Australia delays delivery of 12 F-35 fighters

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spazsinbad

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Unread post01 May 2014, 00:24

Interesting number for two RAAF F-35A Squadrons at RAAF Willytown....
Second strike of Joint Strike Fighters in sights for Williamtown 29 Apr 2014 SARAH PRICE

"...It is a decision which will see Williamtown RAAF Base reap much of the rewards with Paterson MP Bob Baldwin saying $986 million would be spent on infrastructure at the Port-based location for JSF-related works.

"It's great news, it's been a long time coming," Mr Baldwin said.

"Two squadrons are to be based at Williamtown . . . 48 of the aircraft....

...The remaining aircraft will be based at Tindal.

Mr Baldwin said "if we play our cards right" Williamtown could also become the main maintenance location for all JSF....

...The first F-35 aircraft will arrive in Australia in 2018 and enter service with the RAAF in 2020.

The JSF will replace the F/A-18 A/B Classic Hornet aircraft which are to be withdrawn from service by 2022.

The government will also consider acquiring an additional squadron of F-35 aircraft to replace the Super Hornets in the future."

SOURCE: http://www.portstephensexaminer.com.au/ ... lliamtown/
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Unread post03 May 2014, 21:08

spazsinbad wrote:'gtx' thanks for the graphics. What is the story about the 'piggy bank' not being there (seen in the WHITE article above) - is that true?


I can't say for certain as I am not privy to the inner workings of the Treasury Dept etc. I do know that for many years now the planning to buy the aircraft has been there and the budget requirements were well known and planned for and confirmed before making any decisions (that is all part of the 'mundane' part of acquisitions - 1st & 2nd passes etc..). I also know that the budget planning factored in aircraft costs far higher than will be the case. As for the implication that Gov't somehow stash away the money in some big bank account waiting to pay…that's simply not the reality of the way these things occur (or for that matter, how most of us manage our own budgets - who here has all the money in an account before they buy a house or a car??). Planning is there and money is allocated in budgets…but it is not necessarily all there up front. :roll: This is nothing to be worried about.
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Unread post03 May 2014, 21:14

'gtx' thanks for the explanation however there seems to be some conjuring in the use of
"...Planning is there and money is allocated in budgets…but it is not necessarily all there up front...."

Planning is not money, "money allocated in budgets" so does that money accumulate somewhere? Or does that 'allocated in budget money' just remain ephemeral. I think I have seen similar explanations over the years with the F-35 total cost always remaining under the "......" however it seems - according to White - that there is no money set aside anyway. I can understand the budget for the total cost of purchase and whatnot but still and all I believe I was reading / hearing that the money was also set aside for the purchase etc.
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Unread post03 May 2014, 21:34

I think (and this is just guessing) that when PM Abbott made the comment that "“It's money which successive governments have carefully put aside to ensure that our nation's defences are strong,” he might have beentretching the truth a tad. In essence, IMHO, what Hugh White has said is corret: the money is not sitting in a big bank account at this instant. What the successive Govt's have done is say something along the lines of "in yr X, we will need to ensure we have $Y available to buy…" and then kept that in mind during budget planning over the years…

As I said earlier, this is essentially no different to what you or I might do in our own personal budgeting/planning.

Of course this is all a rather simplistic explanation and I may well be wrong…maybe there is a big bank account somewhere. :D

Either way, I don't see this as being an issue one way or another. The RAAF will get all of its F-35s in the time planned. Both sides of Australia's govt are fully supportive.
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Unread post03 May 2014, 21:42

'gtx' thanks. I think that has been referred to as you say over the years however in perhaps more recent times the notion of a 'bank account' alluded to by the current and previous PMs recently was that 'bank' suggestion. There is such a thing as 'consolidated revenue' [Commonwealth of Australia Consolidated Revenue Fund] I guess where money can appear and disappear at will there. Perhaps the pollies can get around to explaining about this more but I'm not holding my breath. Accounting is never for the faint of heart anywhere eh. :devil:
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Unread post10 May 2014, 10:11

ONLY the first question about HOW Australia Buys Defence Equipment (F-35) and LHD question are in the edited .MP3 attached (11min 20sec). Full interview (40 Mins) is at the URL below.

Australia's Defence and the Strike Fighter Purchase 09 May 2014 Helen Richardson

"The Government has announced plans to spend over 12 billion dollars on the purchase of 58 more Joint Strike Fighters. Why are they needed and where will these fighters fit into Australia's defence strategy? How can it afford this at times of Budget cost cutting, when we're all being asked to 'tighten our belts'? Trevor Chappell discussed this with Dr John Blaxland who Senior Fellow at the Strategic and Defence Studies Centre at ANU."

