Forum: General F-22A Raptor forum

http://ctrambler.wordpress.com/2007/02/ ... ens-today/
February 28, 2007
If Pearl Harbour bombing happens today
Filed under: Uncategorized — ctrambler @ 2:41 pm

Imaging the Japanese bombing of Pearl Harbour happening not in WW2 but six months ago. After the bombing, American sends their most advance fighters, F22 Raptor, to pursue the bombers. What happens next? All F22 falls into the sea as soon as it cross the International Date Line.

Impossible? Nope, it happened. Yes, I dramatized the event by saying Pearl Harbour was bombed, and that the F22s drop into the sea. However, the theory is solid. According to reports, F22s on their way to Japan from Hawaii did indeed suffer catastrophic navigation lost when they cross the International Date Line.

“Every time we fly this jet we learn something new,” Raptor squadron commanding officer Lt-Col Wade Tolliver said.

Indeed.
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i got this after browsing for a little bit and my questions are:
Is this an ''Achilles heel'' so to speak?
Will this hinder long distance flights?
is this exaggerated raptor-hater bull****?
Will this be used against the already besieged efforts to buy more F-22s?

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The Dateline incident was a one-time thing, and they weren't "Lost at Sea". They simply followed the KC-10 that was dragging them, and received vectors from ATC. It really wasn't as big a deal as the media hyped it up to be.

They fixed it. It was a problem with the software in the navigation system. It was probably related to the time switchover or just switching longitude values (going from 179.9999999 west to 179.9999999 east). Not hard to fix once you know it's there.

Needless to say, LM tested the F-35 system a little better...

Actually the software was built pre-Y2K, LMCo had a patch on it's way immediately. Just one of those things that 'enginerds' forget about..... LMAO

The F-22 program is in a holding pattern until the world's first fifth generation fighter is completed.

Once that technology is completed, it will be ported to the F-22s.

The F-22 has already benefited from the stealth coatings developed for the F-35 and will need the F-35 software (and CPUs) in order to fully use the IR sensors built into the F-22 airframe.

hcobb wrote:

The F-22 program is in a holding pattern until the world's first fifth generation fighter is completed.

Ummmm, the F-22 IS the worlds first fifth generation fighter. It was designed to be more of a fighter than the F-35. The Raptor was designed as an air superiority machine whereas the F-35 was designed as a fighter/bomber with air to air undertones. It is not in any kind of holding pattern. It has been decided that 187 airframes will be built and that is final. The only way to change that is with a new administration and SecDef. I don't understand your statement. Also, the IR sensors on the Raptor are already being used to their full capability. They don't need any help from the F-35 program to be "more" operational.[/i]

Here's the links for those who haven't kept up with the facts on the F-22 hanging around for the JSF program to provide the critical bits needed to become fully operational.

http://www.airforcetimes.com/news/2011/ ... s-040611w/
http://www.flightglobal.com/blogs/the-d ... g-the.html

hcobb wrote:

Here's the links for those who haven't kept up with the facts on the F-22 hanging around for the JSF program to provide the critical bits needed to become fully operational.

http://www.airforcetimes.com/news/2011/ ... s-040611w/
http://www.flightglobal.com/blogs/the-d ... g-the.html

Those links still don't support your premise, as stated. Benefits of shared technology are one thing, but that hardly means that the F-22 is in a holding pattern, waiting for the world's first Fifth Generation fighter(seeing as how the F-22 holds that title).

The Raptor has been fully operational since 2005. Like wrightwing said, those articles have nothing to do with your claims. They simply bring to light the possibility of integrating F-35 sensors into the F-22 for a commonality and cost savings option. The Raptors sensor suite was designed in the 80's and 90's. The F-35's sensors are 10-15 years ahead. Of course there's going to be some difference. Integrating F-35 sensors into the F-22 would be massively expensive and require an enormous amount of maintenance. With all the crap going on in this country right now, I think we could use that money in far better places than "F-35ing" the Raptor. Some of the F-35s sensors were also designed with the notion that it would be more of a fight/attack airplane, making it's design much different than the air superiority role the Raptor was intended for. Again, the Raptor WAS and IS the worlds first stealth fighter. The F-35 in no way can claim that title.

Thanks

The F-22 is not combat capable.

The only way a F-22 pilot can find a ground target is to look out the windscreen, because he doesn't have SAR or FLIR.

