Forum: Off-topic

Straight to the point. Do you believe in UFO?

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Why not?

TEG

If you have even the slightest idea about probabilities, you HAVE TO agree that there's NO WAY we are the ONLY civilization in the entire universe. That being said, I think that the majority of UFO sightings are just that, 'unidentified' things that have some terrestrial explanation. I think an advanced civilization will have the means to come and go without being detected as readily as simply 'unexplained lights' in the sky.

I am making a bold assumption that our technology is still way primitive to detect these. There are far too many unknown in our world we've yet to figure out.

Occasionally, I look over my shoulders to the skeptics, it's interesting to see how some of them try to "manufacture" phenomenons for demonstration. Being able to reproduce something does not necessarily mean it doesn't exists.

Forum Veteran Joined: Dec 15, 2006 - 12:28 AM Posts: 760

ed.r.lee wrote:

Straight to the point. Do you believe in UFO?

Of course I believe in UFOs. UFOs simply means unidentified flying object.

However you seem to be much like the typical layman that seems to think that UFO means/implies extraterrestrial spacecraft technology and/or extraterrestrial intelligent life forms. (which would not be accurate)

I believe in the Drake equation. I think in all probability there is life out there and there may even be primitive life in our solar system. However I think it’s very unlikely that we will be or have been visited by extraterrestrial spacecraft technology and/or intelligent extraterrestrial life forms.

The closest idea to a ‘spacecraft’ that might bring (have brought) extraterrestrial life to earth is perhaps a comet or meteor may have seeded or re-seeded life to earth.

I am highly skeptical that we are visited by extraterrestrial intelligent life and/or extraterrestrial spacecraft technology.

However I have known a few people that I would consider to be reputable that allege they have seen something that makes them think they saw an extraterrestrial spacecraft. I think they may have seen some sort of experimental technology and/or natural terrestrial phenomena that they have misinterpreted. They have not been able to prove their claims, yet there is a few I can't disprove.

I joke we search space for intelligent life because there is none here.

Elite 1K Joined: May 26, 2005 - 08:39 PM Posts: 1496

ed.r.lee wrote:

I am making a bold assumption that our technology is still way primitive to detect these. There are far too many unknown in our world we've yet to figure out.

Occasionally, I look over my shoulders to the skeptics, it's interesting to see how some of them try to "manufacture" phenomenons for demonstration. Being able to reproduce something does not necessarily mean it doesn't exists.

What's even more interesting is watching the alien hunter people CONSTANTLY trying to manufacture evidence of extraterrestrials. Crop circles, anyone? Heck that Balloon Boy jerk was originally planning on trying to make a UFO video with his shiny saucer shaped craft and was a 2012 moonbat.

Absence of evidence is not evidence of absence, this is true. But also you can't prove a negative. Both basic principles of science. Science can't prove aliens don't exist, it's not possible to do that. If hard evidence of alien intelligence ever existed I'd gladly change my mind, being skeptical means you want to see evidence or proof, basically not being gullible.

But then because these things can't be disproven by rational logic, some people love to live in the realm of no evidence and half truths. It's the same with the 2012 doomsayers, Moon landing hoax people, 9/11 truthers, ghost hunters and the like. I think maybe it makes some people feel special to believe they "know" something the rest of the world doesn't? Or maybe it's just fame seeking behavior like in the case of Heene.

Like ATFS said, UFOs? Sure. Aliens? I remain skeptical. Occasionally I like to look over my shoulder at the woo-woo people and chuckle. Everyone needs a hobby, I guess.

Don't get me wrong, I love sci-fi stories and movies. I just don't think they're real. My favorite story ever about what an encounter with alien life might go like is here: http://baetzler.de/humor/meat_beings.html

"We've translated it. It's a cookbook."

"Don't get on that ship."

Klaatu barada nicto

Forum Veteran Joined: Dec 15, 2006 - 12:28 AM Posts: 760

Guysmiley wrote:

ed.r.lee wrote:

I am making a bold assumption that our technology is still way primitive to detect these. There are far too many unknown in our world we've yet to figure out.

Occasionally, I look over my shoulders to the skeptics, it's interesting to see how some of them try to "manufacture" phenomenons for demonstration. Being able to reproduce something does not necessarily mean it doesn't exists.

