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F-35B internal carry

Unread postPosted: 20 Jan 2013, 13:55
by mcraptor
Can the F-35B carry the JSOW or any stand-off weapons internally, besides SDBs?

RE: F-35B internal carry

Unread postPosted: 20 Jan 2013, 13:56
by spazsinbad
Thanks.

Re: F-35B internal carry

Unread postPosted: 20 Jan 2013, 14:37
by stobiewan
mcraptor wrote:Can the F-35B carry the JSOW or any stand-off weapons internally, besides SDBs?


Not the B, no, JSOW's a tight fit internally in the A/C bay but B, she no feet senor. In UK use, Brimstone will likely be the primary hitter at distance, plus Paveway.

Re: F-35B internal carry

Unread postPosted: 20 Jan 2013, 15:25
by Conan
mcraptor wrote:Can the F-35B carry the JSOW or any stand-off weapons internally, besides SDBs?


JDAM-ER based on a Mk.82 or BLU-111 would likely fit.

http://www.aviationweek.com/Article.asp ... 490988.xml

RE: Re: F-35B internal carry

Unread postPosted: 20 Jan 2013, 15:48
by delvo
I started a thread where I addressed this by superimposing images of various weapons onto an image of an F-35 internal bay published by a company that's making at least one of the weapons for it:

http://f-16.net/f-16_forum_viewtopic-t- ... 6995d.html

My conclusion was that, although JSOW wouldn't fit B without modification (such as a shortening the tail and making the fins collapsible, or moving the attachment points for hanging it from an airplane's hardpoint 9-10 inches farther back), which presumably won't happen, the Joint Strike Missile will fit, based on the fact that the Naval Strike Missile it's based on already appears to and its makers wouldn't want to shoot themselves in the foot by modifying it so that it doesn't, thus cutting off sales to navies using F-35B. NSM/JSM is a surface-skimming cruise missile instead of a glide bomb like JSOW. F-35B can still carry JSOW; it just has to be external.

RE: Re: F-35B internal carry

Unread postPosted: 20 Jan 2013, 17:43
by SpudmanWP
[re:JSOW] Internal no, External yes

Image

RE: Re: F-35B internal carry

Unread postPosted: 20 Jan 2013, 19:48
by mcraptor
Damn lift fan.

RE: Re: F-35B internal carry

Unread postPosted: 20 Jan 2013, 20:17
by spazsinbad
Funny comment. LiftFan makes the F-35B extra special. No?

RE: Re: F-35B internal carry

Unread postPosted: 20 Jan 2013, 20:40
by SpudmanWP
Internal JSOW was not an initial F-35B requirement.

Post X-35B LM thought that it could meed the requirements with a 2k bay in the F-35B. Turned out, not so much... which led to SWAT and the return to the original 1k JDAM requirement.

RE: Re: F-35B internal carry

Unread postPosted: 21 Jan 2013, 02:56
by delvo
According to that image, B can't carry a 1000-pound Paveway internally. The reason JSOW doesn't fit is because of how far back the back is, but the back of a 1000-pound Paveway isn't nearly that far back. It's based on a standard 1000-pound bomb, with nothing making it any longer in the back but a long extra piece attached on the front, which extends farther forward than the front of other F-35 internal weapons. So the obstacle preventing it from fitting in B must be in front. But what would be in the front of B's bay that isn't there in A or C? The front limit of the bay has always seemed to be the air intake, but all three versions have the same air intakes. (If they didn't it would affect engine performance.) Then again, is the image even reliable on this? It's hosted on a PhotoBucket account and clearly has been altered from whatever its original official form was...

Re: RE: Re: F-35B internal carry

Unread postPosted: 21 Jan 2013, 03:04
by neptune
spazsinbad wrote:Funny comment. LiftFan makes the F-35B extra special. No?


Not so much, maybe. Given that most, if not a lot of Corp flight activities are about CAS. Not having a stealthy internal capacity for longer weapons would not be a hinderance, stick it out on a wing hardpoint. Not much need for stealth in CAS and not much need for long range weapons in a CAS mission.

Stealth ISR or initial attack may better benefit the "C" mission and if required, the Corp will fly their "C" to the mission requirement.

How many of these "won't fit" weapons fly on the Harrier? Please remember the "B" replaces the Harrier and the "C" replaces the Hornet and Prowler.

Corp tactics will be significantly different when the legacies are parked in the boneyard and the B and C are active on the flight decks. :lol:

Re: RE: Re: F-35B internal carry

Unread postPosted: 21 Jan 2013, 03:20
by SpudmanWP
delvo wrote:what would be in the front of B's bay that isn't there in A or C?
The Lift Fan bulge.

delvo wrote:Then again, is the image even reliable on this? It's hosted on a PhotoBucket account and clearly has been altered from whatever its original official form was...
The reason I hosted the image on Photobucket (you can tell it's mine due to the path name) is that I got it directly off a Program PDF or PPT.

The original PDF was from 2006 and is hosted on the JSF.mil site. The page in question is 41.

http://www.jsf.mil/downloads/documents/ ... ept_06.pdf

RE: Re: RE: Re: F-35B internal carry

Unread postPosted: 21 Jan 2013, 03:34
by count_to_10
Does the lift fan really change the shape of the bay? I thought it fit in the space that the B and C used for gas.
Not having a schematic in front of me, I can't really say, but is it possible that the ducts for the roll vents in the wing are what are limiting the B's payload?

RE: Re: RE: Re: F-35B internal carry

Unread postPosted: 21 Jan 2013, 03:37
by SpudmanWP
There must be some significant changes needed, likely structural.

For a clue, look at the side by side lineup of the bay arrangement for the A/C vs the B (from page 39 of the above PDF.

Notice how the two doors (A2A & A2G) for the B are the same length yet the A2G door is much longer on the A/C.

Also note the position of the 1k JDAM vs the 2k JDAM.

Image

Re: RE: Re: F-35B internal carry

Unread postPosted: 21 Jan 2013, 03:48
by count_to_10
SpudmanWP wrote:
delvo wrote:what would be in the front of B's bay that isn't there in A or C?
The Lift Fan bulge.

delvo wrote:Then again, is the image even reliable on this? It's hosted on a PhotoBucket account and clearly has been altered from whatever its original official form was...
The reason I hosted the image on Photobucket (you can tell it's mine due to the path name) is that I got it directly off a Program PDF or PPT.

The original PDF was from 2006 and is hosted on the JSF.mil site. The page in question is 41.

http://www.jsf.mil/downloads/documents/ ... ept_06.pdf

Okay, page 39: you can clearly see that the rear of the -B bay is cut short relative to the -A and -C by the roll control vents.

Edit: bah, you beat me to it. :D