SOURCE: http://www.abc.net.au/overnights/stories/s4001497.htm
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Australia's Defence and the Strike Fighter Purchase 09may2014.mp3 [ 2.61 MiB | Viewed 11381 times ]

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Unread post14 May 2014, 16:02

SHOW ME THE MONEY!
Defence Portfolio Budget Statements 2014-15 http://www.defence.gov.au/budget/14-15/pbs/
Defence Materiel Organisation page 158
"...Joint Strike Fighter
Joint Strike Fighter Aircraft - AIR 6000 Phase 2A/B
Prime Contractor: Lockheed Martin is contracted to the United States Government for the development and production of the F-35 Joint Strike Fighter (JSF). Australia is procuring the aircraft through a government-to-government agreement.

This project is approved to acquire 72 JSF aircraft and supporting elements to form three operational squadrons and one training squadron. This comprises 14 aircraft approved in 2009 and 58 approved in April 2014. The funding for the recently approved 58 aircraft and associated elements will be transferred to the DMO post the 2014-15 budget.

During 2014-15 production of Australia’s first two JSF Aircraft will be completed at the Lockheed Martin facility in Fort Worth Texas. The aircraft will then be ferried to the International Pilot Training Centre at Luke Air Force Base, Arizona to support the commencement of Australian pilot training.

Some of the major risks for the project include the establishment of an electronic warfare reprogramming capability and the stand up of sustainment systems and facilities required to support Australian operations...." [get dem Canuks onboard]

SOURCE: http://www.defence.gov.au/budget/14-15/ ... 04_DMO.pdf (0.7Mb)
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Unread post21 May 2014, 16:36

Minister for Defence – Transcript – Interview with Chris Coleman, ABC Riverina 20 May 2014

"MINISTER:...
...There is a lot of rebuilding to do and that is why we are working on a new White Paper due out next year, with a funded Defence Capability Plan and defence force structure review that will set the path out to 2030 as it should have been under the previous Government....

CHRIS COLEMAN:
There has been a bit of criticism that the JSF, 58 extra JSF and more than $28 billion at the same time that money is being taken out of health and education, according to the coverage, how do you respond to that?

MINISTER:
Well, look I am pleased to respond to that, because we took that decision in 2002 to go with the JSF

CHRIS COLEMAN:
The extra 58 of them ?

MINISTER:
Well, in 2009 we said 100. We’re going to 72 within the second half of the next decade, we will look at where we are at and what decisions the then Government can make, but can I say this about the Joint Strike Fighter – it will be a regionally dominant platform, there is nothing comparable to it, it is a fifth generation fighter and anybody who understands history, any history at all, will understand that air capability is crucial to the survival of our nation, particularly with our vast maritime environment and responsibility.

Now, what has been happening is that since 2006 is we have been funding and putting money away into that particular program, there is no new money into the Joint Strike Fighter Program out over the Defence Capability Plan out to 2025. Now, this is the way Defence runs its capital accounts, we acquire the large capital and put the money away at an early stage because the Government needs to know, when these projects are going to be available, how much it is going to cost, when the payments will be due, it is just good planning. So a whole host of programs have had money taken from them, but this is not one of them. So the Joint Strike Fighter coming forward is probably one of our most important Defence purchases.

CHRIS COLEMAN:
Provided they can get them flying.

MINISTER:
Look, there are a hundred of them flying, there are a whole lot of them at Eglin Air Base and Yuma, in Arizona, the marines have taken possession of them, they’re coming along. This aircraft, I will be very pleased to show you Chris in 5 years, is just the aircraft for us, and is ultimately coming to us at a reasonable price.

....

MINISTER:
Well, I think they are going to realise that this Government is planning and charting a course that is funded, now we are not going to make big splash announcements, but we are going to make sure that the commentators that know what to look for, the Mark Thompsons at ASPI and others that do a constant surveillance if Defence funding can see transparency where the money is coming from and where it is going.

Now, the fact that we have stabilised the haemorrhaging from the Defence Budget, or attempted to means we have a greater responsibility to make sure that we have a clear and transparent chartered course in the portfolio going forward, and of course, in the projects that we are funding, that we are getting good value for money, which is a huge increase in responsibility on Defence, to get better value for money, so we’re conducting reform...."

