F-35 USAF Hypoxia Study 2018

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popcorn

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Unread post01 Feb 2018, 03:08

Lara posting from the future... :D
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"When a fifth-generation fighter meets a fourth-generation fighter—the [latter] dies,”
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Unread post01 Feb 2018, 03:10

Go back one page to my addition.... This bit was added and repeated here:
"...According to a recent Seligman 'milking the life out of an F-35 pilot quotes' article it seems some aircrew (probably from a foreign non-native English speaking country perhaps) are not trained well OR current training is not sufficient - who nose?"
RAN FAA A4G Skyhawk 1970s: https://www.faaaa.asn.au/spazsinbad-a4g/ AND https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCwqC_s6gcCVvG7NOge3qfAQ/
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rheonomic

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Unread post01 Feb 2018, 03:14

spazsinbad wrote::devil: I would ask you to read all the posts about this UPE/PE/OBOGS in this forum but then you'd have to kill me. :doh:

So without going to a lot of personal protection troubles I'll compromise and generalize that all high performance aircraft that use oxygen equipment - particularly/mostly in the military have over this long period of time many and various issues with all sorts of aeromedical problems related to oxygen or the lack thereof. That is why aircrew are trained in these specific aeromedical issues - some are replicated in chambers of death or with specific training equipment as used in USN.

According to a recent Seligman 'milking the life out of an F-35 pilot quotes' article it seems some aircrew (probably from a foreign non-native English speaking country perhaps) are not trained well OR current training is not sufficient - who nose?


Thanks for the quick summary. I'm pretty far removed from the life support side of things.
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Unread post01 Feb 2018, 03:27

Fair enough. In any fast miljet air arm aeromedical training should be thorough, conducted by aeromedical doctors and staff. Some really funny funny things can occur to aircrew in flight in different conditions. These have been referred to piecemeal here over the years. I recall a thread about using DAS at night to shoot (gun one presumes) down bogies. I have a lot of info in PDF format that may take time to assemble, there may be some PDFs in this forum. IIRC there is at least one about USN hypoxia and another about 'doc my neck hurts' etc. Spatial Disorientation are two buzzwords to search on.
RAN FAA A4G Skyhawk 1970s: https://www.faaaa.asn.au/spazsinbad-a4g/ AND https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCwqC_s6gcCVvG7NOge3qfAQ/
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Unread post01 Feb 2018, 03:31

spazsinbad wrote:I have a lot of info in PDF format that may take time to assemble, there may be some PDFs in this forum.


Please don't feel any need to do so on behalf on my earlier questions.
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Unread post01 Feb 2018, 03:50

Now hear this.... :roll: :doh: I do not do anything on this forum that does not interest me (in some threads I'm invisible).

There should be a 5.6Mb PDF about HYPOXIA somewhere on or about 22 Dec 2016. What I'm going to do is add more info about aeromedical INCLUDING SPATIAL DISORIENTATION that will add up to 11? Mbs - the file size limit here. Whatever.

The attached PDF: "These 150 pages are mostly historical information about HYPOXIA Incidents in the USN + information on Spatial Disorientation & G-loc & Neck Pain. Recent UPE/PE info NOT included." Collection of recent UPEs ongoing.

These PDF pages have been reprinted (PRN) this means any URL links are not there but the text of the string is there....
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Hypoxia&SpatialDisorientation&AeroMedical+Gtolerance+Neck PRN pp150.pdf
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RAN FAA A4G Skyhawk 1970s: https://www.faaaa.asn.au/spazsinbad-a4g/ AND https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCwqC_s6gcCVvG7NOge3qfAQ/
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Unread post01 Feb 2018, 18:41

spazsinbad wrote:Go back one page to my addition.... This bit was added and repeated here:
"...According to a recent Seligman 'milking the life out of an F-35 pilot quotes' article it seems some aircrew (probably from a foreign non-native English speaking country perhaps) are not trained well OR current training is not sufficient - who nose?"


That was my reaction as well. It was really a deliberately emotive article that overlooks the fact
that this was not an unexplained physiological event (OBOGS failure with ICAWS caution) and the
pilot did not stay on the backup oxygen supply; that your symptoms recur on the backup
is not-unexpected.

Of course, Seligman is not reporting on the Auto-CGAS addition which would be a highly relevant
bit of news since IMHO you will likely never solve all possible combinations of human physiology
and machine interface.
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Unread post08 Feb 2018, 21:38

FLABBERGASTED is my way of indicating I AM FLABBERGASTED at this piece of INFO - USAF maintenance NOT TRAINED....?
House Subcommittee Head Slams Air Force Over its Handling of Hypoxia Issues
07 Feb 2018 Steve Hirsch​

"​The Air Force's deputy chief of staff for operations told House legislators on Tuesday that maintenance likely is to blame for multiple hypoxia-like issues that forced the service to ground its T-6 trainer fleet earlier this month.

