UK 2015 Defense Review 138 F-35Bs etc.

[neptune]

http://alert5.com/2015/11/23/britain-to-buy-138-f-35bs/

Britain to buy 138 F-35Bs

Britain has committed itself to buying 138 F-35Bs and 24 of these will be operating from the two new Royal Navy aircraft carriers by 2023.

This is the first time that the total number of the stealth fighters to be bought is revealed.

A spokesman for the Ministry of Defense added that the decision to have 24 jets by 2023 is a “substantial acceleration.”

http://www.abovetopsecret.com/forum/thread1093727/pg1

A report in Sunday papers in the UK is claiming that the defense review due out tomorrow will show the UK is about to sign for 138 F-35Bs. The deal is worth £12B.

BRITAIN is to buy 138 stealth fighter jets in a £12bn deal that will treble the firepower of the UK’s two new aircraft carriers and put the country on a “full war footing” in the Middle East for a generation.

George Osborne reveals today that the centrepiece of the government’s strategic defence review, to be unveiled tomorrow, will be a commitment to give Britain the world’s second most potent carrier strike force after the United States.

http://www.thesundaytimes.co.uk...

https://www.gov.uk/government/news/pm-p ... efence-kit



Press release

PM pledges £178 billion investment in defence kit

From:
Prime Minister's Office, 10 Downing Street, The Rt Hon David Cameron MP and Ministry of Defence

First published:
23 November 2015
...

The Prime Minister will announce a £178 billion investment in defence equipment and support over the next decade

•£12 billion uplift in equipment budget

•9 new Boeing P8 maritime patrol aircraft

•2 New Strike Brigades by 2025 for rapid deployment missions both of which will be up to 5000 strong


The Prime Minister will announce a £178 billion investment in defence equipment and support over the next decade when he unveils the Government’s five year National Security Strategy and Strategic Defence and Security review in the House of Commons later today.

The £12 billion uplift in funding will be focused on investments that will help to ensure the UK can respond to diverse threats in an increasingly dangerous and uncertain world. This will include:

•9 new Boeing P8 maritime patrol aircraft for maritime surveillance, anti-submarine and anti-surface ship warfare, increasing further the protection of our nuclear deterrent and our new aircraft carriers. These roles require an aircraft that can carry torpedoes, as well as being fitted with a broad range of sensors, including radar and sonobuoys, which are operated from the rear of the cabin by a team of specialists. These aircraft will also provide maritime search and rescue and surveillance capabilities over land.

•We will be extending the life of our multirole Typhoon for 10 extra years through to 2040, meaning we will be able to create 2 additional squadrons. This will give us a total of frontline 7 squadrons, consisting of around 12 aircraft per squadron. We will also invest in their ground attack capability and fit them with a new Active Electronically Scanned Array radar to ensure they can continue to operate in hostile environments in the future.

•Create two new ‘Strike Brigades’ by 2025 to be rapidly deployable, able to self-deploy thousands of kilometres, and with a much lower logistic footprint. They will use the new Ajax family (previously known as Scout) range of vehicles, comprising 6 variants and almost 600 armoured vehicles.


The Prime Minister is expected to make further announcements later today as he sets out the Government’s comprehensive approach to national security, including boosting its soft power and focusing aid on fragile states and regions to tackle the root causes of conflict.

Writing in the foreword to the National Security Strategy and Strategic Defence and Security Review, the Prime Minister says:

“Our national security depends on our economic security, and vice versa. So the first step in our National Security Strategy is to ensure our economy is, and remains, strong.”

“Over the last five years we have taken the difficult decisions needed to bring down our deficit and restore our economy to strength. In 2010, the total black hole in the defence budget alone was bigger than the entire defence budget in that year. Now it is back in balance.”

“By sticking to our long-term economic plan, Britain has become the fastest growing major advanced economy in the world for the last two years. Our renewed economic security means we can afford to invest further in our national security.”

“This is vital at a time when the threats to our country are growing. From the rise of ISIL and greater instability in the Middle East, to the crisis in Ukraine, the threat of cyber attacks and the risk of pandemics, the world is more dangerous and uncertain today than five years ago.”

“So while every government must choose how to spend the money it has available, every penny of which is hard-earned by taxpayers, this Government has taken a clear decision to invest in our security and safeguard our prosperity.”

“As a result, the United Kingdom is the only major country in the world today which is simultaneously going to meet the NATO target of spending 2% of our GDP on defence and the UN target of spending 0.7% of our GNI on development, while also increasing investment in our security and intelligence agencies and in counter-terrorism.”
…..
“At its [the strategy] heart is an understanding that we cannot choose between conventional defences against state-based threats and the need to counter threats that do not recognise national borders. Today we face both and we must respond to both. So over the course of this Parliament our priorities are to deter state-based threats, tackle terrorism, remain a world leader in cyber security and ensure we have the capability to respond rapidly to crises as they emerge.”
….
“Our Armed Forces, our police and our security and intelligence agencies put their lives on the line every day. Their service is an inspiration to us all and they are the pride of our nation. Through this National Security Strategy and Strategic Defence and Security Review we will back them and use our hard-earned economic strength to support our Armed Forces, and to give those in our police and our security and intelligence agencies who fight terrorism the resources

[spazsinbad]

'popcorn' was 1st over here + with some follow on posts: viewtopic.php?f=58&t=15969&p=309609&hilit=Osborne#p309609

[optimist]

I hope someone is on suicide watch. With the P-8 and 138 x F-35's being announced. Sweetman, et al will be frothing at the mouth.

[magitsu]

I hope this massive increase in defense spending will wake up others.

This is also in stark contrast to Canada. The UK will procure very few ships vs. aircraft.

Original requirement for T45 destroyers was 12. MoD cut to 8, then 6. Requirement for T26 was 13, order now just for 8.

https://twitter.com/LJ_Skipper/status/668740063291920384

[sferrin]

I hope someone is on suicide watch. With the P-8 and 138 x F-35's being announced. Sweetman, et al will be frothing at the mouth.

ROFL! I was about to suggest the same.

[optimist]

guess who he's still in denial, so the suicidal thoughts haven't hit yet.

Six more F-35 squadrons (beyond 809/607/OCU) plus a brace of Typhoon T1 squadrons, multi-role Aesa-equipped T2/T3s and Protectors, with the Anglo-French UCAV on the way, would be a formidable force, but I don't see it happening.

Of the final 90 F-35s, maybe some will replace the life-extended T1s in the late 2020s. But the real cash-down decision date on those is a decade away.

Far be it from me to suggest that the 138-JSF "commitment" is a political sop to the U.S., offsetting the fact that UKG has just given Typhoon a huge shot in the arm for the upcoming political fight in Denmark and the contest in Belgium.

[spazsinbad]

The SDSR statement will be delivered officially in the UK House of Commons soonish like so there is that.

U.K. to Buy 138 F-35s, Purchase P-8 Poseidon
23 Nov 2015 Tony Osborne

"Britain will commit to buying 138 Lockheed Martin F-35 Joint Strike Fighters and will order a fleet of nine Boeing P-8 Poseidon maritime patrol aircraft as part of a £12 billion ($18 billion) increase in spending on defense equipment over the next decade.

The plans, to be formally published Nov. 23 with the publication of the U.K.’s Strategic Defense and Security Review (SDSR), will also extend the service life of the Eurofighter Typhoon fleet from its current out of service date of 2030 to 2040. Meanwhile, a further two front-line squadrons will be formed by retaining Tranche 1 aircraft that were due to retire in over the next 2-3 years. The government has also pledged to fit the Tranche 3 aircraft with the active electronically scanned array radar, currently in development....

...In an interview on British television on Nov. 22, Chancellor George Osborne said that the U.K. would accelerate its program of bringing the F-35 into service for the carrier strike role by having 24 of the aircraft ready for use the U.K.’s new Queen Elizabeth-class aircraft carriers by 2023.

“We are going to step up the aircraft carrier punch of the United Kingdom. We are going to make sure that when these aircraft carriers are available they are going to have planes that can fly from them in force," Osborne said.

The U.K. has already signed up to purchase 14 F-35s over the next five years, on top of the three already in service and a fourth due to be delivered towards the end of this year. Six more F-35Bs were ordered by the U.K. at the beginning of November.

Until now, British ministers had only confirmed plans to purchase 48 F-35s.

It is unclear whether the 138 will be made up of STOVL-model F-35Bs; it seems likely that the U.K. may now also look at the land-based F-35A...."

Source: http://aviationweek.com/defense/uk-buy- ... 8-poseidon

[selvagor]

I feel sorry for Britain, so much budget cuts to buy such a waste. But the good news is that Britain will be ready to fight terror by 2023...

[spazsinbad]

It would be useful to know this then (new ships with new aircraft and new crews - after a NavAv Holiday - take some time to get going doncha know).

UK orders first operational F-35 combat aircraft
23 Nov 2014 Gareth Jennings

"...In 2018, 617 Sqn will transfer to its future home station at RAF Marham in the UK, and in December of that year the UK will declare initial operating capability - land (IOC - Land) for its F-35B force [2018].

The second unit - the FAA's 809 'Immortals' Naval Air Squadron - will be created ahead of the commencement of sea trials aboard the future HMS Queen Elizabeth aircraft carrier in 2018, with the full operating capability (land and maritime) being declared in 2023...."

Source: http://www.janes.com/article/46164/uk-o ... t-aircraft

[spazsinbad]

There are two versions of the official UK 2015 SDSR PDFs with the graphic from the print version:

https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/s ... T_only.pdf (1.9Mb)

https://www.gov.uk/government/uploads/s ... b_only.pdf (1.3Mb)

[tritonprime]

I understand that Lockheed Martin pitched a C-130J conversion, known as the SC-130J Sea Herc, as an alternative to the Boeing P-8A Poseidon.

[neptune]

I understand that Lockheed Martin pitched a C-130J conversion, known as the SC-130J Sea Herc, as an alternative to the Boeing P-8A Poseidon.

Sea Herc is an interesting concept but.....those long (8-12 hours) flights at those high altitudes in the back of a Herc will wear down the proverbial "Iron Man".....better to fly the 737 with full pressurization, it will yield a more capable crew effort.

....low, slow and dirty would be ideal for a Herc but ASW has gone high, fast and tight since the latest Orions...especially with the new LSRS (JSTARS) radar....

...surveillance with a business jet could be manageable but inserting mines, torpedoes, and the like would be a large (heavy) challenge for most business jets.

[spazsinbad]

Don't forget "MAD MAD MAD" (likely as low as the 200 feet cited BELOW).

U.S. Navy Growing P-8 Poseidon Operations in the Western Pacific
02 Mar 2015 Mike Yeo

"...According to Detwiler, mission profiles flown by the P-8s include Anti-Submarine and Anti-Surface Warfare, Maritime Patrol, High-Altitude Intelligence, Surveillance and Reconnaissance (ISR), Command, Control and Communications (C3) and providing standoff targeting for other U.S. Navy assets.

However, it was the search for the missing Malaysian Airlines flight MH370 in March and April 2014, during the P-8’s first 7th Fleet AOR deployment, that provided the U.S. Navy with the greatest insight into the aircraft’s capabilities. During the second phase of the air search, which saw involved aircraft making 1,200 – 1,400 nautical mile transits from airports in Western Australia to the southern Indian Ocean search area, the U.S. Navy initially utilized a single P-8A from VP-16 War Eagles and a P-3C.

However, the long transits soon saw the addition of a second P-8A from VP-16 and the withdrawal of the P-3 due to the P-8s getting “three to four hours additional on-station time, partly because it has a higher transit speed” in the words of Boeing’s Detwiler. On top of this, it was found that the operational fuel burn on the P-8 was a lot less than that predicted by computer modelling performed during the type’s development, even when the aircraft was operating at altitudes as low as 200 feet for significant periods of time. [low altitude MAD BOOM Extended TIME when submarine metal detecting/searching.] This meant that the P-8 was capable of up to twelve hours on station during the search for MH370, with crews reporting less fatigue than that encountered on comparable missions flying on P-3s due to increased ride comfort...."

Source: http://news.usni.org/2015/03/02/u-s-nav ... rn-pacific

..."MAD confirms submarine contact"... at end of video below just before TORPEDO RELEASE.

[Dragon029]

The US Navy (and RAAF when they arrive) P-8s don't actually had MAD booms fitted (the Indian models do though). The plan in the near future is to utilise expendable MAD drones that will be launched from sonar buoy tubes; the reason they were flying low was likely to just perform surface debris searches.

[spazsinbad]

'Dragon029' OK - I did not know that. Thanks. BOING! has just starting building the first RAAF P-8 in the last few days. Do you know how the UKie Ones will be bespoke outfitted in the MAD department? Yes and I get that the low altitude searches mentioned were specifically NOT MAD as indicated above "MAD used likely as low as 200 feet cited in article...".