Vermont Anti F-35 crowd fails the Google test

Program progress, politics, orders, and speculation
  • Author
  • Message
Offline

SpudmanWP

Elite 5K

Elite 5K

  • Posts: 8378
  • Joined: 12 Oct 2006, 19:18
  • Location: California

Unread post13 Apr 2019, 00:03

A group opposed to basing the Air Force's F-35 fighter jet in Burlington is hosting forums to spread its message.

Citizens Against Nuclear Bombers in Vermont will meet at the Unitarian Universalist Church in Burlington Friday night at 7 p.m. Two more events are Saturday in Middlebury and Waterbury.

The group opposes basing the jets at the Vermont Air National Guard base they claim they could someday carry nuclear weapons. The Air Force says the jets coming to Vermont are not currently capable of that.

Defense analyst Pierre Sprey says the Air Force has nuclear bombs that now fit smaller jets. "This one is a basically completely new redesign shrunk down to fit into the bomb bay of the F-35. That makes the F-35 a very specialized nuclear bomber," he said.

The jets are scheduled to begin arriving in Vermont in September.

https://www.wcax.com/content/news/F-35- ... 05231.html

I think someone forgot to tell them that the F-16s that are based in Vermont today can also carry the same bombs that the F-35 will be able to, specifically the B-61 that was first produced in 1968. The F-16 can also carry the B-83 nuclear bomb.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/B61_nuclear_bomb

Also, the B-61 was not "shrunk down" to fit in the F-35, it was given a new GPS guided tail-kit. Basically a nuclear JDAM.

b61-12nukedt-common-streams-streamserver-cls.jpeg
Changes to the B-61 Mod 12


Here is a good read on the subject of the F-35 and the B-61
http://www.airforcemag.com/MagazineArch ... 10nato.pdf
0710nato.pdf
Nukes for NATO
(271.86 KiB) Downloaded 136 times
"The early bird gets the worm but the second mouse gets the cheese."
Offline
User avatar

white_lightning35

Senior member

Senior member

  • Posts: 395
  • Joined: 18 Sep 2016, 03:07
  • Location: Home of nuclear submarines, engines, and that's about it.

Unread post13 Apr 2019, 21:21

SpudmanWP wrote:A group opposed to basing the Air Force's F-35 fighter jet in Burlington is hosting forums to spread its message.

Citizens Against Nuclear Bombers in Vermont will meet at the Unitarian Universalist Church in Burlington Friday night at 7 p.m. Two more events are Saturday in Middlebury and Waterbury.

The group opposes basing the jets at the Vermont Air National Guard base they claim they could someday carry nuclear weapons. The Air Force says the jets coming to Vermont are not currently capable of that.

Defense analyst Pierre Sprey says the Air Force has nuclear bombs that now fit smaller jets. "This one is a basically completely new redesign shrunk down to fit into the bomb bay of the F-35. That makes the F-35 a very specialized nuclear bomber," he said.

The jets are scheduled to begin arriving in Vermont in September.

I never thought I'd see Waterbury mentioned on here, haha. I think the authorities are luckily ignoring these fools, so hopefully I can take some photographs of the planes coming in to Burlington this September 8) .
Offline

aussiebloke

Enthusiast

Enthusiast

  • Posts: 66
  • Joined: 07 Dec 2017, 22:29

Unread post14 Apr 2019, 15:58

here is the web site of the vermont based "Save Our Skies: From the F-35s":
https://saveourskiesvt.org/

SIX AREAS OF CONCERN

1. NUCLEAR THREATS FROM AND TO VERMONT
“THE F-35 JOINT STRIKE FIGHTER IS SLATED TO BE ARMED WITH THE B61 NUCLEAR BOMB AS EARLY AS 2020, BUT COULD CARRY THE WEAPON SOONER”

2. COST TO OUR COUNTRY
THE LIFETIME COST OF THE F-35 IS OVER 1.4 TRILLION DOLLARS – AND RISING.
THE PRICE PER PLANE HAS DOUBLED SINCE 2001.

