Moscow Times: PAK-FA Faster than F-22

disconnectedradical · by **disconnectedradical** » 13 Feb 2012, 21:15

http://www.themoscowtimes.com/news/arti ... 52993.html

http://www.themoscowtimes.com/news/arti ... 52999.html

The fifth-generation PAK FA T-50 jet fighter will have a higher maximum speed, longer maximum flight time and greater freight capacity than the American-made F-22 and the Chinese J-20, Air Force Colonel General Alexander Zelin said Monday, RIA-Novosti reported. The new Russian fighter plane, first shown off in August at the 2011 MAKS air show outside Moscow, also has a shorter required takeoff distance than the American and Chinese fighters currently in use.

Production of the American F-22 was ceased by manufacturer Lockheed Martin in December. The latest American jet fighter, the F-35, was first tested in 2006 and is set to enter the field in 2016.

Zelin also announced Monday that a new missile will be developed this year for the S-400 Triumf anti-aircraft defense system. The S-400 system has been in service since 2007 and owes its name to its capability to hit targets at a distance of 400 kilometers.

pushoksti · by **pushoksti** » 13 Feb 2012, 22:05

The PAK-FA will need that higher maximum speed to run away after it detects the F-22. Oops, it won't even be able to do that, so either way it's screwed.

SpudmanWP · by **SpudmanWP** » 13 Feb 2012, 22:18

The PAK-FA will need that higher maximum speed to run away after it detects the inbound AMRAAM.

Fixed it for ya

cywolf32 · by **cywolf32** » 13 Feb 2012, 22:38

Guess we will have to see how long those engines last then. It's one thing to reach ludicrous speed. Doing it reliably and safely is entirely different. Considering the SU-35's engine woes, it is a bold claim.

tacf-x · by **tacf-x** » 13 Feb 2012, 22:39

Oh sure, the Russians make that claim even though their jet uses VG intake ramps that reduce Low Observability, radiate huge amounts of power with all of those radars, use leading edge slats and vortex controllers that also aren't good for LO, and has yet to display that it is superior to the F-22 at those given parameters. Like I said earlier, all talk and no bite.

Also I could be wrong but I believe it was mentioned on here that even Kopp admits to the Su-35's engines having issues with short TBOs due to the larger and sloppier tolerances of their internal components.

cywolf32 · by **cywolf32** » 13 Feb 2012, 23:05

I've seen and been in both MiGs and Sukhoi's. If they are the benchmark to go by, nuff said. Would be nice to know if Mr. Goon has had that opportunity. Gives perspective and maybe some credence to his claims if so.

em745 · by **em745** » 13 Feb 2012, 23:24

tacf-x wrote:Oh sure, the Russians make that claim even though their jet uses VG intake ramps that reduce Low Observability, radiate huge amounts of power with all of those radars, use leading edge slats and vortex controllers that also aren't good for LO

For the record, the F-22 also uses those.

cywolf32 wrote:I've seen and been in both MiGs and Sukhoi's. If they are the benchmark to go by, nuff said.

I think I'll throw in my own "nuff said":

MiG-25... Mach 3.2... Nuff said. :wink:

cywolf32 · by **cywolf32** » 13 Feb 2012, 23:29

yeah, and the engines are melting all the way back to Russia. Yawn..... how many ever reached that theoretical speed? Oh by the way, its just an interceptor, not a multirole 5th gen acft. Would love to see what it cannot do in WVR combat. That thing will stick out on radar like a sore thumb by the way. And they have been shot down by SLOWER acft!! Just saying.....

sewerrat · by **sewerrat** » 13 Feb 2012, 23:35

Sounds like those idiotic new car brochures where the manufacturer bullet points everything it does "better" than the competition; but in the real world, there's no difference discernable from one to the other.

One key word I noticed was "maxiumum" with respect to speed. The Mig-31 has a higher maximum speed than an F-15. And... Which is the better aircraft? Apparently no F-15 has never done M2.5 in combat, and no F-16 has done M2.0 in combat.

That said, I do wonder about accelleration between the 2 aircraft. The Pak Fa is obviously heavier than the -22, so I'd guess the -22 could out accellerate it to its max airspeed.

tacf-x · by **tacf-x** » 13 Feb 2012, 23:39

Yes, but the Raptor's use fixed chines. Shouldn't that be better for LO?

disconnectedradical · by **disconnectedradical** » 13 Feb 2012, 23:48

Not even Sukhoi made this claim; it was made by a Russian Air Force general. Not sure if that implies anything though.

IIRC, Sukhoi claimed that the Su-35 with the same class of engines as the PAK-FA (maybe vice versa) will out accelerate the T-50. I'll have to look up the source. It seems reasonable, as an F-22 would probably be slower than an F-15 if it were to have the latter's engines.

shingen · by **shingen** » 14 Feb 2012, 01:10

Accelerate from what speed to what speed?

Doesn't aspect ratio play some role in where a plane's best acceleration is?

cywolf32 · by **cywolf32** » 14 Feb 2012, 01:17

The F-22 would still be "slower" @ top speed given it's stealth coatings and fixed inlets require such a limitation. However, from an acceleration point of view with a usable combat load, F-22 baby.

deadseal · by **deadseal** » 14 Feb 2012, 01:46

Who cares how fast you go...Once everyone gets over the mach...avionics/stealth become the big equalizer

southernphantom · by **southernphantom** » 14 Feb 2012, 02:27

I can smell the melting titanium from my house :lol:

Just be glad those K-36Ds are Russian :wink: