Commander Naval Air Forces wants more F/A-18s

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popcorn

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Unread post20 Dec 2016, 00:49

Dragon029 wrote:Jets get bird-bathed on land and hosed down on carriers to remove sea-salt and reduce corrosion. I'm not sure how it would relate to what happened.

Ditto.
"When a fifth-generation fighter meets a fourth-generation fighter—the [latter] dies,”
CSAF Gen. Mark Welsh
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neurotech

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Unread post20 Dec 2016, 01:55

Dragon029 wrote:Jets get bird-bathed on land and hosed down on carriers to remove sea-salt and reduce corrosion. I'm not sure how it would relate to what happened.

Not directly related, but when a high pressure washer sent water into the AoA sensor on an A320, this was a major factor in why the jet went down.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/XL_Airway ... light_888T

It's possible water got somewhere it shouldn't on this EA-18G, but I'm not sure the details as to how.
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35_aoa

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Unread post20 Dec 2016, 04:47

Busy weekend for NAVAIR I think. New boldface emergency procedures for A-G jets this morning. Ironically, both my flights today were in Super Hornets, which last night, I had expected to be grounded at least for the day. I guess the turnaround is pretty quick when you have the AIR BOSS breathing down your neck.
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blindpilot

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Unread post20 Dec 2016, 05:51

neurotech wrote:
Dragon029 wrote:Jets get bird-bathed on land and hosed down on carriers to remove sea-salt and reduce corrosion. I'm not sure how it would relate to what happened.

Not directly related, but when a high pressure washer sent water into the AoA sensor on an A320, this was a major factor in why the jet went down.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/XL_Airway ... light_888T

It's possible water got somewhere it shouldn't on this EA-18G, but I'm not sure the details as to how.


Also lost a B-2 that way -

"After the accident, the Air Force took the B-2 fleet off operational status until clearing the fleet for flight status 53 days later on 15 April 2008. The cause of the crash was later determined to be moisture in the aircraft's Port Transducer Units during air data calibration, which distorted the information being sent to the bomber's air data system. As a result, the flight control computers calculated an inaccurate airspeed, and a negative angle of attack, causing the aircraft to pitch upward 30 degrees during takeoff. This was the first crash of a B-2 and the only loss as of 2016."
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Northrop_ ... e_note-136

Sadly this is not a once only problem, nor restricted to one aircraft`s "design".

BP
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Dragon029

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Unread post20 Dec 2016, 13:31

Just heard earlier on from a guy associated with VAQ-132 that the problem was a cockpit over-pressurisation that got so severe (because the cockpit safety valve failed to open) that the canopy blew open. Their critical health status likely comes from severe decompression sickness, but the canopy may potentially have shattered as well, which could have lead to nasty lacerations.
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Unread post20 Dec 2016, 21:22

Dragon029 wrote:Just heard earlier on from a guy associated with VAQ-132 that the problem was a cockpit over-pressurisation that got so severe (because the cockpit safety valve failed to open) that the canopy blew open. Their critical health status likely comes from severe decompression sickness, but the canopy may potentially have shattered as well, which could have lead to nasty lacerations.

The F414 engine gets the bleed air from the 7th (final) stage compressor, so if somehow there is a stuck open Bleed Air Pressure Regulator and Shutoff Valve, Its going to be a really bad for the crew of that jet.
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Unread post20 Dec 2016, 21:25

In an A-4 when the aircon got stuck on FULL HOT - or it went to FULL HOT unserviceability - it was REALLY HOT real quick and AFAIK NATOPS RTB ASAP (return to base and land as quickly as possible). I have read that some pilots were tempted to jettison the canopy before able to land, when aircon went to full hot.
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popcorn

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Unread post20 Dec 2016, 23:12

Dragon029 wrote:Just heard earlier on from a guy associated with VAQ-132 that the problem was a cockpit over-pressurisation that got so severe (because the cockpit safety valve failed to open) that the canopy blew open. Their critical health status likely comes from severe decompression sickness, but the canopy may potentially have shattered as well, which could have lead to nasty lacerations.

Presumably the crew popped the canopy?
"When a fifth-generation fighter meets a fourth-generation fighter—the [latter] dies,”
CSAF Gen. Mark Welsh
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neurotech

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Unread post20 Dec 2016, 23:37

popcorn wrote:
Dragon029 wrote:Just heard earlier on from a guy associated with VAQ-132 that the problem was a cockpit over-pressurisation that got so severe (because the cockpit safety valve failed to open) that the canopy blew open. Their critical health status likely comes from severe decompression sickness, but the canopy may potentially have shattered as well, which could have lead to nasty lacerations.

Presumably the crew popped the canopy?

Scuttlebutt says the canopy wasn't jettisoned, but shattered as a result of the overpressure.

Edit: Mishap summary
A CLOSED AIRCRAFT CANOPY EXPLODED ON FLIGHT LINE DURING GROUND OPERATIONS
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Unread post21 Dec 2016, 06:26

YIKES! If so, then I shudder to think of the kind of pressure the aircrew was under. I was thinking they might have been trying to deal with the situation knowing they at least had that final option in reserve.
"When a fifth-generation fighter meets a fourth-generation fighter—the [latter] dies,”
CSAF Gen. Mark Welsh
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Corsair1963

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Unread post21 Dec 2016, 06:58

Honestly, the Navy will never be able to afford the F-35C. If, it doesn't start placing larger orders! For example Lot 9 says it all.........


The contract set a price of $102.1 million per A model and $131.6 million per B model, down from about $108 million and $134 million, respectively. However, a smaller Navy order for only two F-35Cs caused unit prices to rise by $3.2 million to $132.2 million per aircraft!

http://www.defensenews.com/articles/f-3 ... ol-program


SPENDING ONE MORE DIME ON ADDITIONAL "SUPER HORNETS' IS CRAZY! :shock:
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popcorn

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Unread post21 Dec 2016, 12:31

http://nationalinterest.org/blog/the-bu ... leet-18797

What's Wrong With the U.S. Navy's Boeing F/A-18E/F Super Hornet Fleet?

According to U.S. Navy sources, while the accident is still under investigation, it appears that the EA-18G suffered from severe cockpit over-pressurization. As it was described, the canopy failed after a particular safety valve—which would have relieved the pressure—failed to operate correctly. The Navy is in the process of implementing procedural fixes to address the most immediate issues in an effort ensure that such an accident doesn’t happen again.

“There is an ongoing investigation into the Mishap experienced by VAQ-132 last Friday,” Commander Jeannie Groeneveld, a spokeswoman for Naval Air Force, told the National Interest. “I can confirm that the crew was troubleshooting cabin pressurization issues when the canopy failed, damaging the aircraft and injuring the crew. It is important to let the investigation run its course to determine all causal factors of this mishap.”
"When a fifth-generation fighter meets a fourth-generation fighter—the [latter] dies,”
CSAF Gen. Mark Welsh
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wolfpak

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Unread post21 Dec 2016, 22:45

There is a large-of-the-art hyperbaric chamber at Travis AFB
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Unread post21 Dec 2016, 22:54

AFAIK hyperbaric chamber training for aircrew has been discontinued for some time. Why? Because it is dangerous. However training is done otherwise; whilst USN Hornet crews are trained specifically about hypoxia symptoms with special gear. This was covered in another forum thread and I have a bunch of info about it. I guess it could be posted here - if not again....

I understand your mention of the hyperbaric chamber to perhaps relieve symptoms however AFAIK we do not know about injuries suffered by the crew in this accident.
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Unread post21 Dec 2016, 23:43

Yep, Only mentioned it because if they had a severe case of decompression sickness they would probably go there since it's close.
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