Japan is Buying F-35s

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quicksilver

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battleshipagincourt

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Unread post20 Dec 2011, 03:54

"This program badly needed an endorsement like this, particularly one from a technically respected customer. But there are still many complications, especially price tag and work share demands..."

This doesn't bode well for the F-35... given as it can't seem to sell itself on its own merits. Now it 'badly' needs endorsements from customers to survive. Too bad that it's still years from being remotely combat-ready... I would have hoped from the decade of development and tens of billions of dollars, they'd have produced more than just a flyable airframe. And even that is years and billions more away from being completed!

Hope the Japanese don't face a major conflict within the next decade... or however much longer they'll be developing the F-35's combat software.
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Unread post20 Dec 2011, 04:17

So Japan chooses the most expensive & least off-setting option and you still think that doesn't bode well??

Wake up! Japan chose it because it was the best option, by far, on the basis of it's capabilities.

Japan's choice is actually the first full FMS customer (non partner/subsidized) purchase and will likely lead to more FMS sales (SK, Singapore, Spain, etc). This will drive down LRIP pricing and lower the overall lifetime cost of the F-35 program.

Cheers to the Japanese, they made the right choice.

btw, how great is it that KJI croaked in the same week as the first FMS F-35 deal is announced? :)
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popcorn

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Unread post20 Dec 2011, 04:43

Congratulations to the winner.
When do the Koreans decide on their fighter acquisition? this has to be a plus for the F-35 in that bidding. It would be unthinkable for the ROKAF to miss the Gen 5 bandwagon and no, the PAK-FA won't be it.
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maus92

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Unread post20 Dec 2011, 04:55

They are buying 4 F-35As in the Japanese fiscal year starting April 1, 2012. No word on pricing of those jets, or a delivery timetable. They will eventually fill 2 squadrons currently operating F-4J's.
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tacf-x

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Unread post20 Dec 2011, 05:01

SpudmanWP wrote:So Japan chooses the most expensive & least off-setting option and you still think that doesn't bode well??

Wake up! Japan chose it because it was the best option, by far, on the basis of it's capabilities.

Japan's choice is actually the first full FMS customer (non partner/subsidized) purchase and will likely lead to more FMS sales (SK, Singapore, Spain, etc). This will drive down LRIP pricing and lower the overall lifetime cost of the F-35 program.

Cheers to the Japanese, they made the right choice.

btw, how great is it that KJI croaked in the same week as the first FMS F-35 deal is announced? :)


I whole heartedly agree. How could Japan buying F-35 be bad? It's good because it allows LM to spread the cost of the JSF program over more units so the LRIP cost can go down. This will SAVE the F-35 as maybe the price tag will look far more appealing to Congress's local liberal military-haters.
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neptune

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Unread post20 Dec 2011, 05:36

maus92 wrote:They are buying 4 F-35As in the Japanese fiscal year starting April 1, 2012. No word on pricing of those jets, or a delivery timetable. They will eventually fill 2 squadrons currently operating F-4J's.


Are these the four that the Aussies didn't op for in LRIP 5?? :?: :wink:
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popcorn

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Unread post20 Dec 2011, 05:41

tacf-x wrote:I whole heartedly agree. How could Japan buying F-35 be bad? It's good because it allows LM to spread the cost of the JSF program over more units so the LRIP cost can go down. This will SAVE the F-35 as maybe the price tag will look far more appealing to Congress's local liberal military-haters.


Well, it is bad news for Eurofighter GmbH and Boeing.. plus all those detractors who were hoping for either of the other two to win if only to spite the F-35 program.
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Unread post20 Dec 2011, 05:42

This is how I see it happening:

Contract signed in 2012
Long lead items started in 2013
Production starts in 2014 (LRIP8)
Deliveries starting in 2016

Their chance of getting in on LRIP5 is about even with KJI's chance of making it to 2012 :)
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Unread post20 Dec 2011, 06:34

Lockheed Lightning II Strikes in Tokyo Dec 19, 2011 By Amy Butler

http://www.aviationweek.com/aw/generic/ ... e=Lockheed Lightning II Strikes in Tokyo

"Japan’s selection of the F-35 for its F-4 Phantom replacement signals that despite technical problems and cost overruns in developing the single-engine stealthy fighter, there is a customer base willing to take a risk in pursuit of a longtime technological advantage on the battlefield.

Japan announced Dec. 20 (local) it would buy 40-50 fighters from Lockheed Martin under its F-X competition, further solidifying the long-standing security relationship between Washington and Tokyo. The package includes a final assembly and checkout (FACO) facility in Japan as well as work there to build components – potentially including the wings or center fuselage – and subcomponents. Specific details on the value of this FACO facility were not disclosed. Italy has a similar FACO facility estimated to cost about $800 million.

Separate contracts will be drawn up to buy of the aircraft and set up the FACO facility. Reuters reported that Mitsubishi Heavy Industries and IHI would participate in the production....

...Lockheed officials declined to identify a potential contract value, but some analysts estimate it to be worth $8 billion. The contract for the first four jets, likely to be used for training, is expected in Japan’s fiscal 2012, beginning in April....

...O’Bryan also says that the company can accommodate additional sales in LRIP 8 to South Korea should the country follow Tokyo’s lead and select the Joint Strike Fighter for its requirement of 60 aircraft. “There is capacity available,” he told reporters on a late-night teleconference in the U.S. “We have tooling available” for more jets in that lot...."

Always more at the JUMP of course! Get to it. :D
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popcorn

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Unread post20 Dec 2011, 07:30

spazsinbad wrote:...O’Bryan also says that the company can accommodate additional sales in LRIP 8 to South Korea should the country follow Tokyo’s lead and select the Joint Strike Fighter for its requirement of 60 aircraft. “There is capacity available,” he told reporters on a late-night teleconference in the U.S. “We have tooling available” for more jets in that lot...:D


LM Just making sure in the unlikely event the Koreans might have missed the news.. :D

Is it too late in the day to offer the F-35 to Brazil, assuming of course Brazil passes muster in Washington's eyes?
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m

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Unread post20 Dec 2011, 18:18

$4 billion, $8 billion? What will the F35 cost the Japanese?
When $4 billion, this is a lot less than the mentioned $10 billion by a Norwegian official in the Canadian news.


2nd UPDATE: Japan Chooses F-35 For Next Generation Fighter Jet

-- Japan chooses Lockheed Martin F-35 for next generation of jet fighters
-- Plane selected over competing bids from Boeing and Eurofighter
-- Deal worth an estimated $4 billion

(Adds comments from Japan defense official in 3rd paragraph, Lockheed Martin executive in 5th paragraph, details of Japanese partner firms in 8th paragraph.)
By Chester Dawson
Of THE WALL STREET JOURNAL

Quote: The contract for the new fighter, dubbed the FX, totals 42 planes, Japanese officials said. They did not disclose the value of the deal, but the order is expected
to be worth more than $4 billion, making it Japan's most expensive fighter procurement ever and one of the world's largest military contracts this year.

http://www.nasdaq.com/aspx/company-news ... ighter-jet
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Unread post20 Dec 2011, 19:04

This sure is some good news. I hope that this gives the program a much needed energy injection, and that they fix it's problems in quick order. :D
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maus92

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Unread post20 Dec 2011, 19:48

neptune wrote:
maus92 wrote:They are buying 4 F-35As in the Japanese fiscal year starting April 1, 2012. No word on pricing of those jets, or a delivery timetable. They will eventually fill 2 squadrons currently operating F-4J's.


Are these the four that the Aussies didn't op for in LRIP 5?? :?: :wink:


These 4 jets are for delivery in 2016, from the LRIP 8 batch.
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Unread post20 Dec 2011, 20:06

Just to put any rumors to bed, they will be Blk3
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