Forum: Technology

http://www.air-attack.com/news/article/3962/Russia-could-start-5th-generation-fighter-tests-by-yearend.html

Is very interesting to note what reported on the end of the article. If it isn't an error, the new jet will be armed with TWO 30 mm gun...
Is like to say "you will not hit me and i probably will not hit you (with missiles).."
If the design will feature exreme maneuverability, that would be anhoter confirmation ...

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Yeah, too bad about the MiG 1.42/1.44 program. It used to be cool to see a new MiG up in the skies, but it has been so long now. Nice to hear that the S-37 Berkut isn't a totally dead issue as well(if that rumor was true, that is). If those ever get produced as an Su-47 eventually it surely will not be the same aircraft as before. That being said, what will 2010 have in store for the Pak-Fa program? Will we actually see what it really looks like and will it ever get off the ground?

But TWO 30mm cannons possibly on it- that I MUST see and I want two models of it as well!!! Cool

PAK-FA is after first tests on the KnAAPO airfield. (Interfax confirmes two taxi trial runs).

http://lenta.ru/news/2009/12/24/pakfa/

And a google translation:

Quote:

Russia a promising fifth-generation fighter - a promising frontline aviation aircraft complex (PAK FA) - the first jogging at the airfield of Komsomolsk-on-Amur Aircraft Production Association (KnAAPO). It is reported by Interfax, citing a source in the aviation industry. When it was held rollout of the aircraft and began his test was not specified.
After the rollout pilot started the engines and the plane started moving on the runway. During jogging PAK FA several times carried inhibition. Results produced two jogging. During the test was observed only employees KnAAPO. As expected the end of 2009 PAK FA will do some jogging, and in January 2010 made its first flight.
Officially, Russia's specifications prospective fighters were not reported. Presumably, PAK FA will be able to reach speeds of up to 2,1 thousand kilometers per hour. Range aircraft will be 5.5 thousand kilometers. Armament plane can be represented by 30-millimeter cannon. PAK FA will have 16 points of suspension, including eight located inside the fuselage.

exec wrote:

PAK-FA is after first tests on the KnAAPO airfield. (Interfax confirmes two taxi trial runs).

Sorry, I just about fell on the floor laughing. First flight has been promised (and delayed) since 2007, and now the Russian fanboys are excited because they have an airframe making taxi runs. Even assuming that they get the fly-by-wire software up and running and allow this thing to fly, it will still be an empty shell with ballast - no on-board systems that are even remotely production ready. If the Russians really want to devote some resources to this (given that their first AESA radar reportedly entered bench tests in 2008), they might have a production ready fighter in . . . 2018? Let's see, how many F-35 fighters will the US have produced by then?

Meanwhile the Russian Air Force intends to cut its aircrew numbers by 40% over the next several years - closer to the levels that they can afford to support.
http://www.aviationweek.com/aw/generic/ ... s%20Tumble

Scorpion82 wrote:

They actually do use an existing engine the AL-41F1S aka article 117S. This engine flys aboard the Su-35 and it will power the T-50 prototype as well. The problems are related to the AL-41F1 which is an all new engine, while the AL-41F1S is a development of the AL-31F.

The engine is going to remain an achilles heel for this airplane for a long time to come. As some of us know, it takes longer to develop a new technology engine than it does to develop the airframe. The US spent a decade of investment to grow the F119 to the F135. The Russians have invested nothing of the sort, and no amount of wishful thinking is going to change that today.

Both NPO Saturn and MMPP Salyut have reportedly been contracted to develop production engines for the PAK-FA. Both are developing derivatives of the AL-31F, using the same core with a new low spool. If NPO Saturn wins the ultimate production tendor, they are fully expected to relabel the resulting engine as the AL-41F.
http://www.flightglobal.com/articles/20 ... ntest.html

They can put whatever label on in they like, but inserting an old technology core into a new airframe is not going to get you performance that even approaches that of the Raptor. It would be equivalent to inserting an evolved F100 or F110 into the F-22 and expecting it to perform the same mission.

