Forum: Modern Military Aircraft

Sorry but that's nonsense. These contracts include complete aircraft including engines and avionics. Weapons integration is a separate issue yes, as are the development and retrofit costs for the change proposals 193 & 210.
You may also check out the DODs programm acquisition costs per airframe document from May 2009.
http://comptroller.defense.gov/defbudge ... eapons.pdf

Page 3-21:
F-22 Procurement costs
2008: 3.79 bln $ for 20 F-22 (189 mln $)
2009: 4.3455 bln $ for 24 F-22 (181 mln $)

In other words a fair bit away from the 140 mln $ figure.

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Scorpion82 wrote:

Sorry but that's nonsense. These contracts include complete aircraft including engines and avionics. Weapons integration is a separate issue yes, as are the development and retrofit costs for the change proposals 193 & 210.
You may also check out the DODs programm acquisition costs per airframe document from May 2009.
http://comptroller.defense.gov/defbudge ... eapons.pdf

Page 3-21:
F-22 Procurement costs
2008: 3.79 bln $ for 20 F-22 (189 mln $)
2009: 4.3455 bln $ for 24 F-22 (181 mln $)

In other words a fair bit away from the 140 mln $ figure.

You need to compare like with like. Tiffie T1 and T2 NAO price was in 2006-2007 timef rame. Clearly prices change over time. The only fair way to give comparison then is to give a price for those years. The 2007 USAF budget had a flyaway cost of 140 or so million.

IF you want to continue to split hairs, the 2009 procurement cost is actually 4.057 bln for 24. T3 of Tiffie again without the AESA is going to be so high the UK MOD has classified it.

That said we are splitting hairs. The fact is the F-22 is far more capable a jet and if it was built in numbers anywhere near Typhoon its cost would be far less. The problem with Typhoon is you get F-22 like price with F-15 like effectiveness.

Well the price changes with upgrades etc. that's just natural and more part of the through life cost not the procurement cost of the aircraft. Feel free to dig up viable sources suggesting that the tranche contracts doesn't include avionics or engines as you suggest.
If we exeggerate and simplify then your conclusion is right. But it's not that easy.

I read in Defense Industry Daily, that in 2015 the RAF plans to furlough/retire one third of the Typhoon fleet... budget cuts!
Some people are so myopic it isn't funny. There is no threat now, so the RAF doesn't need the Typhoon? When the threat is spotted, will there be any time to design and build new weapons, hell no!! All of this while Russia is talking about making 1,000 T-50s!
In July of 1990, there appeared to be no threat to justify America's defense spending, the Cold War was over. On August 02, 1990... Iraq invaded Kuwait. In December of 1990, the F-117 was a classic example of wasteful Pentagon spending. On January 17, 1991 the F-117 was a great example of superior American technology! The "myopic wonders" were silent!!

The aircraft won't be retired as such, they will be moutballed and rotated in and out of service to spread FH over a larger number of airframes. The RAF originally planned to support an active fleet of 137 Typhoons with 232 airframes. They are now planning with an active fleet of 123 aircraft with 160 aircraft. The official excuse is that the attrition rates are much lower than expected and that this number is subsequently sufficient.

What they really needed was a Jaguar replacement for the types of wars that are fought now. Since the UK doesn't seem to happy with F-35 I would draw the conclusion the Brits should have gone with Rafale, a better bomb truck that can fly from a carrier. 20/20 hindsight.

Suggestions from single individuals don't mean much at all. The UK hasn't withdrawn from the JSF and I simply don't think they'll go for the SH. Afterwards wisdome doesn't help much, the Rafale is definitely the better striker, but the main problem for the Typhoon now is numbers both for aircraft and trained pilots. In theory the RAF is ready to go to Afghanistan or somewhere else and employ the Typhoon in the CAS role, they just haven't enough personal and aircraft to do so now.

Forum: Modern Military Aircraft

EF Typhoon Article