The Germans are coming!

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hythelday

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Unread post27 Nov 2018, 09:44

marsavian wrote:This from the earlier usnews link looks the more probable outcome as I can't see the Germans wasting their time and money on Typhoon nuclear certification when F-35 is having it done anyway and is clearly the more deterrent delivery platform being so stealthy and as long some Typhoons are still bought that does its bit for European military industry solidarity. The nuclear requirement gives the Germans an excuse to at least slip some F-35 in under the nose of the disapproving French ;).

One proposal calls for Germany to buy 45 Lockheed F-35 jets to replace those Tornados, and about 75 new Eurofighters to replace both the other Tornados and a first batch of Eurofighters delivered between 2003 and 2008, sources said.


Can we take a moment to appreciate the fact both Britain and Germany need to buy T3 Typhoons to replace T1 Typhoons delivered 15 years ago? And to think that Eurofighter has the balls to suggest it will be relevant against "2060 threats"
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Corsair1963

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Unread post27 Nov 2018, 09:52

hythelday wrote:
Can we take a moment to appreciate the fact both Britain and Germany need to buy T3 Typhoons to replace T1 Typhoons delivered 15 years ago? And to think that Eurofighter has the balls to suggest it will be relevant against "2060 threats"



Politics is pretty much the same the world over.....(sadly) :?
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weasel1962

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Unread post27 Nov 2018, 09:58

hythelday wrote:Can we take a moment to appreciate the fact both Britain and Germany need to buy T3 Typhoons to replace T1 Typhoons delivered 15 years ago? And to think that Eurofighter has the balls to suggest it will be relevant against "2060 threats"


Don't think the Brits will be buying T3s to replace their T1s. The Typhoons will be relevant against the Argie A-4s that will still be flying in 2060.
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Corsair1963

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Unread post27 Nov 2018, 10:18

Let's hope the F-35 replaces the majority of the Tornados. (85 aircraft) While, Tranche 1's (33 aircraft) are replaced by the New Tranche 3 Typhoons. Not that I am holding my breathe...........
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marsavian

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Unread post27 Nov 2018, 12:21

weasel1962 wrote:
hythelday wrote:Can we take a moment to appreciate the fact both Britain and Germany need to buy T3 Typhoons to replace T1 Typhoons delivered 15 years ago? And to think that Eurofighter has the balls to suggest it will be relevant against "2060 threats"


Don't think the Brits will be buying T3s to replace their T1s. The Typhoons will be relevant against the Argie A-4s that will still be flying in 2060.


Indeed the RAF are keeping all their T1 single seaters for QRA purposes and equipping two new distinct squadrons. The twin seaters have been reduced to spares and scrap. No doubt these T1 single-seaters will be the first to be replaced by Tempest in about 15-20 years.
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spazsinbad

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Unread post27 Nov 2018, 14:22

weasel1962 wrote:
hythelday wrote:Can we take a moment to appreciate the fact both Britain and Germany need to buy T3 Typhoons to replace T1 Typhoons delivered 15 years ago? And to think that Eurofighter has the balls to suggest it will be relevant against "2060 threats"


Don't think the Brits will be buying T3s to replace their T1s. The Typhoons will be relevant against the Argie A-4s that will still be flying in 2060.

Ahem. According to WickedPedia: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lockheed_ ... ghtinghawk
"...In January 2016, Argentine Minister of Defence Julio Martinez confirmed that all Air Force Lockheed Martin A-4AR Skyhawk (Fightinghawk) fighters were grounded. Originally this was due to the expiry of the explosive cartridges in their ejection seats, but later it became apparent that there were additional problems. In any case only 4-5 were airworthy with the rest in storage at Villa Reynolds...."
RAN FAA A4G Skyhawk 1970s: https://www.faaaa.asn.au/spazsinbad-a4g/ AND https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCwqC_s6gcCVvG7NOge3qfAQ/
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marsavian

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Unread post27 Nov 2018, 15:12

Sheesh, they don't have any Mirages left either. Do they plan to invade Falklands again with 27 Pucaras now or have they given up on their land grab plans ;).

List_of_active_aircraft_of_the_Argentine_Air_Force

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of ... _Air_Force

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ricnunes

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Unread post27 Nov 2018, 15:25

Don't cry for me Argentina, the truth is... :mrgreen:
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marsavian

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Unread post27 Nov 2018, 15:27

Anyway there are 4 Typhoons with a Voyager tanker waiting for them anytime they are feeling lucky ;).
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SpudmanWP

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Unread post27 Nov 2018, 16:47

hythelday wrote:Can we take a moment to appreciate the fact both Britain and Germany need to buy T3 Typhoons to replace T1 Typhoons delivered 15 years ago?

Now I can really appreciate the design choices made in the F-35 so that even Block 2 jets can be easily ungraded for the next 30+ years.
"The early bird gets the worm but the second mouse gets the cheese."
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hythelday

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Unread post27 Nov 2018, 19:10

marsavian wrote:
weasel1962 wrote:
hythelday wrote:Can we take a moment to appreciate the fact both Britain and Germany need to buy T3 Typhoons to replace T1 Typhoons delivered 15 years ago? And to think that Eurofighter has the balls to suggest it will be relevant against "2060 threats"


Don't think the Brits will be buying T3s to replace their T1s. The Typhoons will be relevant against the Argie A-4s that will still be flying in 2060.


Indeed the RAF are keeping all their T1 single seaters for QRA purposes and equipping two new distinct squadrons. The twin seaters have been reduced to spares and scrap. No doubt these T1 single-seaters will be the first to be replaced by Tempest in about 15-20 years.


Hmm, I stand corrected on the all T1 Typhoons part.

However we need to look into the root cause of that decision - it's because T1 Typhoon takes too much effort to overhaul into a multi-role aircraft, isn't it? Thus the single seaters are "relegated" to QRA intercepts over North Sea, at least it is a task Typhoon does really well, perhaps the only thing it does better than F-35.

And with this fact in mind, how should one assess Typhoon's ability to evolve in the future. Countries that chose F-35 now or ten years ago were looking to keep those in service at least until 2060. Do T3 Typhoons have a vastly different and thus more upgrade-able architecture, or maybe more internal space to put more gizmos in?

SpudmanWP wrote:Now I can really appreciate the design choices made in the F-35 so that even Block 2 jets can be easily ungraded for the next 30+ years.



Interesting what will happen to Austria's fleet. I remember news about them having second thoughts about their Eurofighters.
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marsavian

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Unread post28 Nov 2018, 01:06

Tranche 2/3 Typhoons have the ability to be retrofitted with Captor-E and all other avionics/computing/weapons modifications. Tranche 1 Typhoons are multi-role too but their development has basically been frozen now for some time i.e. they won't have the Meteor or new air to ground weapons upgrade either. I suppose the nearest analogy is the difference between training and production Raptors due to earlier blocks still having initial AESA and avionics. Austria was told what it was getting when it bought the T1, a model with a limited development path.
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XanderCrews

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Unread post28 Nov 2018, 04:54

marsavian wrote:Sheesh, they don't have any Mirages left either. Do they plan to invade Falklands again with 27 Pucaras now or have they given up on their land grab plans ;).

List_of_active_aircraft_of_the_Argentine_Air_Force

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of ... _Air_Force

Image



i can't even imagine how they would try nowadays. Anytime the "malvines" come up I just retort "come take them" and that usually quiets things right down.
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