan** » 05 Feb 2006, 01:41

In Lockheed Blackbird- Beyond the Secret Missions Paul F Crickmore researched SR-71 interceptions. Soviet MiG-25PDs and Swedish Viggens both routinely scrambled to intercept SR-71 flights around the Baltic sea. The SR-71 would fly a loop around the Baltic, anticlockwise. Swedish Viggens would be alerted as the SR-71 entered the Baltic then flew along the Lithuania/Latvia coastline, and scramble to intercept head-on as the SR-71 headed back down the Swedish coast. Closing speed of Mach 4.5-5.0 were typical on this headon intercept technique; the Viggen would reach between 18500 and 20000m altitude. In the first Swedish SR-71 intercept, the SR-71 was clocked at Mach 2.98 and 21500m, and the Swedish pilot had visual contact.

The Soviets usually did an intercept as the SR-71 passed East Germany on the way home. A MiG-25PD would scramble and fly a wide curve, converging on a parallel course to the SR-71. The MiG-25 couldn't keep up for long, but flew correctly would arrive below and behind the SR-71 (approx 63,000ft altitude, and 1.6nm behind the SR-71) within weapons range for an R-40 AAM shot.

In each case, the intercept window was tight, and if the SR-71 changed course sufficiently it could spoil the intercept geometry.

The MiG-31 altered things a bit. Its 8TP IRST could detect an SR-71 at 100-120km. The interception was carried out purely by GCI and the IRST. The MiG-31's radar was set to "wartime" frequencies, which was normally forbidden during peacetime to prevent ELINT equipment from detecting it. However, should a shootdown prove necessary, the hope was that any onboard ECM on the Blackbird would not be able to counter the radar in its "wartime" mode. The radar was therefore left off during the intercept. The MiG-31 would converge on the SR-71 in a circular path, arriving about 4000m below the SR-71 and just behind it.

The MiG-31 pilot interviewed for the book, Major Myagkiy, made 14 SR-71 intercepts between August 1984 and January 1987. Only once did he get a visual on it; in the other 13 intercepts it was just an IR contact on the WSO's screen.

If the order had been given to fire on the SR-71, then the WSO would have turned on the radar, acquired the target and fired his R-33 missiles. No such order was ever given to a MiG-31 pilot.

MiG-31 pilots are confident that their R-33 missiles would have worked. SR-71 pilots are pretty sure that their onboard ECM systems would have jammed it. We'll never know one way or the other for certain...

parrothead · by **parrothead** » 05 Feb 2006, 09:33

I think I saw a missile that might have been conceived to bring down the Blackbird at Nellis. This is just a replica, but it gives you an idea of just how massive the thing is.

The SA-5 "Gammon" is one big mother of a missile at 15,600 lbs and 35 feet long :shock:

! Its range is listed as between four and eighty-one nautical miles and the effective altitude is listed as between 1,000 and 131,000 feet!

The moment I read those statistics, I immediately thought that this was built with the idea of bringing Blackbirds down.

RyanCollins · by **RyanCollins** » 05 Feb 2006, 23:09

Now, that's a missile...

KarimAbdoun · by **KarimAbdoun** » 07 Feb 2006, 08:33

Hell yeah, but in my mind, if I am a Russian and I wannt to have any chance of intercepting an SR-71, I'd go for the MiG-25 or 31, the MiG-25 ould reach a stagerring 80,000ft and a world record was set at 118,898ft. And so does the 1, but they can't sustain that alttiutude for long as they need to cruise at Mach 2 only to be airbourne. A for the SR-71, it could sustain its 80-85,000ft routine flight at Mach 3.2
For more read this:
http://www.wvi.com/~sr71webmaster/mig25.html

Guysmiley · by **Guysmiley** » 07 Feb 2006, 17:30

If that were true, why were no SR-71s shot down again? :poke:

TC · by TC » 08 Feb 2006, 01:42

KarimAbdoun wrote:I'd go for the MiG-25 or 31, the MiG-25 could reach a stagerring 80,000ft and a world record was set at 118,898ft.

That's with no armament, no tanks, and just enough internal fuel to fly that high altitude profile, and RTB on bingo. Oh yeah, and that was only the "official" world record. SR drivers like to look at that record for a laugh.

KarimAbdoun wrote:As for the SR-71, it could sustain its 80-85,000ft routine flight at Mach 3.2

It would go higher and faster. Official speeds and altitudes for the Blackbirds operational profiles are still classified.

Beers and MiGs were made to be pounded!