Block 3F Status / Schedule

Cockpit, radar, helmet-mounted display, and other avionics
  • Author
  • Message
Offline

maus92

Elite 2K

Elite 2K

  • Posts: 2031
  • Joined: 21 May 2010, 17:50
  • Location: Annapolis, MD

Unread post19 Sep 2017, 01:09

US considers non-combat-rated subset of F-35 fleet
18 SEPTEMBER, 2017 SOURCE: FLIGHTGLOBAL.COM BY: STEPHEN TRIMBLE WASHINGTON DC


"Scores of US-owned Lockheed Martin F-35s would remain in the fleet with a software operating system rated below combat-grade under one of several cost-saving proposals under review by the Joint Programme Office.

Delays during the development stage caused Lockheed to deliver more than 108 aircraft with Block 2B software. Each fighter requires 150-160 modifications to be raised to the combat-rated Block 3 standard, says Vice Adm Matt Winter, the F-35’s programme executive.

The looming modification bills are threatening to suck resources from a looming production ramp-up with more than 900 aircraft projected for delivery over the next five years, Winter says....."

https://www.flightglobal.com/news/artic ... et-441248/

Gotta love that Concurrency model until the bill comes due and bites you in the a--
Offline

SpudmanWP

Elite 3K

Elite 3K

  • Posts: 6975
  • Joined: 12 Oct 2006, 19:18
  • Location: California

Unread post19 Sep 2017, 01:16

They knew it was coming and this is just one of many proposals to deal with the budget realities in the sequestration age we live in now that did not exist when the program started.
"The early bird gets the worm but the second mouse gets the cheese."
Offline
User avatar

spazsinbad

Elite 3K

Elite 3K

  • Posts: 19391
  • Joined: 05 May 2009, 21:31
  • Location: ɐıןɐɹʇsn∀¯\_(ツ)_/¯
  • Warnings: -2

Unread post19 Sep 2017, 01:19

And the rest of it says (not knowing what the bill will be - but hey - FUD works since the beginning in the garden of Eden.
"...“We’re looking at solution spaces to give our warfighters options,” Winter says. [Yeah BABY!]

One of those options is to keep a subset of the F-35 fleet at the Block 2B software standard. It would follow a practice used on the Lockheed F-22 programme, which has about 30 fighters maintained at Block 20 for training missions and about 150 fighters using the go-to-war Block 30/35 standard." [any complaints about that?]
RAN FAA A4G Skyhawk 1970s: https://www.faaaa.asn.au/spazsinbad-a4g/ AND https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCwqC_s6gcCVvG7NOge3qfAQ/
Offline

quicksilver

Elite 1K

Elite 1K

  • Posts: 1928
  • Joined: 16 Feb 2011, 01:30

Unread post19 Sep 2017, 01:19

So what is the Navy/Boeing excuse for the 120+ non viable SHs parked on the fence somewhere (for life-limited parts and Block I shortcomings)?
Offline

quicksilver

Elite 1K

Elite 1K

  • Posts: 1928
  • Joined: 16 Feb 2011, 01:30

Unread post19 Sep 2017, 01:38

The reality is that there are always aircraft 'left behind' so-to-speak. It was/is not different in the Hornet program, the SH program, the Raptor program or the Viper program. In this case, the characterization of Block 2B/3i jets as not combat-capable is -- as the USG has pointed out given USMC and USAF IOCs with those jets -- false.
Offline
User avatar

neptune

Elite 2K

Elite 2K

  • Posts: 2616
  • Joined: 24 Oct 2008, 00:03
  • Location: Houston

Unread post19 Sep 2017, 01:50

maus92 wrote:US considers non-combat-rated subset of F-35 fleet
18 SEPTEMBER, 2017 SOURCE: FLIGHTGLOBAL.COM BY: STEPHEN TRIMBLE WASHINGTON DC

"Scores of US-owned Lockheed Martin F-35s would remain in the fleet with a software operating system rated below combat-grade under one of several cost-saving proposals under review by the Joint Programme Office....


...not to rain on a parade but....those seem to be in training programs.. and the head JPO guy said they may "never" need to be upgraded as the trainees move to the active units that have the a/c with the latest revisions. I think they may be similar to the Block 20 F-22s....or not??
:)
Offline

marauder2048

Active Member

Active Member

  • Posts: 187
  • Joined: 14 Mar 2012, 06:46

Unread post19 Sep 2017, 02:47

US considers non-combat-rated subset of F-35 fleet
18 SEPTEMBE, 2017 SOURCE: FLIGHTGLOBAL.COM BY: STEPHEN TRIMBLE WASHINGTON DC

"Scores of US-owned Lockheed Martin F-35s would remain in the fleet with a software operating system rated below combat-grade under one of several cost-saving proposals under review by the Joint Programme Office....



Where's the news here? Winter's account is even substantially less detailed than Harris' testimony from Feb.
Offline

maus92

Elite 2K

Elite 2K

  • Posts: 2031
  • Joined: 21 May 2010, 17:50
  • Location: Annapolis, MD

Unread post20 Sep 2017, 19:54

quicksilver wrote:So what is the Navy/Boeing excuse for the 120+ non viable SHs parked on the fence somewhere (for life-limited parts and Block I shortcomings)?


Seems to me that those aircraft were actually used in operations.
Offline

maus92

Elite 2K

Elite 2K

  • Posts: 2031
  • Joined: 21 May 2010, 17:50
  • Location: Annapolis, MD

Unread post20 Sep 2017, 20:09

neptune wrote:
maus92 wrote:US considers non-combat-rated subset of F-35 fleet
18 SEPTEMBER, 2017 SOURCE: FLIGHTGLOBAL.COM BY: STEPHEN TRIMBLE WASHINGTON DC

"Scores of US-owned Lockheed Martin F-35s would remain in the fleet with a software operating system rated below combat-grade under one of several cost-saving proposals under review by the Joint Programme Office....


...not to rain on a parade but....those seem to be in training programs.. and the head JPO guy said they may "never" need to be upgraded as the trainees move to the active units that have the a/c with the latest revisions. I think they may be similar to the Block 20 F-22s....or not??
:)


The concurrency model used by the program to justify building a number of jets pre-IOC / while still in development assumed that early block jets would have deficiencies that would need correction - but they would become fully operational / combat coded aircraft. But the complexity / expense of the needed modifications is now driving the consideration that maybe this is not a wise use of limited funding. The concurrency / aircraft modifications needed is more than upgrading the ICP to handle Block 3F software - a number of these jets will require depot level disassembly to correct known structural deficiencies and other system modifications. An eventuality that was foreseen, but discounted. Hubris strikes again.
Offline

SpudmanWP

Elite 3K

Elite 3K

  • Posts: 6975
  • Joined: 12 Oct 2006, 19:18
  • Location: California

Unread post20 Sep 2017, 20:27

Concurrency (93%) & Block 3i update packages (99%) have already been paid for. It's more likely a manpower issue at this point as they ramp-up 3F production.
"The early bird gets the worm but the second mouse gets the cheese."
Offline
User avatar

spazsinbad

Elite 3K

Elite 3K

  • Posts: 19391
  • Joined: 05 May 2009, 21:31
  • Location: ɐıןɐɹʇsn∀¯\_(ツ)_/¯
  • Warnings: -2

Unread post22 Sep 2017, 22:13

Valerie has a go - bit late though?
Some F-35s could remain without fully combat-capable software
22 Sep 2017 Valerie Insinna

"NATIONAL HARBOR, Md. — The Defense Department is considering a plan that would keep about one hundred F-35s in an earlier software configuration not optimized for combat.

According to a FlightGlobal report, Lockheed Martin delivered about 108 aircraft in a 2B software configuration during the early stages of the program, Vice. Adm. Mat Winter, head of the F-35 joint program office, said Monday. It would take at least 150 modifications to bring each jet up to the 3F software standard associated with full combat capability.

