Budget victim: Joint Dual-Role Air Dominance Missile

F-35 Armament, fuel tanks, internal and external hardpoints, loadouts, and other stores.
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sprstdlyscottsmn

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Unread post15 Feb 2012, 17:34

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tacf-x

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Unread post15 Feb 2012, 19:43

We NEEEEED these weapons! Think about it. What other opportunity do we have to develop a missile that can eliminate enemy fighters both at BVR and WVR with higher Pks than AMRAAM or AIM-9Xs and also dial the weapon for anti-radar SEAD roles all while on the same mission? Also how could we pass up the opportunity to store a large amount of these into a weapons bay and thus triple the flexibility of a platform per sortie?
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SpudmanWP

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Unread post15 Feb 2012, 20:19

Someone (I forget whom) suggested that they may do to the AMRAAM what they did to the Sidewinder, eg continually update with new motors, seekers, warheads, etc until it no longer looks like it did when it started.

They have already got plans for a new mulch-stage motor that ATK has been working on since 2009.

It would be easy enough to change it's seeker to incorporate HARM, IIR, etc functions and then add directional blast, etc as the tech is developed.
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handyman

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Unread post15 Feb 2012, 22:09

Buy the meteor. Problem solved.
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VigilanteAgumon

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Unread post15 Feb 2012, 22:26

handyman wrote:Buy the meteor. Problem solved.

How, pray tell, do you plan on fitting a Meteor in the weapons bay?
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wrightwing

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Unread post15 Feb 2012, 23:02

VigilanteAgumon wrote:
handyman wrote:Buy the meteor. Problem solved.

How, pray tell, do you plan on fitting a Meteor in the weapons bay?


4 Meteors will fit inside of an F-35.
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HaveVoid

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Unread post15 Feb 2012, 23:35

It probably comes down to nice to have versus need to have. Sure it would be nice to have a missile that is capable of intercepting and destroying aircraft, destroying SAM sites, sinking the enemy's Aircraft Carriers, and destroying Tanks too, but it would also likely cost a small fortune. At a time where we are having to pick which platforms we need, and which we would simply like to have (A-10, C-27, C-5A cuts) it hardly seems congruent to throw a bunch of money at a program that is not yet needed. If the AIM-120D and AGM-88E represent a sufficient enough capability, why would we spend money on JDRADM that could be better spent on buying the jets that carry such missiles. The argument that an F-35 needs JDRADM to do SEAD is not, in my opinion, a valid one. I daresay that an F-35 flight should have scarce little problem localizing hostile emitters and ensuring the adequate JDAM or JSOW delivers a suitable greeting. Perhaps JDRADM will be pushed to the right somewhat, as has been mentioned. I think we can all agree that the F-35 would still outclass most foes in the BVR arena using the the older AIM-120A (assuming it could fit in the internal bays, which I know it cannot), simply by virtue of its LO and radar capabilities.



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1st503rdsgt

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Unread post16 Feb 2012, 03:58

wrightwing wrote:
VigilanteAgumon wrote:
handyman wrote:Buy the meteor. Problem solved.

How, pray tell, do you plan on fitting a Meteor in the weapons bay?


4 Meteors will fit inside of an F-35.


Actually, it's only 2 for now (on the A2G stations). Meteor will require some modification to fit on the door-rail.
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Conan

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Unread post16 Feb 2012, 04:04

handyman wrote:Buy the meteor. Problem solved.


Does Meteor have an anti-radiation missile capability, does it? Is Meteor being designed with WVR combat in mind is it?

Meteor does not solve "all" problems.

Besides it's an active radar guided missile and doesn't have the variety of guidance options that the Russian and Chinese missiles do, so I'm sure Eric will be along shortly to tell us all how useless it is...
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handyman

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Unread post16 Feb 2012, 04:09

Conan wrote:
handyman wrote:Buy the meteor. Problem solved.


Does Meteor have an anti-radiation missile capability, does it? Is Meteor being designed with WVR combat in mind is it?

Meteor does not solve "all" problems.

Besides it's an active radar guided missile and doesn't have the variety of guidance options that the Russian and Chinese missiles do, so I'm sure Eric will be along shortly to tell us all how useless it is...

It doesn't have to solve ALL problems. The whole jack of all trades concept is flawed. Haven't we learned anything from the F35?
http://www.flightglobal.com/news/articl ... 35-347416/
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Conan

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Unread post16 Feb 2012, 04:34

handyman wrote:It doesn't have to solve ALL problems. The whole jack of all trades concept is flawed. Haven't we learned anything from the F35?
http://www.flightglobal.com/news/articl ... 35-347416/


JDRADM wouldn't solve ALL problems either, but it would solve a hell of a lot more than Meteor.

To fit the Meteor into an internal bay it was never intended to go into during it's initial design is going to result in reduced capability because of that modified missile's compromised design (or a more expensive missile) and still not address the other capability (or lack thereof) concerns for F-35 in a low observable configuration, namely an anti-radiation missile or increased weapons load outs.

There are plenty of lessons to be learned from F-35, a strong one which seems to escape many is that simplistic answers offer simplistic solutions, but not necessarily the best...
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lampshade111

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Unread post16 Feb 2012, 11:58

Unless a follow up program is right in the works this is completely unacceptable. We can do far better than the AIM-120D in my opinion. Put plans for a dual-mode seeker on hold and just get something that combines a VFDR motor, AIM-120D seeker, and thrust vectoring, and some more minor improvements. Leave the advanced seekers and networking for a later stage of the program.
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constantinoujake

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Unread post16 Feb 2012, 14:15

Im sorry but the name 'Joint Dual Role Air Dominance Missile' makes me want to wet myself.
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marksengineer

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Unread post16 Feb 2012, 19:35

This might be an area were a smart defense contractor that has existing missile experience develops what the AF and Navy need on their own. The contractor then offers it to the customers much like what General Atomics has done with the Predator, Reaper and Avenger. In these economic times the business model of being a proactive supplier may lead to single source contracts. The caveat is that your product needs to work well and require little additional testing or modifications to have military value.
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SpudmanWP

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Unread post16 Feb 2012, 20:34

I wonder how long it is before Boeing and Raytheon get together an offer SITES-based upgrades to AMRAAM?
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