3. TECHNOLOGICAL DISASTER
AFTER TWENTY-TWO YEARS IN DEVELOPMENT AND TESTING, THE F-35A STILL
• CAN’T SUPPORT GROUND TROOPS
• CAN’T DEFEND ITSELF FROM AIR OR GROUND STRIKES
• CAN’T HIDE FROM ENEMIES
• NEEDS A LARGER, FASTER, MORE MANEUVERABLE AIRCRAFT TO PROTECT IT
• USES OUTDATED STEALTH TECHNOLOGY
The F-35A has had more fleet-wide groundings than any other fighter aircraft in the last 50 years.


4. MILITARY-INDUSTRIAL-POLITICAL CORRUPTION
“IN THE COUNCILS OF GOVERNMENT, WE MUST GUARD AGAINST THE ACQUISITION OF UNWARRANTED INFLUENCE, WHETHER SOUGHT OR UNSOUGHT, BY THE MILITARY-INDUSTRIAL COMPLEX. THE POTENTIAL FOR THE DISASTROUS RISE OF MISPLACED POWER EXISTS AND WILL PERSIST.”– PRESIDENT DWIGHT EISENHOWER

“THE F-35 IS BOTH A SCANDAL AND A TRAGEDY” AND IS “THE WORST EXAMPLE OF THE MILITARY-INDUSTRIAL-CONGRESSIONAL COMPLEX.” – SENATOR JOHN MCCAIN (R-AZ)

5. ADVERSE HEALTH IMPACTS
“THERE IS OVERWHELMING EVIDENCE THAT EXPOSURE TO ENVIRONMENTAL NOISE HAS ADVERSE EFFECTS ON THE HEALTH OF THE POPULATION.”
(WORLD HEALTH ORGANIZATION REPORT: BURDEN OF DISEASE FROM ENVIRONMENTAL NOISE, 2011)


6. HARM TO CHILDREN
“A GROWING BODY OF SCIENTIFIC KNOWLEDGE DEMONSTRATES THAT CHILDREN MAY SUFFER DISPROPORTIONALLY FROM ENVIRONMENTAL HEALTH RISKS AND SAFETY RISKS. THESE RISKS ARISE BECAUSE CHILDREN’S NEUROLOGICAL, IMMUNOLOGICAL, DIGESTIVE, AND OTHER BODILY SYSTEMS ARE STILL DEVELOPING” - (EXECUTIVE ORDER 13045, PROTECTION OF CHILDREN FROM ENVIRONMENTAL HEALTH RISKS AND SAFETY RISKS, APRIL 2003)

“THERE IS INCREASING AWARENESS THAT CHRONIC EXPOSURE TO HIGH AIRCRAFT NOISE LEVELS CAN IMPAIR LEARNING.”
(AIR FORCE ENVIRONMENTAL IMPACT STATEMENT, 2013)
Offline

aussiebloke

Enthusiast

Enthusiast

  • Posts: 66
  • Joined: 07 Dec 2017, 22:29

Unread post14 Apr 2019, 16:01

Citizens Against Nuclear Bombers in Vermont organised a protest forum held 2 days ago. The speakers included:

"Ben Cohen >Co-founder of Ben & Jerry’s
Colonel Rosanne Greco >Former Intelligence Officer and Nuclear Weapons Expert
Chuck Spinney >Former Engineer and Analyst for the Office of the Secretary of Defense
Pierre Sprey >Co-designer of the F-16 and A-10"

https://saveourskiesvt.org/wp-content/u ... 90408b.pdf
Offline
User avatar

sferrin

Elite 5K

Elite 5K

  • Posts: 5332
  • Joined: 22 Jul 2005, 03:23

Unread post14 Apr 2019, 18:30

aussiebloke wrote:Citizens Against Nuclear Bombers in Vermont organised a protest forum held 2 days ago. The speakers included:

"Ben Cohen >Co-founder of Ben & Jerry’s
Colonel Rosanne Greco >Former Intelligence Officer and Nuclear Weapons Expert
Chuck Spinney >Former Engineer and Analyst for the Office of the Secretary of Defense
Pierre Sprey >Co-designer of the F-16 and A-10"

https://saveourskiesvt.org/wp-content/u ... 90408b.pdf


Pierre Sprey did NOT "co-design" the F-16 and A-10.
"There I was. . ."
Offline

SpudmanWP

Elite 5K

Elite 5K

  • Posts: 8378
  • Joined: 12 Oct 2006, 19:18
  • Location: California

Unread post15 Apr 2019, 00:56

aussiebloke wrote:here is the web site of the vermont based "Save Our Skies: From the F-35s":
https://saveourskiesvt.org/


Sometimes you have to admire blind dedication.. other times just pitty it.
Last edited by SpudmanWP on 15 Apr 2019, 00:57, edited 1 time in total.
"The early bird gets the worm but the second mouse gets the cheese."
Offline

Corsair1963

Elite 5K

Elite 5K

  • Posts: 5562
  • Joined: 19 Dec 2005, 04:14

Unread post15 Apr 2019, 00:56

sferrin wrote:
aussiebloke wrote:Citizens Against Nuclear Bombers in Vermont organised a protest forum held 2 days ago. The speakers included:

"Ben Cohen >Co-founder of Ben & Jerry’s
Colonel Rosanne Greco >Former Intelligence Officer and Nuclear Weapons Expert
Chuck Spinney >Former Engineer and Analyst for the Office of the Secretary of Defense
Pierre Sprey >Co-designer of the F-16 and A-10"

https://saveourskiesvt.org/wp-content/u ... 90408b.pdf


Pierre Sprey did NOT "co-design" the F-16 and A-10.


Plus, he does little to dispel that either........ :?
Offline

strykerxo

Senior member

Senior member

  • Posts: 433
  • Joined: 21 Mar 2008, 04:40

Unread post15 Apr 2019, 05:07

Feel the Bernie? He must be proud of his minions.
You can't shot what you can't see - Unknown
Offline

krieger22

Enthusiast

Enthusiast

  • Posts: 68
  • Joined: 10 Jul 2018, 22:02

Unread post15 Apr 2019, 11:34

It's strangely hilarious that the Ben of Ben & Jerry apparently has more clout than Sprey.

Well, they ask way too much for their product out here anyway...
Offline

mixelflick

Elite 3K

Elite 3K

  • Posts: 3312
  • Joined: 20 Mar 2010, 10:26
  • Location: Parts Unknown
  • Warnings: 3

Unread post15 Apr 2019, 13:07

Dunno why these peacenick's bother. If the USAF decides it needs F-35 in Burlington, they're going to put them in Burlington.

Period. End of story.

But left wing whackos exist everywhere, and we shouldn't be surprised they're in VT too. What is surprising is Pierre Sprey, still railing against the F-35 where at this point, there is ample evidence to the contrary (and growing daily). They'll pay his way no doubt, but really... it's all just theater for left wing loons.
Offline
User avatar

XanderCrews

Elite 5K

Elite 5K

  • Posts: 5916
  • Joined: 16 Oct 2012, 19:42

Unread post17 Apr 2019, 03:38

strykerxo wrote:Feel the Bernie? He must be proud of his minions.



Bernie has been pro F-35. It doesn't matter what these politcos say in public. Both Bernie and McCain went bananas on the expense of the F-35 program while simultaneously ensuring they got some in their state to keep bases/jobs.

Bernie flat told a guy at a town hall if Vermont didn't get them, the program would just put them somewhere else, benefiting whoever that was economically. If Ben and Jerry's want to make up the economic stimulus of the F-35s in Burlington in lieu of them being brought there with cash infusions to the public I strongly encourage them to do so. Rich leftists never just do that though (how bizarre!)

