Finnish DefMin Interest in F-35s NOT Gripens

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magitsu

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Unread post04 Sep 2019, 12:36

Minister of Defense Kaikkonen: "More accurate estimate of the cost of the HX project in the near future"

- The idea is also to narrow down the price disadvantage, this is a really massive investment.
So far, we have talked about EUR 7-10 billion, but we need to make a more accurate estimate of it soon.
At this point, five options are on the same line.
Next year, a careful assessment will be made of how these five options will fit in practice with the varying circumstances of Finland.
The tests will be careful and tough, but also fair.
The final procurement decision will be made in 2021, Kaikkonen tells Reserviläinen.

https://www.reservilainen.fi/uutiset/pu ... ahiaikoina
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magitsu

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Unread post08 Oct 2019, 16:10

This is very interesting.
They seem to be dropping the requirement of set amount of 64 jets, but more importantly what was 7-10 billion has now become max 10 billion.

Meaning this is starting to look like the deal of the decade in Europe.

Partial google translate:
From the project's point of view, we received clear and timely guidance from the political leadership, on the basis of which we can proceed with the project as planned in line with the defense statement. The revised call for tenders sent in late autumn was set at a price cap of EUR 10 billion. Within the price ceiling, a performance entity must be built that includes not only the machines and their weapon systems, but also other components required by the HX system. These include e.g. a support, training and maintenance system, changes to the management and information systems required for integration into the defense system, and the construction of security-critical infrastructure.

The Advanced Call for Proposals moves, as planned, to a model that invites bidders to provide full performance within a set price cap. Thus, if required or even enabled to remain within the price ceiling or to achieve full performance, the provider may offer 64 different quantities of machinery. However, the criteria for full replacement of performance will not change with the advanced call for tenders. The number of fighters and their ability to survive and to make losses have a significant impact on crisis prevention and the credibility and performance of the Finnish defense system. Quality cannot be replaced by quantity or quantity by quality, but both are needed to achieve credibility.


https://www.defmin.fi/puolustushallinto ... 10006.blog

The program maneger himself said about the contestants:
"In my view, there are no signs that any provider would leave the game at this stage. Confirmation will be obtained when manufacturers bring their machines to the January-February HX Challenge testing and verification event."
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Corsair1963

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Unread post09 Oct 2019, 00:20

Honestly, I still believe Finland will acquire the F-35. Assuming Trump didn't scare the Finnish President Sauli Niinistö during their recent meeting....

Yet, I doubt it because I am sure he does what's in the best interest of the Finish People. :wink:
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magitsu

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Unread post09 Oct 2019, 01:50

Corsair1963 wrote:Honestly, I still believe Finland will acquire the F-35. Assuming Trump didn't scare the Finnish President Sauli Niinistö during their recent meeting....

Yet, I doubt it because I am sure he does what's in the best interest of the Finish People. :wink:

Trump should be long gone by 2025-30 when they should receive the fighters.
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mixelflick

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Unread post09 Oct 2019, 15:26

Corsair1963 wrote:Honestly, I still believe Finland will acquire the F-35. Assuming Trump didn't scare the Finnish President Sauli Niinistö during their recent meeting....

Yet, I doubt it because I am sure he does what's in the best interest of the Finish People. :wink:


It's hard to see the Finn's going for anything other than the F-35, assuming that competition is fair. I mean honestly, look around! The dominoes are starting to fall almost as quickly as the price of the jet itself. Anyone flying Gripen in the European theater is really asking for it. It's not just the fact that in 5 scant years they won't be competitive, they're behind the 8 ball today! Only meteor is keeping its head above water, and that isn't going to last long. Imagine getting a factory fresh aircraft that's.... already obsolete.

Then again, we're building F-15EX's.. :doh:
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magitsu

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Unread post09 Oct 2019, 16:11

The only truly interesting competitor to F-35 is the Boeing offer.

We already know that they include Growlers in the package. Imagine if they also could somehow drop in 737AEW&C (Swedish offer is ridiculous in this regard, 1&2 seater Gripens plus 2 GlobalEye, which are Bombardier Global 6500) . Then it would be really something compared to likely all F-35A offer. NGJ + Wedgetail. :drool:

Though I'm just kidding. FiAF likely couldn't afford to operate (crew mainly) Wedgetails. There's just one sigint CASA-C295 with LM's Dragon Shield container payload currently.

But that kind of package would truly blow non-F-35 packages out of the water. :mrgreen:
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