USAF F-35B Pilots Go to Sea with VMFA-122

Unread postPosted: 04 Nov 2019, 22:12
by quicksilver

Re: USAF F-35B Pilots Go to Sea with VMFA-122

Unread postPosted: 05 Nov 2019, 00:16
by spazsinbad
I wonder what happened with the RAAF F-35B exchange pilot promised by LtGen 'Dog' Davis USMC a few years ago now.

Re: USAF F-35B Pilots Go to Sea with VMFA-122

Unread postPosted: 05 Nov 2019, 00:47
by Corsair1963
Honestly, what so special about this??? As exchange duty between the services and even foreign militaries is fairly common.....

Re: USAF F-35B Pilots Go to Sea with VMFA-122

Unread postPosted: 05 Nov 2019, 01:03
by quicksilver
Corsair1963 wrote:Honestly, what so special about this??? As exchange duty between the services and even foreign militaries is fairly common.....


Common? USAF exchange pilots are rare animals in USMC STOVL community. IIRC not since early AV-8A, ie the 70s, and maybe going back to the Kestrel evaluation in the 60s.

Re: USAF F-35B Pilots Go to Sea with VMFA-122

Unread postPosted: 05 Nov 2019, 02:38
by sferrin
I wonder if the USAF will ever end up with some Bs.

Re: USAF F-35B Pilots Go to Sea with VMFA-122

Unread postPosted: 05 Nov 2019, 03:44
by Corsair1963
quicksilver wrote:
Corsair1963 wrote:Honestly, what so special about this??? As exchange duty between the services and even foreign militaries is fairly common.....


Common? USAF exchange pilots are rare animals in USMC STOVL community. IIRC not since early AV-8A, ie the 70s, and maybe going back to the Kestrel evaluation in the 60s.



I was of course talking in "general terms". As exchange pilot assignments happen all of the time...


For example before Lt. Col. David "Chip" Berke (Ret) was the CO of F-35B Squadron (VMFAT-501). He flew as an exchange pilot with the USAF on F-22A's.

Re: USAF F-35B Pilots Go to Sea with VMFA-122

Unread postPosted: 05 Nov 2019, 03:46
by Corsair1963
sferrin wrote:I wonder if the USAF will ever end up with some Bs.



Short-term no long-term possible........

Re: USAF F-35B Pilots Go to Sea with VMFA-122

Unread postPosted: 05 Nov 2019, 03:57
by quicksilver
Corsair1963 wrote:
quicksilver wrote:
Corsair1963 wrote:Honestly, what so special about this??? As exchange duty between the services and even foreign militaries is fairly common.....


Common? USAF exchange pilots are rare animals in USMC STOVL community. IIRC not since early AV-8A, ie the 70s, and maybe going back to the Kestrel evaluation in the 60s.



I was of course talking in "general terms". As exchange pilot assignments happen all of the time...


For example before Lt. Col. David "Chip" Berke (Ret) was the CO of F-35B Squadron (VMFAT-501). He flew as an exchange pilot with the USAF on F-22A's.


Thanks for the insight.

Re: USAF F-35B Pilots Go to Sea with VMFA-122

Unread postPosted: 05 Nov 2019, 04:47
by outlaw162
Are we saying here the USAF is discerning....or reluctant? :D

Re: USAF F-35B Pilots Go to Sea with VMFA-122

Unread postPosted: 05 Nov 2019, 04:56
by quicksilver
Blue suiter killed in an RAF GR1 in 1971; probably the latter.

Re: USAF F-35B Pilots Go to Sea with VMFA-122

Unread postPosted: 05 Nov 2019, 05:11
by outlaw162
https://aviation-safety.net/wikibase/wiki.php?id=55593

Doesn't seem like it had anything to do with the pilot being USAF.

Re: USAF F-35B Pilots Go to Sea with VMFA-122

Unread postPosted: 05 Nov 2019, 05:12
by spazsinbad
Couldn't be done it seems (not surprising given the complete lack of interest by the RAAF most likely): PEP/TED TALK?
Personnel Exchange Program (PEP)

"The Marine Corps Foreign Personnel Exchange Program (MCFPEP) is a means of continuing a long-term, selectively visible presence and association among military counterparts to enhance worldwide security cooperation...."

--------- Country ---------------- Billet

------------------- Australia
-------------------- ARH Tiger Exchange
-------------------- F/A-18 Pilot Exchange
-------------------- F-35 Maintenance Officer Exchange
-------------------- Air Support Control Officer Exchange...."

Source: https://www.aviation.marines.mil/Branch ... -Exchange/

Re: USAF F-35B Pilots Go to Sea with VMFA-122

Unread postPosted: 05 Nov 2019, 06:42
by Corsair1963
Remember, this......


Finnish fighter pilot lands on US aircraft carrier

https://www.marinecorpstimes.com/news/y ... carrier-2/

Re: USAF F-35B Pilots Go to Sea with VMFA-122

Unread postPosted: 05 Nov 2019, 08:19
by spazsinbad
RAAF Hornet Exchange Pilots with USMC / USMC Hornet Pilots Flying with RAAF Hornets - neither fly from any carriers. Specifically RAAF Hornet Pilots flying with USMC Squadrons DO NOT fly from carriers so I guess they are not doing so now.

Re: USAF F-35B Pilots Go to Sea with VMFA-122

Unread postPosted: 05 Nov 2019, 11:32
by quicksilver
outlaw162 wrote:https://aviation-safety.net/wikibase/wiki.php?id=55593

Doesn't seem like it had anything to do with the pilot being USAF.


Has a blue suiter flown an operational Harrier anywhere in the world since then? Not a DT or OT guy; on an operational exchange?

‘Reluctant’ I’d say. Not without justification, but ‘reluctant‘ nonetheless.

Re: USAF F-35B Pilots Go to Sea with VMFA-122

Unread postPosted: 05 Nov 2019, 14:57
by XanderCrews
Corsair1963 wrote:Honestly, what so special about this??? As exchange duty between the services and even foreign militaries is fairly common.....



Harriers are not easy to fly and very unique. Most USMC pilots are a literally a rank above their peers because their flight training takes longer. So Harrier pilots tend to have higher rank since they've been in longer before they finally arrive at their operational squadron.

Even well trained harrier pilots have a hard time taming the beast. so its like having a F-15 pilot go fly a helicopter. Youre basically starting from scratch.

Image

Re: USAF F-35B Pilots Go to Sea with VMFA-122

Unread postPosted: 05 Nov 2019, 15:20
by quicksilver
Bringing it back to F-35B, the significance is that the USAF has established a first-time exchange in the STOVL world. To my knowledge, they haven’t done that anywhere on the planet since the 70s.

IMO, that is testament to the degree of simplicity (and consequential safety) inherent in the F-35B control laws and pilot mechanization/PVI. Think about being those guys — you’re one of few pilots in your entire service who have ever landed a jet on ship, and one of only two who have ever done so on an amphib...as an O-3, no less. That’s very cool.

I’d sign up for that duty. 8)

Here’s where we talked about it before. This gent must still be in training — viewtopic.php?t=53757

Do I think the USAF would buy Bs? No.

Re: USAF F-35B Pilots Go to Sea with VMFA-122

Unread postPosted: 05 Nov 2019, 17:12
by XanderCrews
quicksilver wrote:Bringing it back to F-35B, the significance is that the USAF has established a first-time exchange in the STOVL world. To my knowledge, they haven’t done that anywhere on the planet since the 70s.

IMO, that is testament to the degree of simplicity (and consequential safety) inherent in the F-35B control laws and pilot mechanization/PVI. Think about being those guys — you’re one of few pilots in your entire service who have ever landed a jet on ship, and one of only two who have ever done so on an amphib...as an O-3, no less. That’s very cool.

I’d sign up for that duty. 8)

Here’s where we talked about it before. This gent must still be in training — viewtopic.php?t=53757

Do I think the USAF would buy Bs? No.


I don't think the USAF will buy B's but the big "STOVL revolution" with the B, compared to the harrier, is that you have "accessible STOVL" as you point out, its not a huge amount of specialization and risk involved. so we have some people who may have not considered STOVL actually taking a hard look at it, and some actually going for it.