Forum: Program and politics

TenguNoHi wrote:

Quote:

In my opinion, 1700 JSF's is just too much, especially since not every mission would need to be accomplished with stealth.

500-600 would be good... Legacy A/C and UAVs could fill in the gap. I also think F-22 production should be increased back to 370-400.

-Aaron

Personally I think the US Air Force would do well with 1200 JSFs, 900-950 F-35A CTOLs and 250-300 F-35B STOVLs for force sustainment and capability. With this, I believe the F/A-22 Raptor numbers should be reinstated back to the 381 number.

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Guysmiley wrote:

elp wrote:

DOD: Hill Cut Would Delay JSF Fielding Up To A Year

What are "long-lead items"?

long lead time.. as in items (parts) that must be ordered a long time in advance in order to meet scheduled delivery.

Scorpion1alpha wrote:

TenguNoHi wrote:

Quote:

In my opinion, 1700 JSF's is just too much, especially since not every mission would need to be accomplished with stealth.

500-600 would be good... Legacy A/C and UAVs could fill in the gap. I also think F-22 production should be increased back to 370-400.

-Aaron

Personally I think the US Air Force would do well with 1200 JSFs, 900-950 F-35A CTOLs and 250-300 F-35B STOVLs for force sustainment and capability. With this, I believe the F/A-22 Raptor numbers should be reinstated back to the 381 number.

Do that and we will have to park half of the airlift, tankers and other airframes to pay for it. Laughing

Personally I think we could kick everyones A$$ with F-16's, F-15's and A-10's. Build some new Vipers and Eagles, put MATV GE 132's in them, upgrade the avionics and game over. But that's just my opinion.

Hey Happy... last night the communist channel ( PBS Laughing

) had an old "Frontline" documentary on that took place back in 2000-1 time frame showing inside company views ( of both Boeing Phantom Works and LM Skunk Works ) on all the events leading up to the JSF competition ( Boeing vs. LM )... it was very interesting stuff.

"PBS, The communist channel," love it, that is funny sh!t I swear and no sarcasm intended.
It's called battle of the X-planes, I think that's the show you’re talking about, great show, they sell the DVD at the LM Rec. center here,
I just TIVO'd it and got it for free like everyone else, why pay for it? I'll bet Boeing doesn't even give it away.
Anyway I wasn't on JSF at the time but I have met a lot of people in that video who are now in F/W on this program.
Funny and quick story, I was working as an F-16 Crew Chief/Mechanical Systems Instructor for LM last year and was teaching a lot of familiarization classes. One particular class I had two X-35 Crew Chiefs from Palmdale. I always talked about (what little I knew at the time) and showed a video of the X-35 being flown from Palmdale to Edwards AFB. Well I look and the guy launching the jet is sitting in the classroom, so of course I said "Hey, is that you" and he said yeah, it is. Then the guy recovering the jet at Edwards is also sitting in the class next to the guy who launched it, I said once again, "Hey, is that you, WTFO?
That is a true story and if I'm lying I'm dying, to this day I don't know why they came to F/W from Palmdale for an F-16 FAM, but they did and that is no BS. Hell I couldn't even make that up, LOL.
I should probably know this as long as I've been on this site, what do you do elp?

I recognized a USAF colonel in that video that I had seen before.

I have had a job for years that allows me to see how just about everything on a USAF base runs, for every neat thing that I have seen that has to do with the flightline, I see 20 things that are the other part of the USAF ( want all kinds of useless trivia on how a USAF CE squadron runs? Laughing

or how about the Security Forces or OSI ?.... or logistics? (LRS) or ( pick any other unit on a base the common public doesn't hear about.... I could even give key note speeches at NCO leadership school or the academy or SOS.... ( I have seen way too much chicken cordon bleu ( most popular item you see on the menu at those events ) I probably have as many hours at those events alone as Gums has flying hours. Surprised

I am a photographer in the USAF. (civilian ) used to be military ( at a bunch of different places ).. nice thing about my job is it can be copy/pasted anywhere in the DOD ( or Fed gov for that matter ). It is a great job and is more fun anytime I get to support aircrew or maintainers. After you do this a while, you have the advantage of being able to start a converstion with just about any AFSC you run into on ( pick an issue ). Makes taking pictures easier when you know how the whole roulette table runs.

On an LM note. LM needs to get their gift shop to go online. In order to get any cool stuff ( which they have lots of ) you have to go to the employee gift shop on the other side of Ft Worth which really stinks ( as I haven't been to Ft Worth in a few years ).

A "long-lead" item is something that takes a long time to procure. For example, you order a "widget" today, so the vendor has time to make it, and in turn you have it in 12 months time to install into the aicraft.

I'm sure someone can do better at explaining.

Last edited by Scorpion1alpha on Oct 28, 2005 - 03:38 AM; edited 1 time in total

elp wrote:

Scorpion1alpha wrote:

TenguNoHi wrote:

Quote:

In my opinion, 1700 JSF's is just too much, especially since not every mission would need to be accomplished with stealth.

500-600 would be good... Legacy A/C and UAVs could fill in the gap. I also think F-22 production should be increased back to 370-400.

-Aaron

Personally I think the US Air Force would do well with 1200 JSFs, 900-950 F-35A CTOLs and 250-300 F-35B STOVLs for force sustainment and capability. With this, I believe the F/A-22 Raptor numbers should be reinstated back to the 381 number.

Do that and we will have to park half of the airlift, tankers and other airframes to pay for it. Laughing

I'd figure if the USAF don't do that (or something similar), they will incur other problems. Obviously, there isn't an easy answer given the current situation. I strongly believe that acquiring as much F-35s is more important than acquiring more "advanced" or "supped-up" F-16s if the Viper is the alternative. And no matter what, acquiring the 381 F/A-22s that the Air Force has insisted that they need is the TOP priority.

but it's already going, and I'm bad about keeping it going...

Quote:

Personally I think we could kick everyones A$$ with F-16's, F-15's and A-10's. Build some new Vipers and Eagles, put MATV GE 132's in them, upgrade the avionics and game over. But that's just my opinion.

And how much would those new Vipers and Eagles cost???? Not a whole lot less than what the fly-away (R+D not included) cost of the F-22 or JSF would be, for a HUGE decrease in capability.

I agree with ELP that a 1000 F-35's should be the target and we should go back to the 350+ f/a-22 figure,it is just a better fighter...However i still think that the JSF no.s could be further trimmed by a few hundered airframes and the saved money can be used to develop modern weaponry as well as networks..Given a chocie b/w say the E-10 development or say 50 JSF's i'd go with the former.

the upper wing skin just now went down for the final time on A-1, things are moving right along.

hjgil510jjr wrote:

Has the F-35 started production yet?

Hugh Gilmartin

Prototypes DO exist and have already been tested. The first one built on the assembly line in Fort Worth (Where they will be built) will roll from the line early next year (2006).

Red6

Forum: Program and politics

F-35 production started?