F-35B Crashes, Reportedly After Mid-Air w Tanker

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quicksilver

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Unread post30 Sep 2020, 04:21

https://abcnews.go.com/US/marine-35-jet ... d=73325534

Saving grace, no reported fatalities.
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spazsinbad

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Unread post30 Sep 2020, 04:52

Marine F-35B Crashes After Collision With KC-130 Over California; All Aircrew Recovered Safely
29 Sep 2020 Sam LaGrone

"A Marine F-35B aircraft has crashed near Naval Air Facility El Centro, Calif., following an air collision with a KC-130J, defense officials confirmed to USNI News.

At approximately 4 p.m. local time, “it was reported that an F-35B made contact with a KC-130J during an air-to-air refueling evolution, resulting in the crash of the F-35B. The pilot of the F-35B ejected successfully and is currently being treated,” read a statement from Marine Corps spokesman Capt. Joseph Butterfield to USNI News. “The KC-130J is on deck in the vicinity of Thermal Airport. All crew members of the KC-130J have been reported safe.”..."

[Looks like outboard & inboard STBD props broken but when?]

Photo: "A Marine KC-130 crash lands in California Sept. 29, 2020." https://news.usni.org/wp-content/upload ... .16-PM.png


Source: https://news.usni.org/2020/09/29/marine ... red-safely


PHOTO: https://www.thedrive.com/content/2020/0 ... rJ7Tqs.jpg
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Screen-Shot-2020-09-29-at-11_01_16-PM.jpg
F-35BarfKC-130overhead.jpg
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hornetfinn

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Unread post30 Sep 2020, 09:30

Sounds like it's time for fully automated air-to-air refueling systems. I know these have been studied and are being developed and I'm sure they could be very useful and safer. Of course I don't know if that kind of system would've helped here, but in general it should help reducing accidents significantly and be faster.
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Unread post30 Sep 2020, 09:32

Fuel? leaking from port wing & two starboard props missing: https://cimg7.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune.org ... a34e0f.jpg
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screenshot_2020_09_30_at_07_39_08_2_b81a4b570080c6184a0577089947eb6821a34e0f.jpg
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Unread post30 Sep 2020, 10:43

More at the more more with an audio recording: https://www.thedrive.com/the-war-zone/3 ... h-an-f-35b

AUDIO: https://forums.liveatc.net/index.php?ac ... tach=10767 (MP3 file attached below)
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RAIDER 50.mp3 [ 2.03 MiB | Viewed 14258 times ]

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madrat

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Unread post30 Sep 2020, 12:51

Sounds like the pilot had balls of steel in the emergency. Great job.
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boilermaker

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Unread post30 Sep 2020, 12:59

spazsinbad wrote:Fuel? leaking from port wing & two starboard props missing: https://cimg7.ibsrv.net/gimg/pprune.org ... a34e0f.jpg



Audio reported a fuel leak



Did he land with gear up? Or down? Why , why not?
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Unread post30 Sep 2020, 13:22

By now you should be aware there are very few details about this accident. Sure we can guess and guess and guess. Is that what you require? What happened in the air? All we know is what the pilot said and the result on the ground. Why guess?
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weasel1962

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Unread post30 Sep 2020, 14:01

4th class A for the Bee on my books. 2nd to crash.
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hornetfinn

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Unread post30 Sep 2020, 14:32

Nice video about how learning to refuel F-35B in the air:


It's definitely not that easy and there are some problems starting at 3:40. The jet is hit by the drogue and suffers some scratches due to it. Of course in this F-35 crash something much more serious happened and it will be interesting to know what really happened.
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Unread post30 Sep 2020, 14:55

In a fast jet, it’s really really hard to run into a tanker’s wings or engines, day, vfr while plugging or while taking on JP; in my experience, I’ve never even heard of such a thing. Thus, other circumstances surrounding the evolution, but not captured by the reporting, are in my mind most likely causal.
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Unread post30 Sep 2020, 15:34

In a fast jet, it’s really really hard to run into a tanker’s wings or engines, day, vfr while plugging or while taking on JP


Agreed, but I have seen one close call with lead maneuvering a four-ship in a turn and the 135 not having completed his rendezvous turn in front of the receivers....but that was at night.

Do any of the reports confirm this occurred while plugged? I missed that.

edit: BTW, why do they call it a refueling "evolution" ? Never heard that.
Last edited by outlaw162 on 30 Sep 2020, 15:38, edited 3 times in total.
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sprstdlyscottsmn

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Unread post30 Sep 2020, 15:37

that's what I was thinking too. The damage to the C-130 is odd.
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steve2267

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Unread post30 Sep 2020, 16:10

One story stated "an aircraft was fully engulfed in flames" prior to hitting the ground and exploding. The audio above has one one aircraft reporting the black plume of smoke from the ground appeared prior to Raider-50 (the KC-130J) making it's mayday call.

Driving an F-35B through the starboard side props is one way to slice up a Lightning and would explain a pre-impact fire. But the outer portside props are missing their tips (or they are curled back). And the portside refueling pod is MIA. (I thought at first the stream from the port wing was from a stuck-open fuel dump valve.)

Damage to the Herky bird evident in the photos above would explain Raider-50's call that they "still had partial control for now" (or words to that effect). Good job getting the tanker on the ground.
Take an F-16, stir in A-7, dollop of F-117, gob of F-22, dash of F/A-18, sprinkle with AV-8B, stir well + bake. Whaddya get? F-35.
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Unread post30 Sep 2020, 16:16

I am reminded of the infamous F-104 <-> XB-70 crash where the Starfighter rolled over the Valkerie, evidently due to the wing tip vortices of the bomber.

For those of you who have tanked behind a KC-130... are it's wingtip vortices strong enough to flip over a fast mover?
Take an F-16, stir in A-7, dollop of F-117, gob of F-22, dash of F/A-18, sprinkle with AV-8B, stir well + bake. Whaddya get? F-35.
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