USMC USAF Chiefs Hold 1st Meeting Since 2011 Coordinate F-35

Variants for different customers or mission profiles
  • Author
  • Message
Offline
User avatar

spazsinbad

Elite 3K

Elite 3K

  • Posts: 20886
  • Joined: 05 May 2009, 21:31
  • Location: ɐıןɐɹʇsn∀¯\_(ツ)_/¯
  • Warnings: -2

Unread post30 Mar 2018, 08:36

Marine Corps, Air Force Service Chiefs Hold First Meeting Since 2011; Plan to Coordinate on F-35, Air Defense Threats
29 Mar 2018 Megan Eckstein

"The Marine Corps and Air Force service chiefs met this week in the first top-level meeting between the services since 2011, in the first step towards developing a closer bond between the services perhaps least likely to work together.

The Marine Corps connects three-star leadership to the Army through a reinvigorated Army-Marine Corps Board, with a similar three-star Naval Board and other mechanisms to ensure interoperability with its sister service under the same Department of the Navy umbrella. But there are fewer avenues to coordinate with the Air Force – and in many cases, less need to do so.

However, Commandant of the Marine Corps Gen. Robert Neller said today that “the meeting we had yesterday with the Air Force was the first time we’ve met since 2011. So one of the first things we decided is we’re not going to wait seven more years to do this again. In fact, we’re probably going to come up with some sort of staff-level board quarterly where we’ll meet and talk about some of the common things that we discussed yesterday,” he said of his meeting with Air Force Chief of Staff Gen. David Goldfein.

Obviously the F-35 is one thing where we have a common focus on the price point of that airplane, the sustainability of that airplane, the logistics of that airplane, and we kind of went from there. So we talked everything from space to cyber to close air support to command and control to security of bases and stations. And so it was a really good day,” Neller said. “I think a lot of times you sit down with somebody that, you might think we don’t have a lot in common with the Air Force, but we filled the time and we could have spent more time there. So we’re going to get together on a more regular basis to try to address some of these things.”..."

Photo: "An F-35B Lightning II assigned to the “Avengers” of Marine Fighter Attack Squadron (VMFA) 211 sits [STOs] on the flight deck of the Wasp-class amphibious assault ship USS Essex (LHD 2) on March 7, 2018. US Navy Photo" https://news.usni.org/wp-content/upload ... 63-092.jpg



Source: https://news.usni.org/2018/03/29/marine ... se-threats
Attachments
F-35BstoESSEX07mar2018.jpg
RAN FAA A4G Skyhawk 1970s: https://www.faaaa.asn.au/spazsinbad-a4g/ AND https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCwqC_s6gcCVvG7NOge3qfAQ/
Offline

lrrpf52

Active Member

Active Member

  • Posts: 140
  • Joined: 29 Mar 2018, 01:52

Unread post12 Apr 2018, 22:19

Next thing you'll tell me is that USAF will learn more about how USMC does CAS. This is a great development.

A little intro:

I'm an Air Force brat of sorts who grew up immersed in developmental programs of the 1970s and 1980s, mostly at Edwards AFFTC, West Germany, and a little time at Hill AFB. Dad worked on RDT&E avionics and weapons systems engineering mostly, starting with the Rocket Lab, then AFFTC test range telemetry data, did an international exchange with the NATO partners on initial engineering work for what would become the Euro Fighter, came back to Edwards to work on B-1B CTF, SRAM II, test range at Hill, F-16C AIFF program with Ball Aerospace, F-15E CTF, then retired from Global Hawk CTF.

I joined the Army as an Infantryman, did a lot of time in various reconnaissance units, deployed to PACOM, SOUTHCOM, CENTCOM, and EURCOM. Have some experience calling in CAS from -16Cs in Korea and A-10As. Worked in units where CSAR was one of our secondary mission profiles, while deep penetration and reconnaissance were primary.

It's not hard to imagine in the environment I was raised in that I'm a huge military aviation buff.

I've been following the conceptual impetus, development, testing, and progress of the JSF like a roller coaster ride, along with the ATF, and recall volumes of pubs on the conceptual phase of development when I was a kid, along with all the Aviation Leak articles and artists' concepts. I still vividly recall how they were emphasizing LO, internal weapons carriage, unprecedented futuristic glass cockpits, helmet displays, and net-centric connectivity with other systems.

I think this article really points to one area of how game-changing the jet is, when you have USAF and USMC working on production models from the same combat aircraft program. Having worked with the USMC and USAF, and noting the different cultures, it will be interesting to see how the cross-pollination works between those organizations, especially as the USAF former F-15C guys share insights on the air dominance mission, and USMC shares their insights on the CAS mission, while both exploit capabilities in the Electronic Attack, ES, interdiction, escort, and AWACS roles.

This is exciting. Biggest thing I've seen when things like this happen is how personalities harmonize. You can have really great momentum going, and then if the wrong personalities get involved, it can ruin opportunities that would have benefitted both organizations. Saw that a bit in Millennium Challenge working in the combined forces components.
Offline

SnakeHandler

Forum Veteran

Forum Veteran

  • Posts: 718
  • Joined: 01 Jul 2007, 18:22

Unread post12 Apr 2018, 22:51

CAS is already codified in JP 3-09.3. CAS is not an airplane, it's a working relationship and trust between the JTAC and the pilot.
Offline

lrrpf52

Active Member

Active Member

  • Posts: 140
  • Joined: 29 Mar 2018, 01:52

Unread post12 Apr 2018, 23:48

SnakeHandler wrote:CAS is already codified in JP 3-09.3. CAS is not an airplane, it's a working relationship and trust between the JTAC and the pilot.