What's even more interesting is watching the alien hunter people CONSTANTLY trying to manufacture evidence of extraterrestrials. Crop circles, anyone? Heck that Balloon Boy jerk was originally planning on trying to make a UFO video with his shiny saucer shaped craft and was a 2012 moonbat.

Absence of evidence is not evidence of absence, this is true. But also you can't prove a negative. Both basic principles of science. Science can't prove aliens don't exist, it's not possible to do that. If hard evidence of alien intelligence ever existed I'd gladly change my mind, being skeptical means you want to see evidence or proof, basically not being gullible.

But then because these things can't be disproven by rational logic, some people love to live in the realm of no evidence and half truths. It's the same with the 2012 doomsayers, Moon landing hoax people, 9/11 truthers, ghost hunters and the like. I think maybe it makes some people feel special to believe they "know" something the rest of the world doesn't? Or maybe it's just fame seeking behavior like in the case of Heene.

Like ATFS said, UFOs? Sure. Aliens? I remain skeptical. Occasionally I like to look over my shoulder at the woo-woo people and chuckle. Everyone needs a hobby, I guess.

Don't get me wrong, I love sci-fi stories and movies. I just don't think they're real. My favorite story ever about what an encounter with alien life might go like is here: http://baetzler.de/humor/meat_beings.html

I find some of the abductees to be funny and scientifically interesting. It may not be scientifically interesting in the way that a layman might think; but interesting in a psychiatric sense.

What do you feel is most likely in order of the following?

1) People are being abducted by intelligent extraterrestrial aliens in extraterrestrial spacecraft technology for medical experiments.

2) People are greedy. People fake extraterrestrial alien sightings for their own personal gain, whether it be financial and/or fame for motive.

3) A psychiatric phenomena: false memories/overactive imagination/dream paralysis/etc…. IE scenario; a group of guys go into the woods and start drinking and/or abusing drugs excessively which can sometimes lower inhibitions. The lowered inhibitions could possibly lead to forcible rape and or a homophobe with suppressed homosexual sexuality may act out homosexually consensually. When they start sobering up they may start recovering their memories but they may be fragmented. The memories and the realities of the drunken orgy may be too much to handle; whether it be consciously or subconsciously to cover-up for the rape and or homosexual ***** acts the memories can be substituted with other memories so the memory can be interpreted as an UFO abduction and being probed; rather than rape or consensual *****.

I think some abductions may be a way for some people to use imagination explain away the painful experience of being raped, or homophobe acting out homosexually, or some other infidelity.

I think mental illness and or trauma and/or dream states can explain some of the claims of abduction.

=====
I think number two is the most likely and most frequent. Many people are attention whores and they are strongly motivated financially and are not as strong morally.

I think number three is the next most likely. There is some sort of psychiatric phenomenon whether it be perception, interpretation, confabulation, hallucinations, delusions, sleep paralysis, vivid dreams, alcohol or drug abuse, etc….

I think number one is extremely unlikely.

=====
I suspect there is intelligent life somewhere out there in the universe. The odds of us making direct contact is astronomical. Odds are if we detect intelligent life that we will perish before we can meet.

It’s fun to fantasize. I like Stargate, the old Star Trek, the old twilight zone and some other sci-fi fantasy shows and movies. I think it’s good to fantasize to consider the scientific possibilities. However I think it’s also important to keep a foot in scientific reality of what is known and the likelihoods.

Though the figures are largely speculative I feel the Drake equation shows that the likelihood that we will confront intelligent extraterrestrial alien lifeforms is extremely small.

Drake equation
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Drake_equation

Based on the answers above...

1. So if a person believes in extraterrestrial life (even remotely), the person automatically qualify as "medically unsound" because he/she has nothing to prove the existence and at the same time - you too - have nothing to disprove the existence?

2. Only believers of extraterrestrial life fake evidences? And skeptics don't?

3. And that we conveniently leave out other occurrences which skeptics can't find an answer and avoid discussing because they have no answers?

I am both interested but also remain sketchy about certain details. Still, I don't think it's respectful to write people off as "mentally unsound". Otherwise, the thirsty desire to see war and drain someone's blood is no different from a child rapist.

Elite 1K Joined: May 26, 2005 - 08:39 PM Posts: 1496

1. Believing in extraterrestrial life? Sure, the universe is a big, big place with lots of stars and planets and has been around for a long time. Aliens visiting our planet? No, the universe is a big, big place with distances so vast it really escapes the grasp of our monkey brain. We can say "5 light years", but we innately do not get how far that really is.

2. Skeptics aren't claiming to have seen little green men butt probing cattle, the burden of proof is not on them. Extraordinary claims demand extraordinary evidence.

3. What exactly is an "occurrence" without evidence? It's a story. A fairy tale. Fiction.

Remember, you came in here asking for opinions. You're getting some.

ed.r.lee wrote:

1. So if a person believes in extraterrestrial life (even remotely), the person automatically qualify as "medically unsound" because he/she has nothing to prove the existence and at the same time - you too - have nothing to disprove the existence?

So anyone except for an Atheist is "medically unsound" because he/she has nothing to prove the existence of the deity of their choosing? (Whatever they may call him or her?)

ed.r.lee wrote:

2. Only believers of extraterrestrial life fake evidences? And skeptics don't?

Who said UFOs are the results of extraterrestrial life? They're just 'unidentified' objects that happen to be flying.
A. If you saw a B-2 side-on flying straight/level on a moon-light night in 1988 prior to the press releases, would you have been able to 'identify' it?
B. Maybe not where they are arriving from but when?
C. Works both ways; want to explain the ultra-top-secret aircraft you've been working on? or say "it was swamp gas" and have nobody believe you? Instant UFO cover-up, not secret project witch hunt.

ed.r.lee wrote:

3. And that we conveniently leave out other occurrences which skeptics can't find an answer and avoid discussing because they have no answers?

The government/media are great for doing this; If it's not talked about on TV/News than it isn't important to John Q Public. Right? If skeptics can't find an answer then it doesn't make for good TV! After all when the government finds an answer, it is dismissed as a cover-up. (Like many UFO sightings that are obviously augmentor plumes and/or IR flares; so many people DON'T realize, but those in the fighter community can tell Wink

)

ed.r.lee wrote:

I am both interested but also remain sketchy about certain details. Still, I don't think it's respectful to write people off as "mentally unsound". Otherwise, the thirsty desire to see war and drain someone's blood is no different from a child rapist.

Anyhow back to the UFOs; people will believe what they WANT to believe. You could fly an F-16 at super-sonic speed over the wide open country, drop flares, boom houses, light the 'burner and disappear into the night. Then could put the HUD video/audio on YouTube and show what you did (laughing all the way), adding an apology for scaring everyone... Someone would still swear it was a UFO/Military cover-up... someone from Discovery or History will do a show, and it will forever become legend/mystery for future discussions/debate.

Keep 'em flyin' Thumb

TEG

Of course. In my opinion you have to be a vain fool not to. They've likely been staying here far longer than our feeble existence of 200,000 years. And we think we know it all! Laughing

Ok, i don't believe in aliens as such but mysterious flying machines yes i do, heres why.
My father and about 15 or so other people back in about 1946 -1947 saw a cigar shaped silver object, quite large, apparently windowless with no detail whatsoever visable such as antenee or wings, high up and moving at a heck of a rate. They were playing cricket and stopped the match to wacth it for a good minute or two. It made no noise either and to this day non of them know what it was.
Funny thing is it was right near (within a mile or two) of a ww2 aerodrome that has lots of mysterious stuff surrounding it including a saucer sighting by RAF personel right when the war ended, btw the saucer was said to be parked on the airfeild!
I don't think my dads sighting was ever officially reported though I think he said the local village policeman was at the cricket game watching. The RAF guys sighting i think was official.
Got me interested again now writing about it so I might research some more and try and find the saucer story to edit onto this post.
Here is the airfield I talked about: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/RAF_Beaulieu
Great thread!

Forum Veteran Joined: Dec 15, 2006 - 12:28 AM Posts: 760

Of course I believe in UFOs; I see infallible evidence of them all the time. UFO = Unintelligible Flowing Orifice (alternate definition). It seems a lot of them are attracted to political offices and positions in the media. Wink

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pwMgWsfou8A

Forum: Off-topic

Unidentified Flying Objects (UFO)