The JPO is conducting a business case analysis to see whether it would be worth conducting the modifications or if that money would be better spent ramping up production and further modernizing the Block 3 jets. That could [nice] mean that a portion of the F-35 fleet will never be fit for combat, and could instead be used for testing or training.

Air Force Chief of Staff Gen. David Goldfein downplayed the situation, telling reporters at the Air Force Association annual conference that the service has had similar conversations in the past about other fighter jets.

“What you’re going to see is us continue to do a business case analysis of the cost to retrofit the older aircraft as we go forward. This is not a big dialogue,” he said Sept. 19. “We have actually had this dialogue with the F-16, we had this dialogue with the F-15, we had this dialogue with the F-22. We just haven’t had it for a while.”...

...Goldfein added that he would be engaged with others who are purchasing the F-35, such as his Marine Corps and Navy counterparts on the joint staff and international air chiefs, on how best to move forward...."

Source: http://www.defensenews.com/digital-show ... -software/
RAN FAA A4G Skyhawk 1970s: https://www.faaaa.asn.au/spazsinbad-a4g/ AND https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCwqC_s6gcCVvG7NOge3qfAQ/
Offline
User avatar

spazsinbad

Elite 3K

Elite 3K

  • Posts: 19391
  • Joined: 05 May 2009, 21:31
  • Location: ɐıןɐɹʇsn∀¯\_(ツ)_/¯
  • Warnings: -2

Unread post26 Sep 2017, 20:51

Page Seven of this thread has an 'agile software development' story from 'zerion' for the F-35 so this story plonked here....

viewtopic.php?f=62&t=52626&p=375749&hilit=agile#p375749
F-35’s ‘special sauce’: Air Force developing software sustainment for jet
26 Sep 2017 Mark Pomerleau

"As almost everything in today’s commercial and military world is underpinned by some type of software capability, the sustainment of that software is of critical national security importance. The services around the military are beginning to take internal looks at how they do software sustainment from an organic standpoint either at depots — which traditionally focused on hardware and platform maintenance — or software sustainment centers.

One recent example is the organic software sustainment capability the Air Force is standing up at the Air Force Sustainment Center for the F-35 fighter jet. The F-35 Joint Program Office assigned the Air Force nine software workloads for the F-35, and gave nine to the Navy....

...“The power of the F-35, it’s great that it has low observables, a great engine. But what really makes it powerful is the software,” he said. [Lt. Gen. Lee Levy, commander of the Air Force Sustainment Center] “The software in the F-35 is really the special sauce. … How we take care of that software over time is really important.” While Air Force software sustainment is generally 60 percent cheaper than industry, said Levy, adding that cost wasn’t the main driver behind developing an organic software sustainment capability for the F-35....

...“In an Iron-Age Air Force, we bend mental. In an information-age Air Force, fifth- and sixth-generation Air Force, we bend ones and zeros,” Levy added. “Our ability to bend ones and zeros rapidly will be a decisive advantage in imposing our will against an adversary and not allowing them to impose their will against us.”

This ability to wield ones and zeros as he put it, will allow the force to rapidly fix flaws or vulnerabilities discovered. As soon as the F-35 is turned on, it immediately connects to the network necessitating the ability to quickly fix vulnerabilities...."

Source: https://www.c4isrnet.com/it-networks/20 ... t-for-jet/
RAN FAA A4G Skyhawk 1970s: https://www.faaaa.asn.au/spazsinbad-a4g/ AND https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCwqC_s6gcCVvG7NOge3qfAQ/
Offline

markithere

Enthusiast

Enthusiast

  • Posts: 45
  • Joined: 25 Mar 2009, 17:26

Unread post26 Sep 2017, 21:16

I do not think passing on converting 108 aircraft to 3F is wise. If the cost of conversion is 10 million that is far less than buying a new one for 80 or more million. I see the option of not converting as stupid and wasteful on a scale that boggles the mind. I'd rather spend 10 million for a 3F plane than many millions more for one built to 3F from the start. Think of it this way. I have 2 planes one will cost you 10 million and the other will cost you 80 million. In every way important they are identical. Do you spend 80 million or the bargin of 10 million?
Offline
User avatar