The only platform a F-22 can send data to is another F-22.

The software for the F-22 is not complete and will not be completed. Instead, once America has a fifth generation jet fighter, the CPUs on the F-22 will be replaced so it can run the software developed for a different aircraft.

So the final score is:
F-35: Base JSF.
F-22: Twin-engined JSF. (Perhaps call the refitted aircraft F-22B instead of F-22A.)
NGB: Twin or quad engined subsonic JSF.

There is only one real fifth generation jet fighter program in the world and it is not complete. Someday the Russians and Chinese will notice this. Hopefully it will be AFTER the "Baby Seals" have eaten their lunches.

Dude you are so far off I don't even really want to get into this argument. I fix this thing every day for a living and I can tell you with the utmost certainty that it is completely combat capable (and like I said before, has been fully operationally capable since 2005). If it wasn't, why would we send it on TSPs to Guam and Japan? Do you have any idea what is involved in the certification to send an airframe on a deployment like that? I'm gonna go with, no, you haven't got a clue. We regularly load JDAMS and drop them on ground targets with SDB integration coming soon. The statement you made about the pilot looking out of the canopy is just stupid and way off track. What you still fail to realize is the two jets were designed for two different roles. The Raptor (as I've ALREADY said) was designed from jump street as an air superiority FIGHTER and that will be its primary role until it is in the bone yard. The F-35, on the other hand, was designed with a primary mission of attacking ground targets with air to air under tones. The Raptor will NEVER be able to drop bombs like an F-35, and an F-35 will NEVER be able to do what a Raptor does (turn and burn and wipe out air targets).....FAIL

F-22s can send data to a hell of a lot more airplanes than just another F-22, that is another media lie....FAIL

The software on every airplane in the Air Force inventory is not complete. OFP updates are done routinely through out the entire fighter/bomber/tanker/trainer inventory. This is NOT F-22 specific and the F-35 will be the same, it will get software updates routinely throughout its life span. It is not "special" in this case....FAIL

The Russians and Chinese have nothing to combat a Raptor. They have no 5th gen airplanes (some in development, but lack of funding and stealth knowledge will keep them years away from production) and their RADAR cannot see the Raptor as is, with its own stealth coatings, let alone the new F-35 coatings.....again FAIL

I'm beginning to think that you're a troll and are just fishing for info so I will not post about this anymore.

How to shoot down a Raptor:

A: Keep your radio and non-AESA radars off.
B: Spot the Raptor on IRST.
C: Close in keeping outside the narrow 120 degree wide cone in front of the Raptor.
D: Park off his six and shoot him down with your cannon.

This will not work against an aircraft that has SAIRST, like say the F-35.

hcobb wrote:

How to shoot down a Raptor:

A: Keep your radio and non-AESA radars off.
B: Spot the Raptor on IRST.
C: Close in keeping outside the narrow 120 degree wide cone in front of the Raptor.
D: Park off his six and shoot him down with your cannon.

This will not work against an aircraft that has SAIRST, like say the F-35.

Now this just seems a little far fetched, 120 degrees is nearly full frontal vision, If you find yourself in front of a Raptor(or a flight of Raptors which would maximize their radar coverage) would be EXTREMELY difficult with the short range of an IRST, even worse if there is bad weather, you are blinded. Even with a simplified version of the F-22s Avionics, it would be difficult to even get within range of IRST. Combine with AWACS, friendly aircraft datalinks, there is no way you can get near a Raptor without anybody knowing.

Ok, I said I wasn't going to respond anymore, but this is just to good. You've lost your mind man. If it were only just that easy. Never mind AWACS, F-16s, F-15s, NAVY, Marines, and what ever other US/NATO airplanes and/or ground stations are out there with active RADAR. That hostile aircraft would be spotted before it ever had a chance to even think about getting close enough for a gun kill. Oh yea, and there's thrust vectoring the Raptor would literally turn circles around the hostile jet. It's called tactics NEWB. That situation would never, EVER happen. If it's so easy then why can't any of our jets do it against a Raptor even when it's 12 on 2 in mock combat where the Raptor is actually severely penalized and limited by fake ROEs? But, you're right, that's all the ruskies and chinese have to do. You should write to them and let them in on your awesome tactics.

Forum: General F-22A Raptor forum

A case for more F-22s