The Russians have a cash flow problem. Part of it was the collapse of the old Soviet economy. A larger part is the internal inefficiency and corruption that keeps them from identifying the programs that they really want and supplying a steady stream of funding for development and production. Given the current situation, I am still far more leary of the long term implications of China's military growth than I am of whatever pipe dream the Russians have. China has the kind of resources that the Russians lack, together with a string of unsettled territorial disputes with its neighbors. Yes, the US needs to be prepared for all possibilities. But over the next twenty years the Far East threat scenarios are far more alarming than anything that the Russian propaganda machine has put out the door.

I was in awe the first time I seen this video on Discovery (or similar) back in '93

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rk-FMT0z ... xt_from=PL

The Russians put some good jets together ... and I don't think anyone else is "WAY" ahead!
Woops ... Fat Finger ... try this;

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G912xcWKF3U&NR=1

hi, ill post some photoshop, but guys from KNAAPO and Sukhoi said that this model looks almost like real one.
First flight claymed to be in first part of jan.

As for me, i think F-35 will be in mass production in like 2016-2018, PAK-FA will be in production in 2018 year, and it defenitly 5th gen.
so even it wont be better than F-22, i dont think it will be shame to be ONLY SECOND in the world. come [Link pending approval]

Just because it is completed in the '5th generation' era, doesn't mean it will have 5th generation capabilities if you catch my drift.

darkvarkguy wrote:

Just because it is completed in the '5th generation' era, doesn't mean it will have 5th generation capabilities if you catch my drift.

I'd have to agree with that. I don't think the PAK-FA will have anything comparable to the Raptors AN/ALR-94 and overall sensor fusion. I think it may match its speed and agility at lower altitude regimes but question if it'll match it at higher alts. Besides it's probably a safe bet to say its at least a decade away from being mature and production rates in Russia being so absymal at the moment doesn't seem to promising for the future of the PAK-FA with in my mind many many less than 187 being put into service in its lifetime.

inf1kek, What do you consider "mass production"?

In 2012, JSF production will be > 100, 2013 will be > 125, 2014 will be almost 200, 2015 will be > 225, etc, etc.

VarkVet wrote:

I was in awe the first time I seen this video on Discovery (or similar) back in '93

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Rk-FMT0z ... xt_from=PL

The Russians put some good jets together ... and I don't think anyone else is "WAY" ahead!
Woops ... Fat Finger ... try this;

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G912xcWKF3U&NR=1

In theory at least. As the Indians and many other of their clients will tell you, quality control is suspect to say the least these days.

India, Russia close to PACT on next generation fighter

http://www.business-standard.com/india/ ... er/381718/

Quote:

Sukhoi’s FGFA prototype, which is expected to make its first flight within weeks, is a true stealth aircraft, almost invisible to enemy radar. According to a defence ministry official, “It is an amazing looking aircraft. It has a Radar Cross Section (RCS) of just 0.5 square metre as compared to the Su-30MKI’s RCS of about 20 square metres.”

O.5 square metre RCS? What a collossal failure if true and hardly a true stealth aircraft as it's not even in the 30 year old F-117 catagory!
It's good this report from the Indians as they undoubtably provide a more honest assesment of the RCS of the jet than the Russian government/Sukhoi would. Infact India should be about the only honest source on this jet in my mind based on my experience with Russian weapons propaganda.

Oh and 20 metre square RCS for the SU-30, wow! So much for the 1.5 /2 square metre many fanboys quote for it. Reality, isn't it a bitch!

Its their first attempt and the first stealth aircraft designed by anyone other than the united states.

bjr1028 wrote:

Its their first attempt and the first stealth aircraft designed by anyone other than the united states.

Oh I fully realise that but it still doesn't change my opinion on the matter. 0.5m2 is really rather poor for something said to be specifically designed to be a "stealth fighter."

Lol, that was totaly fake.

first - there was NO indians on first roll-out to the airport.
and COME ON, just read it - "That means that while a Su-30MKI would be as visible to enemy radar as a metal object 5 metres X 4 metres in [Link pending approval];
ahhahahaha, metal object 5x4 meters? = 20m2 RCS ? lol? did he even know what RCS means?

Forum: Technology

Sukhoi T-50 PAK-FA