neptune

Elite 2K

Elite 2K

  • Posts: 2616
  • Joined: 24 Oct 2008, 00:03
  • Location: Houston

Unread post26 Sep 2017, 23:11

http://www.defensenews.com/air/2017/09/ ... this-year/

F-35 program office to finish tests of key weapon this year

By: Valerie Insinna

WASHINGTON —
By the end of the year, the F-35 program office will wrap up testing of a key munition that will allow U.S. Air Force F-35A jets to hit moving targets, the Pentagon’s F-35 program head said Sept. 18. The director of the Air Force’s F-35 integration office told Defense News in February that the service hoped to integrate Raytheon’s GBU-49 munition into the “A” model’s weapons load out in time for full combat capability. Without it, the service would be left dependent on a range of munitions without “lead laser capability,” which allows the weapon to calculate the path of a moving target. GBU-49 has that ability built into its front end, while the F-35’s other munitions require that a pilot estimate where a target will move and aim there.

In an exclusive interview last week at the Air Force Association’s annual conference, Vice Adm. Mat Winter, head of the F-35 joint program office, that the effort is coming along quickly. The Air Force’s F-35A is now able to carry the GBU-49 as long as it has 3F software, and the JPO has proven the jet can safely and accurately drop the bomb through weapons delivery tests, he said. “We have done fit checks, we have done all of the other integration, all of the normal weapons integration — form, fit, function — of GBU-49 on the F-35A. And that was a collaborative effort of industry and the government together, which is a good news story,” Winter said.

The aircraft’s most recent software iteration does not include specific interfaces for the munition. However, that will change at the end of the month, when the JPO begins rolling out a software update, termed 3FR6.3, to A-model jets used for developmental and operational tests. “What it does is it provides the appropriate displays and information,” Winter said. “Right now, when you carry a GBU-49, it shows GBU-12 in the cockpit” because the weapons are basically the same in terms of size, weight and flight characteristics. “Now the software will provide GBU-49 indications and the airplane knows it’s a [GBU-]49, that way you know you’re probably going against a moving target,” he added. Once the new software is installed on developmental and operational test jets, the JPO will spend several months validating it through a series of flight tests. When that evaluation is complete — sometime in December for the F-35A, Winter said — the program office’s GBU-49 integration effort will be complete. It may take months for the Air Force to roll out that software update to its operational fleet, which is just now starting to accept 3F jets. “That doesn’t mean I couldn’t put GBU on an airplane if we had to do something right now. Because we could do that,” said Winter, who reiterated that should the F-35A be called to combat, it could drop the GBU-49 as long as it has 3F software.

Rather, the software update means that “full flight clearance [is] done, tie it with a bow, out the door,” he explained. During a February interview, Brig. Gen. Scott Pleus, then director of the Air Force’s F-35 integration office, said the F-35’s ability to hit moving targets would become vitally important as the joint strike fighter moves from its development phase to operational use. “The ability to hit a moving target is a key capability that we need in current close-air support fight, and the GBU-49 is a great solution for the F-35 and, frankly, for all of our legacy platforms to hit these moving targets,” he said. When the F-35’s requirements were first formed, the Defense Department intended for the joint strike fighter to drop cluster munitions to be able to hit moving targets. However, the U.S. military has stopped employing cluster munitions due to concern from human rights organizations, and the F-35’s electro-optical infrared system will not be upgraded with a lead-laser capability until follow-on modernization starts in the early 2020s.
:)
Offline
User avatar

jetblast16

Senior member

Senior member

  • Posts: 387
  • Joined: 23 Aug 2004, 00:12
  • Location: USA

Unread post27 Sep 2017, 00:48

“In an Iron-Age Air Force, we bend mental.

Bend mental, huh? I'd like to see that :roll:

it immediately connects to the network necessitating the ability to quickly fix vulnerabilities....

Windows Update lol?
Bringing BLAST since 2004...(In my opinion)
PreviousNext

Return to F-35 Avionics

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 2 guests