F-16.net

loke wrote:

Corsair1963 wrote:

loke wrote:
The future Greek Rafales maybe better than the Turkish F-16's. Yet, not markedly so....

Incorrect; the future Greek Rafale will be significantly better than the Turkish F-16. Just look at how much better the Rafale scored compared to the Swiss Hornets, back in 2008; The Rafale has evolved quite significantly since then.

Another reference point is the Indian MMRCA; only Rafale and Typhoon made the cut, but of those two the IAF ranked Rafale higher than the Typhoon. The F-16 block 70 offered to India was much stronger than the Turkish F-16 but wasn't even shortlisted.

The Rafale has much better situational awareness, much better radar, and with Meteor, a missile with much larger NEZ. The EW capabilities is also much better. The Greek pilots are also very good. The Turkish F-16s will struggle. The major weak point of the Greek Rafale will be that they will be way too few.

jessmo112 wrote:Note a S-400 on the Bosphorus straight would cover alot of greece. Rafales would die after wheels up.

gta4 wrote:Correction: F-16 block70 was not shortlisted because India required the F16 to carry CFTs to perform flight test.

loke wrote:

gta4 wrote:Correction: F-16 block70 was not shortlisted because India required the F16 to carry CFTs to perform flight test.

Do you have a source for this claim? None of the two shortlisted MMCRA contenders carried CFTs.

gta4 wrote:

loke wrote:

gta4 wrote:Correction: F-16 block70 was not shortlisted because India required the F16 to carry CFTs to perform flight test.

Do you have a source for this claim? None of the two shortlisted MMCRA contenders carried CFTs.

https://carnegieendowment.org/files/Dec ... cision.pdf

Lockheed Martin responded to
this requirement by equipping the F-16
— until then, among the world’s most
wickedly agile air combat platforms —
with conformal fuel tanks (CFTs). These
CFTs, which can be removed between
missions but not jettisoned in flight,
extended the F-16’s already impressive
reach, but at the cost of robbing it of its
renowned sprightliness

The concerns about
handling and turn
rates, however, clearly
indicate something
important about the
IAF’s preferences in the
MMRCA competition,
while highlighting the
fact that the F-16IN
remains in some ways a
retrograde development
where close-in air
combat manoeuvring is
concerned

With its CFTs, the F-16IN’s handling
and sustained turn rates — which otherwise rank among the world’s best —
dropped to the bottom relative to the
other MMRCA competitors and thus
provided the final strike against its inclusion in the shortlist. The fact that the
CFT-equipped F-16IN would be less manoeuvrable compared to Pakistan’s F-16
Block 50/52s made the Super Viper’s exclusion from the MMRCA shortlist virtually a foregone conclusion

the F16IN Super Viper that Lockheed Martin offered in the MMRCA competition
grew out of the F-16 Block 60 developed
for the United Arab Emirates (UAE). The
UAE partially funded its development in
order to acquire an aircraft capable of
carrying a useful ordnance load to the
extended distances necessary to target
Tehran. Lockheed Martin responded to
this requirement by equipping the F-16
— until then, among the world’s most
wickedly agile air combat platforms —
with conformal fuel tanks (CFTs).

The focus on agility, turn rates, thrust-to-weight ratios, handling, and in general, aerodynamic performance, provides clear indication that what the IAF
wanted most dearly in its MMRCA was a
‘super hot rod of the skies’ — an aircraft
that would excel in air combat manoeuvring because it possessed superior
speed, acceleration, and nimbleness.

loke wrote:

Corsair1963 wrote:

loke wrote:
The future Greek Rafales maybe better than the Turkish F-16's. Yet, not markedly so....

Incorrect; the future Greek Rafale will be significantly better than the Turkish F-16. Just look at how much better the Rafale scored compared to the Swiss Hornets, back in 2008; The Rafale has evolved quite significantly since then.

Another reference point is the Indian MMRCA; only Rafale and Typhoon made the cut, but of those two the IAF ranked Rafale higher than the Typhoon. The F-16 block 70 offered to India was much stronger than the Turkish F-16 but wasn't even shortlisted.

The Rafale has much better situational awareness, much better radar, and with Meteor, a missile with much larger NEZ. The EW capabilities is also much better. The Greek pilots are also very good. The Turkish F-16s will struggle. The major weak point of the Greek Rafale will be that they will be way too few.

France begins backfilling its Rafale fleet after selling some to Greece
29 Jan 2021 Christina Mackenzie

"PARIS – The French Air and Space Force will be getting 12 new Rafales to replace those being removed from its inventory to sell to Greece, Defense Minister Florence Parly said on Friday....

...While no price tag was given during Parly’s announcement, Trappier has previously said one fully equipped fighter costs around 100 million euros, or $121 million, which would put the total package at just under $1.5 billion.

Parly said the 12 new aircraft would be built to the latest F3R standard. She added, “We sold 18 Rafales to Greece so it is indeed 18 Rafales that Dassault will have to produce.” Speaking at the factory, the defense minister said one Rafale would come off the production line per month...

...The French Air and Space Force will have its 12 new aircraft by the end of 2025. Together with the 28 Rafales that Dassault is to deliver between 2022 and 2024, this will bring the total to 129, as projected in the 2019-2025 military program law.""

Source: https://www.defensenews.com/global/euro ... to-greece/