Air National Guard F-16s respond quickly to stray aircraft

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Unread post12 May 2005, 08:03

This is a discussion topic for the F-16.net news article: "<a href="news_article1364.html" target="_top">Air National Guard F-16s respond quickly to stray aircraft</A>". You can read the <a href="index.php?name=PNphpBB2&file=viewtopic&t=3033.html" target="_top">full forum discussion</A> in the F-16.net forum.
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swanee

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Unread post12 May 2005, 08:05

Gotta be afraid of our own shadow...

The way the media handled it you would have thought a Russian nuke bomber came that close instead of a Cesna 150...

In tonights headlines: "Be afraid of your own shaddow" and "Life will eventually kill you". Details at 11...
Last edited by swanee on 12 May 2005, 20:13, edited 1 time in total.
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Unread post12 May 2005, 20:09

swanee wrote: "Life will eventuall kill you". Details at 11...


Funny :-D

The thing to note, however, is that at first, it wasn't released that it was 'only' a C-150. I am sitting in South Korea right now (mid shift, which is daytime in the states) and caught the very first news reports; all that was said was there was an emergancy evacuation of the capitol and DC area, reason unknown, but people were being told to get out of the area, and to run, not walk. With all the talk recently about Iran wanting to start a 'peacefull' (ok, sure) nuke program, and N. Korea possibly preparing to test a nuke, among all the other domestic security issues out there, there was really no way to know. Now, if the intial warning had included "a small cessna aircraft has violated restriced airspace and is headed this way", I am sure it wouldn't have blown up as big and quickly as it did. One of those situations where clear communication of the whole story would have helped out alot.

:offtopic: What gets me was that immediatly after, there were those sitting around saying "see, nothing happened, we didn't have to react like we did". That attitude is why things such as the patriot act would never have passed before 9/11. I'm not saying the PA is a perfect answer; however, if intelligence had in fact prevented 9/11, then those same people would be sitting there today saying "see, all those searches and concerns and preperations weren't needed, nothing happened". We know now certain strong measures would have possibly prevented the 9/11 attacks. However, I would bet a months worth of my meager pay, that those measures could not have been implemented, because there would have been public (and political) outcry about such drastic measures being taken "for a possible threat". Just (some of) my thoughts on the whole subject.
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Unread post13 May 2005, 00:14

What also irks me (I'm in that mood today, sorry) about the "Sheesh!...it was only a Cessna?" reactions is that what if:

A) It was indeed a terrorist plan being excecuted?

B) There was no intent to crash into anything?

C) Being the clever bast*rds they are what if they managed to rig a C-150 to spray or dump a bio, chem, or God forbid a "radiological" agent over the center of DC? What would have been the reaction then? We all know what panic the Anthrax attacks caused and that was pretty localized.

IMO the thing was handled well, all things considered.

And BTW: here's a pretty good commentary from Fox News' Neil Cavuto regarding some of the congressional commentary afterwards. If it wasn't such a pay cut for him this guy should run for office. :thumb:
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Unread post13 May 2005, 00:28

What gets me was that immediatly after, there were those sitting around saying "see, nothing happened, we didn't have to react like we did". That attitude is why things such as the patriot act would never have passed before 9/11. I'm not saying the PA is a perfect answer; however, if intelligence had in fact prevented 9/11, then those same people would be sitting there today saying "see, all those searches and concerns and preperations weren't needed, nothing happened". We know now certain strong measures would have possibly prevented the 9/11 attacks. However, I would bet a months worth of my meager pay, that those measures could not have been implemented, because there would have been public (and political) outcry about such drastic measures being taken "for a possible threat". Just (some of) my thoughts on the whole subject.


How long did it take after 9/11 for the public to go right back to where we were before? I'm not advocating some sort of constant vigil police state, but folks need to understand that we aren't done with either terrorist threat, or the threat from rogue states with nuclear ambitions. I'm awfully sorry that the pols had to get up from their Starbuck's and run for their lives, but it just takes once....or at least it just took once for me to get it.

sigh.........
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Unread post13 May 2005, 03:54

All my argument is about how the media handles these things. Link is right, it could have been worse, but the Media treated it as if it were terrorists, not a couple of guys who just got confused and lost in the sky... The FAA and Customs and the DC ANG did the right thing and did their job. It should have been, "In other news, the pilot of a small single engine airplane made an error and flew into restricted airspace over DC today, no one was hurt and the FAA and Customs and the DC ANG all worked together and escorted the airplane out of restricted airspace and into a Maryland airport."

Instead, it was, "Oh my God! It was an airplane headed for Capitol Hill or the White House! Be Afraid! Terrorists are coming to get you! Everyone run for your lives."

Yes there is a threat of terrorism in this country. But I think it gets a little sensationalized when it get to the media.
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Unread post13 May 2005, 04:08

2! Ya said it much better than I did. :thumb:
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Unread post13 May 2005, 05:17

For the sake of discussion, the point I was trying to make is this: when the alarm was first raised, there was absolutely no mention of an airplane at all, at least on Fox (which is the news network that cut into the TV show I was watching on AFN here in South Korea). There was, therefore, no mention it was 'only' a cessna 150. It was something like 3 hours later, I might add, that it was released it was only a couple pilots who got lost. I was sitting on an Air Force base, 48 miles from N. Korea, watching the late show with Letterman when the news alert cut in. The only information they had, immediatly, was that there was an emergancy evacuation of the capitol and DC area under way. I then spend the next 15-20 minutes wondering if the call was going to come down to recall everyone to work, because DC had been attacked. As I mentioned above it was some time before the 'errant cessna' reports began to come out. Did the media sensationalize the issue? Maybe they did. Hell, I'm sure they did, thats what they're good at. But, they also may not have had much info, and an emergancy evacuation order of the capitol building is likely to get anyones blood pumping, when they don't know exactly what is going on. It certainly did mine, and I'm half a world away. Point being, we really can't be too carefull.

Or, we can look at it this way: the world (read: terrorists) now knows they can get a small, slow aircraft to within 3-4 miles of the white house/capitol building before they're likely to be seriously engaged. That is within range of a small nuke or biological/chemical threat. That means, if they upgrade to something as simple as a cessna 182, or a 310, or something even faster like a lancair; and especially something capable of 350+ knots like a learjet (still a small plane), they can turn in and make a run on the capitol with decent odds of getting there. That is just a little worrying to me. There is of course the good chance that 'layered defense' would get the aircraft before it could strike anything, but there is also the change it'll still get through. Again, I wonder at the principle of being 'too carefull' or 'over-reacting'. What do you guys think?
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Unread post13 May 2005, 05:54

make a run on the capitol with decent odds of getting there.


I'm betting that when they guy said "layered defense" he meant it. It might get messy around the capitol/White House, but I think you'd have a tough time getting into within a mile of either without literal volleys of AA. If you are a lost glasair pilot...so sorry, so sad. Anyway, unless you DID have a serious explosive, I don't imagine a civil plane would destroy either target.

You are right though...it would just take "close" for a small nuke or a nasty chemical.


On a completely unrelated note....whatever happened to that German kid who landed the Cessna in Red Square?

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