SOURCE: http://www.minister.defence.gov.au/2014 ... ranscript/
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Unread post21 May 2014, 18:10

CHRIS COLEMAN:
Provided they can get them flying.

Classic "Journalistic" research integrity
"The early bird gets the worm but the second mouse gets the cheese."
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Unread post21 May 2014, 19:00

SpudmanWP wrote:
CHRIS COLEMAN:
Provided they can get them flying.

Classic "Journalistic" research integrity



Expecting journalistic integrity from the anti-F-35 crowd? Shame on you.
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Unread post22 May 2014, 17:35

What will make our RAAFie Chappies COOL DOODS indeed when it all goes operational. NGJ here we come.... :mrgreen:
The Future of Airpower from the Fleet 22 May 2014 Marc V. Schanz

"Preserving key electronic attack capabilities will be critical to projecting airpower in future conflicts, Chief of Naval Operations Adm. Jonathan Greenert told reporters in Washington, D.C., on Wednesday. Greenert said these “critical” electronic warfare capabilities will be just as important as stand-alone stealth in the future. “The ability to detect sooner, to spoof, jam, intercept other sensors and weapons, I think, is key to the future,” Greenert said. Although the Navy is getting delivery of the F-35C, the strike fighter is just “one element of stealth,” and works alongside assets like the E/A-18G Growler electronic attack jet. He also emphasized the importance of unmanned aircraft in future fights, indicating their importance to naval air operations will only grow in the near future. “There’s so much payload on an aircraft associated with a person that you can only imagine the sensors, and potential weapons, we could carry on that,” he said. While all the services are focus on anti-access, area-denial problems, Greenert stressed that he does not see the solution as “knocking down and defeating every single item” in a conflict. He said that would be “exhausting, too expensive, and prejudicial to the most efficient way to operate.” Instead, the focus should be on capability needed to get in to a fight, achieve a set objective, and get out, he added.​"

SOURCE: http://www.airforcemag.com/DRArchive/Pa ... Fleet.aspx
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Unread post23 May 2014, 01:08

Adm. Greenert's approach is suited for Navy's mission, given their relative limited resources that can be brought to bear via a CAW. AF can bring more assets to bear and is focused on the more demanding task of more aggressively going after the IADS,a strategy going back to TAC.
Traditionally, Navy is more SEAD-focused vs more emphasis on,DEAD for AF.. is that a fair assessment and can we see any changes coming in their respective doctrine?
"When a fifth-generation fighter meets a fourth-generation fighter—the [latter] dies,”
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Unread post14 Aug 2014, 02:01

Australia Eyes Strengthening Japan Military Ties
12 Aug 2014 Jason Scott

"Australia, in talks to acquire submarine technology from Japan, may further bolster military ties as the East Asian nation eases its pacifist doctrine and rules on defense exports, Defense Minister David Johnston said....

...Australia also sees an opportunity to share information with Japan on the F-35 Joint Strike Fighters. It’s buying 72 [perhaps 100 in future total?].

“There’s a huge opportunity because there’s a very big investment by both of us in air combat capability,” Johnston said. “We can do exercises together, we can exchange views on how to sustain the aircraft, how to make repairs, and generally get as much value out of the platform as we both want to do. Leveraging off each other’s capabilities is a very significant part of the interaction.”..."

Source: http://www.bloomberg.com/news/print/201 ... -ties.html
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Unread post19 Aug 2014, 06:25

F-35 AU-1 Royal Australian Air Force (RAAF) "Roll Out Ceremony" HD
Published on Jul 24, 2014

"The first two Australian F-35 were officially unveiled at a ceremony in our Fort Worth, Texas, factory on July 24, 2014. The F-35 will provide the Royal Australian Air Force with a transformational 5th generation fighter capability."

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Unread post19 Sep 2014, 22:20

Might be interestin'?
Upcoming Public Hearings NACC (for Nics? - NicNaccNO?)

"The committee will consider and report on the AIR 6000 Phase 2A/B New Air Combat Capability Facilities.
23 Sep 2014: Canberra, ACT"

Source: http://www.aph.gov.au/Parliamentary_Bus ... Works/NACC


Some 'beaten into submission' PDFs here: http://www.aph.gov.au/Parliamentary_Bus ... ubmissions

Most interestin' is this 11.2Mb PDF jobbie:
Facilities Requirements for the New Air Combat Capability June 2014
http://www.aph.gov.au/DocumentStore.ash ... bId=254100
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