LWF Competition Designs

Military aircraft - Post cold war aircraft, including for example B-2, Gripen, F-18E/F Super Hornet, Rafale, and Typhoon.
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by TenguNoHi » 18 Apr 2005, 12:01

Does anyone have any drawings of the other single engine LWF competition designs aside the YF-16? Especially Boeings design?! Help is greatly appreciated and thanks ahead of time :)

-Aaron


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by Taco44 » 18 Apr 2005, 22:29

TenquNoHi,

The other fighter for the LWF competition was the McDonnell Douglas/Northrop/Boeing YF-17. The YF-17 grew some larger landing gear and became the F/A-18 bought by the Navy. As far as I know, there was no other single fighter design.

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by TenguNoHi » 19 Apr 2005, 04:47

FAS.org wrote:Industry recognized, correctly, that regardless of USAF hostility, LWF variants had great potential for profitable foreign military sales, including replacing the F-104. Single-engine designs were put forward by Boeing, General Dynamics, LTV, Northrop, and Rockwell. Northrop also proposed on a twin-engine design, in effect using Air Force money to develop a replacement for its F-5 export fighter.

The Boeing and General Dynamics designs were the clear leaders from the beginning, with the Northrop twin-engine design clearly the weakest of the six.

Source: FAS.org


That right up definitely implies there were 4 other fighter designs that never saw it past the drawing table... I was just wondering if those drawings ever got anywhere but the trash can after they were rejected... Anyone know?

-Aaron


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by Taco44 » 20 Apr 2005, 04:01

Thanks for the info. I don't know if anything progressed from the other designs.
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by Pat1 » 21 Apr 2005, 00:04

LTVs design was probably based on the super crusader XF8U-3. Was an impresive aircraft...
Also, wasn't the F-20 a contender in the early stages?


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by TenguNoHi » 21 Apr 2005, 00:47

Pat1, I wouldnt doubt the F-20, or at least an advanced F-5 air frame was a contender... I know in the early 90s the F-20 competed with the F-16 for some contract but I forget what. While the F-20 performed better the fact that the F-16 was already in major production nabbed the contract as a cost effective choice.

With the ammount of available art on losing JSF designs I thought that maybe a good ammount of LSF designs would be available too. Guess not =/

-Aaron


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by Pat1 » 21 Apr 2005, 05:04

Thanks for the info Aaron :)
Google some XF8U-3 images, you won't be disappointed!


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by TC » 21 Apr 2005, 06:36

The F-20 Tigershark, built in 1982 (some 7 years after the USAF LWF competition) was a competitor for a low cost, lightweight strike fighter, and aimed primarily toward an FMS contract. We briefly played with the idea of the Tigershark as an agressor for TOPGUN and Red Flag.

However, the F-16N was built and killed all of that. The Navy decided to go with the N model Viper, and without TOPGUN on board, the AF said "Thanks, but no thanks."

When Reagan said that our foreign friends did not have to buy a reduced-performance variant of the Viper (read that, F-16/79) they went with the P&W F100 powered Viper, over the smaller-engined F-20 (GE F404). The thought being that if the Americans are flying it, then they would readily have the parts and support that they needed to sustain Viper ops.

The F-20, built by Northrop was on shakier ground. Northrop was involved in litigation at the time. Plus, the Americans already stated they would not be operating the Tigershark, so the Viper was a much more attractive option.

Two destroyed aircraft, and several cancelled orders later, the F-20 program was cancelled in 1986 with little fanfare. Northrop remained out of the fighter biz until they merged with Grumman, thus picking up the F-14 program.

Beers and MiGs were made to be pounded!


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by TenguNoHi » 21 Apr 2005, 07:43

damn shame...

I always thought the F-20 was an attractive air craft. (not that the vipers not, but you always want more of what you can get, right :p ?)

TC, I may be wrong but wasn't the T-38 built off either the F-5 or the F-20?

-Aaron


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by Habu » 21 Apr 2005, 08:42

Actually, it's the other way around, the F-5 was built from the T-38 platform. The T-38 flew first, and the fighter design came from that.
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by esnss » 21 Apr 2005, 09:42

TenguNoHi, i have a picture of Boeings design for the LWF Competition pretty sure this is what your looking for
Attachments
LWF-Boeing-Model-908.jpg
LWF-Boeing-Model-908b.jpg


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by TenguNoHi » 21 Apr 2005, 23:20

Thats pretty friggin sweet! Whered you find that at Esnss?

Btw, does anyone else think those nose on that baby looks absolutely menacing! I like it :) The back end reminds me of an early model mig though :(

-Aaron


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by TC » 22 Apr 2005, 00:15

So that was Boeing's design, eh?

Doesn't it "suspiciously" kinda-sorta remind of of something a little more familiar?? Hmmm?? Think hard now! :wink:

Looks like a little inter-contractor espionage or intrigue going on. Or am I going a little too "Oliver Stone" on everybody? :P

Oh yeah, T-38 is a couple decades older than the Tigershark (1958 I think?). Then came the F-5A Freedom Fighter, then the F-5E Tiger II (Navy's Grumman F11F was the other Tiger). Those F-5s were both built in the '60s.

The F-20 Tigershark didn't come around until '82. The Tigershark got its name because of its older brother, the Tiger. Hope that helps.

Beers and MiGs were made to be pounded!


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by Taco44 » 22 Apr 2005, 02:55

Boy....seeing Boeing's design makes me glad they picked the 16. That thing's ugly! Looks like an erector set pieced together from different planes.
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by TenguNoHi » 22 Apr 2005, 03:04

I must be the only one that likes it ! :lol:

You guys just dont know beauty when you see it :)

-Aaron


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