If you can't convince hippies like Ben and Jerry's to donate money, who can you convince? :|
Choose Crews
Offline

mixelflick

Elite 3K

Elite 3K

  • Posts: 3312
  • Joined: 20 Mar 2010, 10:26
  • Location: Parts Unknown
  • Warnings: 3

Unread post17 Apr 2019, 13:03

Bernie's own tax returns prove he's part of the 1% he rails against!

I'm a Republican, but do admire Sanders. Unlike Clinton, I think he really believes in his message, is genuine and running for the right reasons. Had the Dems not rigged their own primaries for Clinton to win, Bernie might be President today.

I'd never vote for him, given his ludicrous positions on things. But I do think that deep down, he's a good guy. Probably belongs elsewhere though, like Venezuela or N. Korea. He'd be happier there..
Offline
User avatar

sferrin

Elite 5K

Elite 5K

  • Posts: 5332
  • Joined: 22 Jul 2005, 03:23

Unread post17 Apr 2019, 13:16

mixelflick wrote:Bernie's own tax returns prove he's part of the 1% he rails against!

I'm a Republican, but do admire Sanders. Unlike Clinton, I think he really believes in his message, is genuine and running for the right reasons. Had the Dems not rigged their own primaries for Clinton to win, Bernie might be President today.


Thank Christ we dodged that bullet. I'd have taken Clinton over "The Bern" and I can't stand that hag.
"There I was. . ."
Offline
User avatar

ricnunes

Elite 2K

Elite 2K

  • Posts: 2049
  • Joined: 02 Mar 2017, 14:29

Unread post17 Apr 2019, 17:02

XanderCrews wrote:Bernie has been pro F-35...

Bernie flat told a guy at a town hall if Vermont didn't get them, the program would just put them somewhere else, benefiting whoever that was economically...


Ditto!

Independently if one likes or not or supports or not Bernie Sanders, there's one thing that no-one can accuse him of, which is to be an anti-F-35 person. He's definitely not!
The situation that Xander describes above can easily be found on video on the web (youtube for example). I remember to have posted here at F-16.net a video of that same situation in the past.


mixelflick wrote:Bernie's own tax returns prove he's part of the 1% he rails against!

I'm a Republican, but do admire Sanders. Unlike Clinton, I think he really believes in his message, is genuine and running for the right reasons. Had the Dems not rigged their own primaries for Clinton to win, Bernie might be President today.

I'd never vote for him, given his ludicrous positions on things. But I do think that deep down, he's a good guy.


I agree with most of the above.
But if I were American I would likely vote for him but I guess that's not important for this discussion.

But then again if I had to choose from the following pool:
- Bernie, Clinton, Trump and to mix the pot a little bit more with an international mix, lets also included Trudeau, Merkel, Macron and May.
Then, I wouldn't have any second thoughts to which one would my vote go (Bernie would win my vote)


mixelflick wrote:Probably belongs elsewhere though, like Venezuela or N. Korea. He'd be happier there..


Here I fully disagree.
I would say that Bernie Sanders political position is more in-line with the Center-Left or Social-Democrats of Europe. Totally unrelated with ruling party/politicians in Venezuela let alone from those of N. Korea.
A 4th/4.5th gen fighter aircraft stands about as much chance against a F-35 as a guns-only Sabre has against a Viper.
Offline

fidgetspinner

Enthusiast

Enthusiast

  • Posts: 45
  • Joined: 17 Nov 2018, 02:27
  • Warnings: 1

Unread post17 Apr 2019, 19:13

I always heard that republicans are more pro-military spending than democrats. Is that still correct? Have socialist cadidates by any means have shown to be pro-military spending with interests for new military projects or improving the f-35 program with more military spending?

The only flaw i have seen for Sanders was getting pushed aside from BLM protestors it makes me think how he will handle the geopolitical stage with Putin. Yang on the other hand seems like he is growing in popularity, out of all places is popular on 4chan /pol/ a right wing nationalist board and had the balls to be in Ben Shapiro's interview which would be the last place in the world that Cortez or Sanders would want to be.
Next

Return to Program and politics

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 12 guests