JSF Stealth Coat Cost (for 65 YEARS?!) Phew.....

Discuss the F-35 Lightning II
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spazsinbad

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Unread post20 Nov 2020, 21:58

A recent example of testament to the F-35 'stealth coating' is of course on another thread so go there: [other threads also]

viewtopic.php?f=60&t=53014&p=428988&hilit=Waldron+rock#p428988
"...the coating itself is “rock solid”. “It’s a generational jump from previous stealth aircraft,” he says. Lockheed’s F-35 factory in Fort Worth, Texas, has a doormat made from the jet’s low-observable skin. “Every year they pick it up and check it, and it still holds that LO quality,” Sheehy says. Steve Over, director international business, adds: “It’s seen tens and tens of thousands of steps. People jump on it, stomp on it... it’s just one thing we use to prove the durability of the coating system.”

More importantly, they contend, the coating is easily applied in the field and requires no environmental control facility as with previous versions of stealth aircraft. Lockheed says the interval between maintenance events for the F-35’s low-observable coating is now 19h – better than the targeted 9h...." https://www.flightglobal.com/news/artic ... id-461721/

___________________________________________________________________

Quote POSTED: viewtopic.php?f=60&t=27639&p=296915&hilit=Materials+Technology+Building+Tactical+Century#p296915
"....For those services that operate airplanes in more benign environments than an aircraft carrier, they’re getting the benefit of a coating system that’s designed for an aircraft carrier. Everybody gets the same thing...."
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energo

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Unread post20 Nov 2020, 23:53

garrya wrote:F-35 skin


Excellent find!
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Unread post21 Nov 2020, 17:30

garrya wrote:F-35 skin
CC278503-3CEA-476D-BD13-478E6CBB1522.jpeg


Could someone explain the differences in composition between the F-22 and the F-35 coatings? Why two primers on the F-22? What does the conductive coating do? What is the waterborne primer? The fibermat?
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Unread post21 Nov 2020, 19:56

michaelemouse wrote:
garrya wrote:F-35 skin
The attachment CC278503-3CEA-476D-BD13-478E6CBB1522.jpeg is no longer available

Could someone explain the differences in composition between the F-22 and the F-35 coatings? Why two primers on the F-22? What does the conductive coating do? What is the waterborne primer? The fibermat?

A 36 page PDF (reprinted hence PRN - URLs not live) about some aspects of how F-35 STEALTH achieved is attached below.

Using the SEARCH function one may find 2 pages of references to 'fibermat' (which is likely also 'fiber mat'/'fibre mat').

ONE example: viewtopic.php?f=58&t=19506&p=229846&hilit=fibermat#p229846
Attachments
F-35ComparisonF-22&legacyCoatingsONLY.gif
F-35 STEALTH PRN pp36.pdf
(1.55 MiB) Downloaded 20 times
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Unread post21 Nov 2020, 20:33

Salute!

I want some of that stuff for my 1964 GTO !!!!!!

What's the use of 400 HP if I can't let the sucker rip?

Gums wishes.....
Gums
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"God in your guts, good men at your back, wings that stay on - and Tally Ho!"
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steve2267

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Unread post21 Nov 2020, 22:03

Gums wrote:Salute!

I want some of that stuff for my 1964 GTO !!!!!!

What's the use of 400 HP if I can't let the sucker rip?

Gums wishes.....


Gums... you just wanna tear by that Florida State Trooper whilst his radar gun reads 0 mph... (If you somehow add the APG-81 to the hood, then you could get his gun to read 55 mph, or whatever you wish.)
Take an F-16, stir in A-7, dollop of F-117, gob of F-22, dash of F/A-18, sprinkle with AV-8B, stir well + bake. Whaddya get? F-35.
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magitsu

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Unread post21 Nov 2020, 23:07

The slide comes from this presentation:
https://slideplayer.com/slide/12976539/
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spazsinbad

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Unread post22 Nov 2020, 00:13

Thanks. What a hassle PPTs are these days for someone without MS Office or a PPT Viewer. I'll see if I can make a PDF.

Official MS PPT Viewer said file was corrupt so from screengrabs a 10 page PDF made with 'question' blank page deleted.

Low Observable Maintenance on 5th Generation Aircraft by Col Jon Eberlan
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LOmaint5genAircraftPPT10pp.pdf
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Unread post24 Nov 2020, 12:43

michaelemouse wrote:
garrya wrote:F-35 skin
CC278503-3CEA-476D-BD13-478E6CBB1522.jpeg


Could someone explain the differences in composition between the F-22 and the F-35 coatings? Why two primers on the F-22? What does the conductive coating do? What is the waterborne primer? The fibermat?


Just found this which explains F-22 coating:
https://www.flightglobal.com/stealth-re ... 82.article

A recent lawsuit against Lockheed brought by a former F-22 stealth engineer provides a detailed glimpse into this specific application. Lockheed denies the claims by the former employee, Darrol Olsen, that the company knowingly supplied defective stealth coatings to the US Air Force during the development phase of the programme. But court records show that Lockheed's goal is to make the F-22 appear as the size of a "bumblebee" to a radar detector.

The F-22's contoured shape achieves the majority of the desired radar cross-section objective, court documents say. In addition, the F-22 also has numerous layers of coatings applied to the aircraft skin.

"The initial requirements were for three layers of coating to be stacked together in the following order," the court documents show. "The first coating is a primer designed to smooth and seal the surface of the skin and promote adhesion of the conductive coating.

"The second is a conductive coating consisting of silver flakes mixed with polyurethane materials and intended to conduct, dissipate and reflect the radar waves away. The third is the topcoat, which has other metallic materials and infrared properties to reduce heat and thus radar detection. In addition, other coatings such as [radar absorbent materials], gap fillers, and adhesives were applied on various specific areas of the aircraft."


There is no mentioning of 2nd Primer here, but that might be used to improve adhesion between Top Coat and Conductive Coating for example.

I think F-22 and F-35 coatings are basically similar, but technology has matured a lot. Fibermat is a big improvement as it's structural and very durable. It's basically combination of Conductive Coating and Fairing Material in F-22 and also saves a layer of primer. It also seems that the materials used are much more efficient if those pictures are in scale. Basically F-35 skin is a lot thinner and much more robust than original F-22 skin.
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