Spain joins France, Germany on new combat fighter

loke · by **loke** » 07 Jun 2019, 20:03

COLOGNE, Germany — A lingering dispute between German lawmakers and Airbus could nix immediate plans to move forward with a future Franco-German-Spanish fighter aircraft, Defense News has learned.
The kerfuffle goes back to a February request for information by members of the Bundestag’s Budget Committee. Citing the government’s role as a major shareholder in the company, lawmakers called on the administration to provide in-depth information about Airbus locations, programs and management equities throughout Europe.
Airbus is one of two prime contractors for the Future Combat Air System, an ambitious project to field a sixth-generation fighter aircraft by 2040. The envisioned weapon also includes new sensors, drones and a complex data infrastructure, making it Europe’s preeminent industrial project for decades to come.
Lawmakers in Berlin are worried that German defense-industry interests, presumably channeled through Airbus, could get the short shrift once substantial contracts are up for grabs amid French competition, led by Dassault.
The Budget Committee reiterated its request for the company deep dive on June 5, when members approved the initial batch of funds for the FCAS program: $37 million for a study on propulsion options.

Lawmakers inserted a note into their approval text that makes answering the February request a condition for entering into follow-on agreements with France.

https://www.defensenews.com/global/euro ... -air-show/

German politicians...

vilters · by **vilters** » 08 Jun 2019, 22:33

Nothing to worry about.
After 12.345 meetings (spending half the budget already) they will split again.

Europe is Europe on paper only.
In the end? Each country will protect its own industry.

We failed with Tornado, a mix from everybody and everything, but good at nothing.

And the split Rafale-Tiffy.
Some really have short memory.

Just wait for the split or half baken result.
Nothing to worry about guys; Nothing to see here.

Corsair1963 · by **Corsair1963** » 09 Jun 2019, 07:44

Nothing wrong with Spain joining the NGF Program with France and Germany. Yet, keep hearing France is putting big pressure on Spain (among others) not to acquire the F-35. This clearly has nothing to do with the 6th Generation NGF Program. Nor, would acquiring the F-35 take sales from it....

As a matter of fact the F-35 would be a good replacement for the Spanish F/A-18 Hornets (F-35A) and Harrier II's (F-35B). Then when the Typhoons are ready to retire. The NGF's would replace them.

wil59 · by **wil59** » 09 Jun 2019, 07:55

vilters wrote:Nothing to worry about.
After 12.345 meetings (spending half the budget already) they will split again.

Europe is Europe on paper only.
In the end? Each country will protect its own industry.

We failed with Tornado, a mix from everybody and everything, but good at nothing.

And the split Rafale-Tiffy.
Some really have short memory.

Just wait for the split or half baken result.
Nothing to worry about guys; Nothing to see here.

You're right! France should do it alone would be better! It will cost more, but if it is the price to pay for the project takes shape !.

vilters · by **vilters** » 09 Jun 2019, 10:44

Correct,
When France goes solo, they can also export the airframe.
When "Europe" builds the thing, there will always be an export veto somewhere to protect each of the countries interests.

Working together "might" reduce R&D (I highly doubt that anyway) and sharing the industry work WILL create more issues than it will solve and export options become close to ZERO.

Our "EUROPE" political and financial structure has become so complicated that the chances of succes go down by the minute.

Compare that with the future cost of a batch of F-35 for each country involved.

No competition.

loke · by **loke** » 17 Jun 2019, 12:22

Mock-up of the new fighter revealed:

https://defence-blog.com/news/dassault- ... -show.html

https://www.flugrevue.de/militaer/europ ... enthuellt/

Picture 7/7 shows a model of the "carriers" that will be developed in parallel.

https://www.huffingtonpost.fr/entry/sal ... 17ef0c7a18

This a/c looks somewhat familiar...

loke · by **loke** » 17 Jun 2019, 12:36

Guided weapons specialist MBDA has unveiled a broad range of air-launched weapons concepts that could equip a future class of combat aircraft being studied by France and Germany, and also the UK.

Displayed at the European company’s outdoor exhibit, the products range in size from a lightweight glide weapon to a supersonic cruise missile, and span strike weapons to so-called “effectors”, which would be suitable for tasks potentially including electronic attack.

Read more:
https://www.flightglobal.com/news/artic ... ca-458962/

forza · by **forza** » 19 Jun 2019, 01:16

jetblast16 · by **jetblast16** » 19 Jun 2019, 02:09

Imitation is the sincerest form of flattery

charlielima223 · by **charlielima223** » 19 Jun 2019, 03:23

https://theaviationist.com/2019/06/18/d ... -air-show/

The Next Generation Fighter mockup’s shape resemble the Northrop YF-23 (the second finalist in the Advanced Tactical Fighter competition which resulted in the F-22) with a slightly more canted tail. The mockup is not very detailed, so it isn’t possible to say if it will be an all-moving tail or a traditional one.

Continuing the comparison with the YF-23, the NGF’s engine nacelles and cockpit appear to be more streamlined. The mockup also sports diverterless supersonic inlets (DSI), similar in shape to those used on the F-35, to ensure high-quality airflow to the engines over a wide range of conditions and reduce the risk of radar waves being reflected when hitting the fan. Like the aircrafts that it’s going to replace, Rafale and Eurofighter, the new fighter uses a delta wing.

jakobs · by **jakobs** » 19 Jun 2019, 15:11

Turns out it must be really hard to build a fighter without tail. I really don't like the long nose on the model, but that aside it seems solid.

sprstdlyscottsmn · by **sprstdlyscottsmn** » 19 Jun 2019, 16:40

I have a bigger issue with the short (in height) canopy. My areas of concern are pilot visibility on landing, Yaw control (those ruddervators are nearly horizontal), and engine airflow (those are tiny inlets).

vilters · by **vilters** » 19 Jun 2019, 22:35

If it is as good as the NH-90 and the AM-400?

What's there to worry about?
They aren't even worth the cost of the aluminium that went into them.

The NH-90 being an overweight maintenance/reliability disaster and the AM-400 does not know if it has to play a grown-up C-130 or a reduced C-17. => No idea what they where thinking, but it is neither.

France and Turky's effort at a stealth airframe look like something like:
"We want to play with the big boys but have no clue what its all about".

madrat · by **madrat** » 20 Jun 2019, 10:57

The design looks focused on frontal stealth. The main wing doesn't look very optimal for anything.

wil59 · by **wil59** » 20 Jun 2019, 14:34

vilters wrote:If it is as good as the NH-90 and the AM-400?

What's there to worry about?
They aren't even worth the cost of the aluminium that went into them.

The NH-90 being an overweight maintenance/reliability disaster and the AM-400 does not know if it has to play a grown-up C-130 or a reduced C-17. => No idea what they where thinking, but it is neither.

France and Turky's effort at a stealth airframe look like something like:
"We want to play with the big boys but have no clue what its all about".

Do not sell the bear skin without killing it.