Forum: Modern Military Aircraft

Scorpion82 wrote:

Thanks for the links WW. Though I thought about new RWR and internal jammer replacing the current kit AN/ALR-56C & AN/ALQ-135 rather than jamming functions of the radar or external jamming pods.

The way I read it, both would occur. They'd get the latest self protection systems, as well as EA functions for the radar, and pods for stand off jamming.
What was said though was that these jamming systems wouldn't be as extensive as an EA-18G.

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I found some information about the IRST pod. I find it odd that it is intended for use in a pod mounted on the front end of a fuel tank. I don't understand why it isn't just mounted under the nose similar to the F-14.

The "front of fuel tank" is how the F-18s are getting IRST, not the F-15s.

They are having them mounted on a pylon ala F-15K.

vs F-18 tank mounted IRST

Thanks for the pictures Spudman. However, when it comes to F-15s I was talking strictly about the F-15Cs, or Golden Eagles that would receive the IRST upgrade. Does the F-15C have the ability to mount an IRST sensor in a manner similar to the F-15K?

This FY2011 Budget Doc has it as a Pod/Pylon combo (ala F-15K).

http://www.dtic.mil/descriptivesum/Y201 ... B_2011.pdf

Quote:

Begin developing IRST pod, pylon and associated Group A hardware and wiring.

This Flightglobal article confirms the pod/pylon combo:

http://www.flightglobal.com/articles/20 ... f-15s.html

Quote:

Unlike the F/A-18's IRST pod, which is mounted at the front of a fuel tank, the F-15 version will feature a sleeker pod design mounted on its "Station 5" stores pylon, says Brad Jones, Boeing's F-15 radar modernisation programme manager. A similar pod has already been supplied for South Korea's F-15K fleet.

Sta 5 (centerline) IRST pod would apparently look like this, when not configured in an AEA jamming escort role (i.e., jamming pod on the centerline)

http://www.lockheedmartin.com/data/asse ... oto5_h.jpg

I'd contemplate the old FASTpack CFT come back for this upgrade though and as such, perhaps the IRST apertures (and forward looking multi-spectral warning - vision) could be flush-mounted in the CFT instead of centerline. The F-15 would gain it's 7-8k lb of extra gas (allowing to replace wing tanks w/ some other store if needed), the added EO SA sensors as described, plus leave the centerline Sta. 5 open for the AEA pod! Bam. Smile

Interesting also though, is the mention or possibilities of APG-82 equipping some Cs, instead of V3. Maybe the APG-82 equipped Cs would be the designated EA-jamming airframes for EA if the suggested RFTF tuning capability could enhance that role?

Given that any USAF'ized NGJ-lite pod which might finally materialize years down the road (after NGJ is IOC?) could be too much for USAF to balance on it's plate of priorities(?) near-term, maybe in the interim at least, DoD could study whether a stopgap AEA attack pod, say by Thales or someone, could be effective and able to be integrated as temp solution?

Come to think about it... maybe the optimal, 'specialized' Escort EW/EA and mini-AWACS supplement as outlined to reinforce the reduced F-22s, would be the upgraded F-15E outright? (i.e. APG-82, already operational fuselage IRST (being delivered to USAF) and most importantly, the two-seats!)?

I'm not saying that a single seat C Goldens w/ APG-V3 and centerline IRST pod (passive eyes for F-22) couldn't be a good F-22 teammate in tactical situations, but when actual escort AEA jamming is required, perhaps the upgraded F-15E+ could be the superior platform?

discofishing wrote:

I found some information about the IRST pod. I find it odd that it is intended for use in a pod mounted on the front end of a fuel tank. I don't understand why it isn't just mounted under the nose similar to the F-14.

That's only on the F-18. The F-15's pod won't be mounted in that fashion.

geogen wrote:

Come to think about it... maybe the optimal, 'specialized' Escort EW/EA and mini-AWACS supplement as outlined to reinforce the reduced F-22s, would be the upgraded F-15E outright? (i.e. APG-82, already operational fuselage IRST (being delivered to USAF) and most importantly, the two-seats!)?

I'm not saying that a single seat C Goldens w/ APG-V3 and centerline IRST pod (passive eyes for F-22) couldn't be a good F-22 teammate in tactical situations, but when actual escort AEA jamming is required, perhaps the upgraded F-15E+ could be the superior platform?

But then you're taking valuable strike assets, and diverting them to A2A. Using the Cs allows you to have your strike force unencumbered with secondary tasks.

What ever happened to the D varient of the F-15?
(Regarding using F-15E's instead of C's as they have two seats)

Fair point, Shep, yes I'd conjecture that the D if equipped with the APG-82, would be better for the role than C. But I don't think there is an absolute need for say 150 designated F-15D/E jamming platforms for such a small fleet of F-22s either, which is why I wouldn't see a problem with some E's being certified in jamming and strike-fighter/fighter escort roles.

Perhaps 30-40 airframes could specialize in this hypothetical EW/EA role (with other V3 Cs supplementing EW/package as raw escort)? In that case, whichever mix of hand picked and properly equipped D mods capable of this specialized upgrade should do the same job as part of a D/E EW mix imo (the stand-alone E having the fuselage IRST pod as well as jamming pod in such a role + greater fuel load/range to boot). Just my views.

Why do they need a specialized jammer when the joint services will send them Growlers when they need them?

Quick question, if the APG-82 and other such AESA radars are more than capable of doing air-to-air and air-to-mud at the same time then couldn't the front seater of a two place eagle track and engage aerial threats while the back seater locks up ground targets using SAR and plans approach vectors/release standoff weapons? It seems to me that AESA radars would more require the second seater to fully utilize its dual role capability. Sorry if my post is worded funny, I just woke up and the coffee hasnt kicked in yet.

Quote:

That's only on the F-18. The F-15's pod won't be mounted in that fashion.

Which F-15s are you talking about? The C/D models or the E model? As shown on the F-15K, I'd assume the USAF would install IRST on their Strike Eagles in a similar manner as the ROKAF did on their Slam Eagles. I'm mainly concerned with the F-15C/D birds. I think the pod idea isn't a great one. The IRST sensor should be integrated somewhere else perhaps under the nose (F-4/F-14), above the nose (Flanker/Fulcrum style) or wing root (like the F-4E's EO sensor).

As the FY2011 docs and the article I linked to show, the F-15C/D is due to get a pylon/pod setup like the F-15K.

Forum: Modern Military Aircraft

Golden Eagle Question