During his testimony before the House Armed Services Tactical Air and Land Forces Subcommittee, Lt. Gen. Mark Nowland also emphasized the importance of training, causing the subcommittee chairman to lit [does author mean "LIGHT" as in "remonstrate"?] into the service for not taking the threat seriously enough....

...Nowland said the T-6's onboard oxygenating systems appear to working properly, but "maintaining it is the critical factor.” He said the time-change technical order for the onboard oxygen-generating system does not exist, so the service has "never trained our technicians on how to maintain that piece of equipment." However, after flying the trainers for "2.1 million hours," the service suspects that maintenance is needed on that system, "but we don't know that for sure," he said.

Nowland noted that the service has increased funding for the 711th Human Performance Wing, which has supported research into hypoxia, biomechanics, and toxicology studies.... [along with others noted above]

...Nowland tried to reassure Turner that the Air Force is not blaming the pilots, while also defending what he called the Air Force’s “holistic” training and examination of maintenance issues...." [then some exchange on TRUST/TRAINING]

Source: http://www.airforcemag.com/Features/Pag ... ssues.aspx
RAN FAA A4G Skyhawk 1970s: https://www.faaaa.asn.au/spazsinbad-a4g/ AND https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCwqC_s6gcCVvG7NOge3qfAQ/
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Unread post11 Jan 2019, 13:06

This is what Finnish Air Force fighter pilots are currently using to avoid hypoxia problems:


https://www.instails.fi/en/products/ipbam.html
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Unread post11 Jan 2019, 13:26

I would guess the US know about these developments from a 'request' for info/proposals some time ago now - 2 page PDF:

https://www.instails.fi/media/materiaal ... onitor.pdf (1Mb)
RAN FAA A4G Skyhawk 1970s: https://www.faaaa.asn.au/spazsinbad-a4g/ AND https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCwqC_s6gcCVvG7NOge3qfAQ/
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Unread post07 Apr 2019, 22:41

This article is about OBOGS for 'fighters' however it does have info on F-35 'OBOGS Fixes' so it is plonked here. OK?
Navy Rules Out Suspected Physiological Episodes Cause While Super Hornet Rates Grow in 2019
04 Apr 2019 Megan Eckstein

"CAPITOL HILL — The Navy has ruled out breathing air contamination as a cause of physiological episodes, but a complex set of conditions – including both cabin pressure issues and human factors – has led to the rates of pilots experiencing PEs this current fiscal year being back on the rise.

Though the service has not yet pinpointed a cause – and likely won’t ever find a single root cause – other gases or contaminants have not been found in breathing air coming from the jets’ Onboard Oxygen Generation System (OBOGS), the Navy said in a little-publicized news release this week.

Despite that progress in ruling out a major factor – and one that was widely blamed for PEs early on when rates among pilots began increasing sharply – two admirals today told lawmakers that there is still much work to be done in stopping the episodes, which can lead to pilots experiencing symptoms of tingly fingers and toes to headaches to passing out in the cockpit....

...As for the Joint Strike Fighter, “F-35 has experienced on average the same or slightly less rate of physiological events that other aircraft have,” Vice Adm. Mathias Winter, the program executive officer for F-35 Lightning II, said at the hearing. Winter described three technology areas the PEO is pursuing to get ahead of any potential increases in PE events in F-35 pilots.

First, on OBOGS, “we found that it was providing the appropriate concentration of oxygen to our pilots, but there was a variation in it that, if we reduced that variation, would eliminate a potential causal factor,” Winter said, and added that the program was working to eliminate that variation so they could focus on other potential causal factors.

Second, the F-35 has a sensor in the seat that measures cockpit pressure and immediately initiates emergency oxygen if it senses the pressure is too low. “It was too sensitive, so we’ve gone back and looked at that based upon pilot input, and we’re doing a seat portion assembly upgrade,” he said.

And lastly, the F-35 program is adding a more sophisticated carbon monoxide filter, despite gas contaminants not being an issue on the Super Hornet and T-45 jets. All three will be included in new jets starting with the next contract, Lot 12, and will be retrofitted into all jets already built starting next quarter, Winter added.... [more on USN jets @ URL]

Source: https://news.usni.org/2019/04/04/navy-r ... still-high
RAN FAA A4G Skyhawk 1970s: https://www.faaaa.asn.au/spazsinbad-a4g/ AND https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCwqC_s6gcCVvG7NOge3qfAQ/
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Unread post08 Apr 2019, 09:50

Some have seen the F-35 OBOGS Honeywell material from: https://aerocontent.honeywell.com/aero/ ... ystems.pdf already. However relevant pages have been repurposed along with some extra info also most likely posted here near the date of article but it is all in one PDF of eighteen pages - download it at your peril.
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F-35 OBOGS USN-USAF INFO PRN pp18.pdf
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RAN FAA A4G Skyhawk 1970s: https://www.faaaa.asn.au/spazsinbad-a4g/ AND https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCwqC_s6gcCVvG7NOge3qfAQ/
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