Copy that. I see the enhanced SA and sensor suite of the F-35, plus the F-35's ability to get on station faster, and the ability to truly do all weather as big leaps in the CAS mission set.

Especially with BFT and the F-35 pilot's perspective fused in the HMS, it will make deconflicting and getting munitions on-target happen quicker than any legacy system.

The pilots will have friendly boxes on TIC, while the TIC can designate ground threats accordingly.

Even using toss profile with SDB, they can provide a very capable offensive support with minimal collateral effects. It will be very interesting to see how the USMC in particular evolves their capabilities with the B and C models, and how that will affect the rest of the Land Component Forces.

I see a lot of potential from the systemic, net-centric, "broad horizons" approach of the F-35 having fundamental long-term effects on the way the entire military goes about training, planning, and execution of warfare. The more people are exposed to what it can do, the more they are going to want to have similar technology for interoperability.
Online
User avatar

popcorn

Elite 3K

Elite 3K

  • Posts: 7253
  • Joined: 24 Sep 2008, 08:55

Unread post13 Apr 2018, 00:19

Welcome to the boards lrrpf52. The AF and Marines have been impressed with the capabilities of DARPA's PCAS in exercises going back several years. Ideally CAS should be platform-agnostic and the F-35 should fit right in. If you wish you can search on PCAS discussions on the forum using "search".



"When a fifth-generation fighter meets a fourth-generation fighter—the [latter] dies,”
CSAF Gen. Mark Welsh
Offline

lrrpf52

Active Member

Active Member

  • Posts: 140
  • Joined: 29 Mar 2018, 01:52

Unread post13 Apr 2018, 00:38

popcorn wrote:Welcome to the boards lrrpf52. The AF and Marines have been impressed with the capabilities of DARPA's PCAS in exercises going back several years. Ideally CAS should be platform-agnostic and the F-35 should fit right in. If you wish you can search on PCAS discussions on the forum using "search".

Thanks for that. I've seen that video before, but it's a good refresher.

I was in a unit where we tested a more mature version of Land Warrior for the Airborne Land Warrior program, "Airborne" meaning paratrooper.

The system included a small Helmet-Mounted Display, a ruggedized mouse pad on the magazine well of the M4, a Laser Range Finder, Combat Camera, and a Digital Compass, all integrated into a small vest-worn computer/GPS/radio.

Image

You could polar plot with that system without even breaking voice comms, and do that on an integrated Joint Fires network that was serviced by C3 nodes you were linked to.

There was a "Fires" header in the tiny Helmet-Mounted Display that you could go to with the cursor, and call for fire using different methods, but polar plot with the LRF was nice. I think the LRF size was limited for range, which is why we still see JTACs using tripod-mounted systems similar to SOFLAM. LRFs have come a long way though, getting much smaller and more capable with better stability and accuracy.

Blue Force Tracker came around after that.
Online
User avatar

popcorn

Elite 3K

Elite 3K

  • Posts: 7253
  • Joined: 24 Sep 2008, 08:55

Unread post13 Apr 2018, 00:41

Appreciate the real life insights you and others who have served bring to these boards.
"When a fifth-generation fighter meets a fourth-generation fighter—the [latter] dies,”
CSAF Gen. Mark Welsh
Online

southernphantom

Elite 1K

Elite 1K

  • Posts: 1039
  • Joined: 06 Aug 2011, 17:18
  • Location: Kentucky

Unread post13 Apr 2018, 01:36

lrrpf52 wrote:
popcorn wrote:Welcome to the boards lrrpf52. The AF and Marines have been impressed with the capabilities of DARPA's PCAS in exercises going back several years. Ideally CAS should be platform-agnostic and the F-35 should fit right in. If you wish you can search on PCAS discussions on the forum using "search".

Thanks for that. I've seen that video before, but it's a good refresher.

I was in a unit where we tested a more mature version of Land Warrior for the Airborne Land Warrior program, "Airborne" meaning paratrooper.

The system included a small Helmet-Mounted Display, a ruggedized mouse pad on the magazine well of the M4, a Laser Range Finder, Combat Camera, and a Digital Compass, all integrated into a small vest-worn computer/GPS/radio.

Image

You could polar plot with that system without even breaking voice comms, and do that on an integrated Joint Fires network that was serviced by C3 nodes you were linked to.

There was a "Fires" header in the tiny Helmet-Mounted Display that you could go to with the cursor, and call for fire using different methods, but polar plot with the LRF was nice. I think the LRF size was limited for range, which is why we still see JTACs using tripod-mounted systems similar to SOFLAM. LRFs have come a long way though, getting much smaller and more capable with better stability and accuracy.

Blue Force Tracker came around after that.


Nice to see you come over to F-16 from ARFCOM! :cheers:
I'm a mining engineer. How the hell did I wind up here?

Return to F-35 Variants and Missions

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest