JASDF may be in the market for more F-35s

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spazsinbad

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Unread post29 Nov 2018, 03:20

Brilliant - thanks for that - saves me a lot of hassle. Have the Japanese mentioned DSO Distributed STOVL Ops ala USMC?
RAN FAA A4G Skyhawk 1970s: https://www.faaaa.asn.au/spazsinbad-a4g/ AND https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCwqC_s6gcCVvG7NOge3qfAQ/
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Corsair1963

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Unread post29 Nov 2018, 03:59

weasel1962 wrote:Someone didn't get the memo that Japan already bought the V-22 "helicopters".... sorry, hovercraft.........must have been at gunpoint to extend the Boeing production line, if some are to be believed.



Those Japanese Osprey's are already assigned other tasks.
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weasel1962

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Unread post29 Nov 2018, 04:07

spazsinbad wrote:Brilliant - thanks for that - saves me a lot of hassle. Have the Japanese mentioned DSO Distributed STOVL Ops ala USMC?


Hints but nothing concrete. Hints include:

Upgrade of Okinawa chain infrastructure.
Proposed deployment of F-35B to defend islands (not just Izumo).
USMC sharing of F-35B operation with Japan.

What would be concrete if a deployment exercise is executed just to demonstrate proof of concept. Currently everything is concentrated at Iwakuni which is Japan mainland.

They have deployed USMC Bs to Okinawa
https://www.1stmaw.marines.mil/Unit-Hom ... n-okinawa/
Last edited by weasel1962 on 29 Nov 2018, 04:12, edited 1 time in total.
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weasel1962

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Unread post29 Nov 2018, 04:10

Corsair1963 wrote:
weasel1962 wrote:Someone didn't get the memo that Japan already bought the V-22 "helicopters".... sorry, hovercraft.........must have been at gunpoint to extend the Boeing production line, if some are to be believed.



Those Japanese Osprey's are already assigned other tasks.


Yup, assigned to other tasks on board the Izumo aka "helicopter" duties.
https://thediplomat.com/2016/07/japan-t ... -aircraft/

A number of V-22s will be stationed aboard the Japan Maritime Self-Defense Force’s new 19,5000-ton helicopter carrier Izumo.


There was a simple reason why they landed a V-22 on the Hyuga in 2013.
https://www.navy.mil/submit/display.asp?story_id=74888
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Corsair1963

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Unread post29 Nov 2018, 04:17

weasel1962 wrote:
Corsair1963 wrote:
weasel1962 wrote:Someone didn't get the memo that Japan already bought the V-22 "helicopters".... sorry, hovercraft.........must have been at gunpoint to extend the Boeing production line, if some are to be believed.



Those Japanese Osprey's are already assigned other tasks.


Yup, assigned to other tasks on board the Izumo aka "helicopter" duties.
https://thediplomat.com/2016/07/japan-t ... -aircraft/

A number of V-22s will be stationed aboard the Japan Maritime Self-Defense Force’s new 19,5000-ton helicopter carrier Izumo.


There was a simple reason why they landed a V-22 on the Hyuga in 2013.
https://www.navy.mil/submit/display.asp?story_id=74888



Not in the role of AEW&C, COD, and/or Tanker.....So, additional aircraft maybe required. (my point)
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spazsinbad

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Unread post29 Nov 2018, 04:29

Bit of a basing problem with Japanese V-22s at moment.
Safety concerns delay delivery of V-22 Osprey aircraft to Japan
28 Nov 2018 Mike Yeo

"TOKYO — Japan’s first Bell-Boeing V-22 Osprey tilt-rotor aircraft are ready for delivery, but a dispute over where they will be based is holding up the process....

...The Japan Ground Self-Defense Force plans to temporarily base its Ospreys at Camp Kisarazu near Tokyo while it constructs additional facilities at Saga Airport near the city of Nagasaki, which is expected to become the permanent base of Japan’s tilt rotors.

This plan ran into opposition with local residents living near Camp Kisarazu, even though the base is already the site of a maintenance depot for American Ospreys based in Japan, and specifically Okinawa....

...When asked if Japan was keen on acquiring more Ospreys, Trautman [retired Lt. Gen. George Trautman, a former U.S. Marine aviator and commander of all Marine Corps aviation who now works as an adviser for Bell] told Defense News there was “no formal dialogue” beyond the 17 aircraft for Japan."

Source: https://www.defensenews.com/digital-sho ... -to-japan/
RAN FAA A4G Skyhawk 1970s: https://www.faaaa.asn.au/spazsinbad-a4g/ AND https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCwqC_s6gcCVvG7NOge3qfAQ/
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weasel1962

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Unread post29 Nov 2018, 04:39

Corsair1963 wrote:Not in the role of AEW&C, COD, and/or Tanker.....So, additional aircraft maybe required. (my point)


I know this must be difficult for you to understand but as others have already highlighted, these aren't available in the 1st instant. I don't know why I bother since the same info below has been stated in so many threads but...

No mods are required for COD. The existing V-22s can operate in the COD. So why need additional?

The tanker is just a roll-on roll off module for existing V-22s so why need additional?

AEW V-22 - only on paper but as we all know "on paper" means in your Corsair1963 world, this is a point I'm certainly not going to belabor....
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Unread post29 Nov 2018, 05:02

weasel1962 wrote:
I know this must be difficult for you to understand but as others have already highlighted, these aren't available in the 1st instant. I don't know why I bother since the same info below has been stated in so many threads but...

No mods are required for COD. The existing V-22s can operate in the COD. So why need additional?

The tanker is just a roll-on roll off module for existing V-22s so why need additional?

AEW V-22 - only on paper but as we all know "on paper" means in your Corsair1963 world, this is a point I'm certainly not going to belabor....


Japanese V-22 Ospreys are planned mainly as troop carriers.......

Also, no mods are need for the COD??? I suggest you talk to the USN as their CMV-22B have a number of modifications over standard Ospreys.

QUOTE: The CMV-22B incorporates an extended-range fuel system for an 1,150 nmi (1,320 mi; 2,130 km) unrefueled range, a high-frequency radio for over-the-horizon communications, and a public address system to communicate with passengers, the range increase comes from extra fuel bladders through larger external sponsons, the version's only physical difference from other Osprey variants. Its primary mission is long-range aerial logistics.....
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h-bomb

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Unread post29 Nov 2018, 06:15

Corsair1963 wrote:
weasel1962 wrote:
I know this must be difficult for you to understand but as others have already highlighted, these aren't available in the 1st instant. I don't know why I bother since the same info below has been stated in so many threads but...

No mods are required for COD. The existing V-22s can operate in the COD. So why need additional?

The tanker is just a roll-on roll off module for existing V-22s so why need additional?

AEW V-22 - only on paper but as we all know "on paper" means in your Corsair1963 world, this is a point I'm certainly not going to belabor....


Japanese V-22 Ospreys are planned mainly as troop carriers.......

Also, no mods are need for the COD??? I suggest you talk to the USN as their CMV-22B have a number of modifications over standard Ospreys.

QUOTE: The CMV-22B incorporates an extended-range fuel system for an 1,150 nmi (1,320 mi; 2,130 km) unrefueled range, a high-frequency radio for over-the-horizon communications, and a public address system to communicate with passengers, the range increase comes from extra fuel bladders through larger external sponsons, the version's only physical difference from other Osprey variants. Its primary mission is long-range aerial logistics.....


The Japanese COD does not have the range requirements the USN has. So they do not need the extra fuel capacity the USN did. They will do COD with standard aircraft as the internal dimensions are not changed. Also all those changes add only 270 nm range.
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Unread post29 Nov 2018, 06:49

Yes, its really "massive" changes....on the external sponsons, yup its really very difficult to achieve, just like getting external fuel tanks. Most difficult is they need to change the light bulbs which is probably impossible for some people. At the same time, the PA is very critical as that probably needs to broadcast Japanese. Can charge another $151m just for that alone.

http://www.navair.navy.mil/index.cfm?fu ... CD0266FE4E
As compared to the MV-22B, the Navy variant has extended operational range, a beyond line-of-sight HF radio, improved fuel dump capability, a public address system for passengers, and an improved lighting system for cargo loading. The CMV-22B will be capable of transporting up to 6,000 pounds of cargo/personnel to a 1,150 NM range.


The Japanese must have been really dumb to buy their MV-22s since they can't use it on the DDHs. *snort*
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weasel1962

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Unread post29 Nov 2018, 06:59

I just realised that I missed out the massive HF radio improvement. Probably needs one that auto translates into Japanese using "snort wave".
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Corsair1963

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Unread post29 Nov 2018, 10:21

Honestly, done wasting my time........
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Unread post29 Nov 2018, 10:48

Thanks then for not wasting any more of our time.
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Unread post29 Nov 2018, 11:40

Back to the discussion before it was side-tracked by "V-22 for japan which they already have" talk.

spazsinbad wrote:Brilliant - thanks for that - saves me a lot of hassle. Have the Japanese mentioned DSO Distributed STOVL Ops ala USMC?


The question also is whether the USMC can perform distributed ops in a China battle without the involvement of the Japanese? If the answer is no, then I would think it is inevitable that Japan would have to sign up for DSO.

Its not like there are many non-Japanese places to conduct distributed ops in that locality.

Digging up my notes in 2012, there was some discussion back then on the US military allowing civilian flights into Yokota for greater US military access to other Japan civilian runways.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/re ... story.html
http://www.toshiseibi.metro.tokyo.jp/ba ... nglish.pdf
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spazsinbad

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Unread post30 Nov 2018, 04:27

So Japan requires marinized helos - please no more V-22 back & forth. So serious deck hardware on way eh: F-35Bs plus.
Japan sets naval-friendly requirement in search to replace AH-1S Cobra fleet
29 Nov 2018 Mike Yeo

"TOKYO — Japan is requiring its new attack helicopters be equipped for shipboard operations, as the country looks to replace its legacy Bell/Fuji Heavy Industries AH-1S Cobra attack helos. Japan’s request for information issued earlier this year called for the new helicopters to be marinized and able to operate from “expeditionary airfields or sea bases,”, said retired Lt. Gen. George Trautman, an adviser to Bell.

Speaking to Defense News at the Japan International Aerospace Exhibition in Tokyo, the former U.S. Marine aviator and commander of Marine Corps aviation said the RFI requested pricing and information for “30, 40 and 50” helicopters. He added that a request for proposals is expected in the next three to four months...."

Source: https://www.defensenews.com/digital-sho ... bra-fleet/
RAN FAA A4G Skyhawk 1970s: https://www.faaaa.asn.au/spazsinbad-a4g/ AND https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCwqC_s6gcCVvG7NOge3qfAQ/
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