Pressure increases on [Canada] to stay or leave F-35 program

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weasel1962

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Unread post05 Aug 2020, 03:49

If one reads the Finnish assessment of what they need, Gripen is imho the last option on their list because they are not looking for cost effectiveness, they are looking for deterrence.

Anyways Finland will release their decision next year followed by Canada by end-2022.
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talkitron

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Unread post05 Aug 2020, 03:51

I am no expert on how Finland does things, but in other countries it would be common for elected politicians to make the final decision. These individuals could have all sorts of motives other than deterrence.
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Corsair1963

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Unread post05 Aug 2020, 04:26

Don't see how Canada could not acquire an American Fighter. Which, means the real choice is down to the F-35A and Super Hornet.

This makes the decision easy as the F-35 is vastly more capable. While, offering Canada a far more lucrative industrial benefit.

So, the only real issue is how Justin Trudeau and his Liberal Government can sell it.....(and save face) :wink:
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weasel1962

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Unread post05 Aug 2020, 04:34

talkitron wrote:I am no expert on how Finland does things, but in other countries it would be common for elected politicians to make the final decision. These individuals could have all sorts of motives other than deterrence.


Agreed, that's real.

A hypothesis to chew on. Presence of existential threats tend to make such decisions more objective. Applicable?
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Corsair1963

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Unread post05 Aug 2020, 04:39

talkitron wrote:I am no expert on how Finland does things, but in other countries it would be common for elected politicians to make the final decision. These individuals could have all sorts of motives other than deterrence.



I expect Finland to acquire the F-35 along with Canada! Honestly, the Swiss are the "wildcard"..... :|


"IMHO"
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hornetfinn

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Unread post05 Aug 2020, 07:02

talkitron wrote:I am no expert on how Finland does things, but in other countries it would be common for elected politicians to make the final decision. These individuals could have all sorts of motives other than deterrence.


Finnish politicians very seldom (almost never) go against what the experts recommend, especially when if comes to military matters. Finnish politics is very unemotional and practical (like Finnish people tend to be) and also very dull due to it. Political populism is extremely mild compared to most other countries as that doesn't really work well here. In Finland political power is very much distributed and governments tend to consist of 4-6 political parties these days. So it would take several parties and legislative branches to support the decision and that would be really tough to get going against what the experts recommend. It would take a lot of explaining to do from the government. I would be extremely surprised if the Finnish politicians chose anything else than what the Finnish Air Force recommends.

Finnish decision might have big impact on Canadian competition as it comes a year earlier and political aspects have very little impact and there is no favouring any manufacturer or country. I'm sure Canadian Air Force is looking very closely how the Finnish competition progresses and what the decision is.
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Corsair1963

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Unread post05 Aug 2020, 07:59

Yes, that has been the problem for the Justin Trudeau Government. As the longer they wait to make a decision on a new fighter. The harder it becomes to not select the F-35!
:doh:
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hornetfinn

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Unread post05 Aug 2020, 08:35

Corsair1963 wrote:Yes, that has been the problem for the Justin Trudeau Government. As the longer they wait to make a decision on a new fighter. The harder it becomes to not select the F-35!
:doh:


Yes, I can't understand how they managed to prolong the whole thing for so long. I guess that is some kind of achievement in itself... :roll:
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Corsair1963

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Unread post05 Aug 2020, 09:44

hornetfinn wrote:
Corsair1963 wrote:Yes, that has been the problem for the Justin Trudeau Government. As the longer they wait to make a decision on a new fighter. The harder it becomes to not select the F-35!
:doh:


Yes, I can't understand how they managed to prolong the whole thing for so long. I guess that is some kind of achievement in itself... :roll:


Trudeau is so bad that he make Trump look good.... :?
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luke_sandoz

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Unread post06 Aug 2020, 16:01

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playloud

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Unread post06 Aug 2020, 19:56

This should be fun. I just approved Bill Sweetman to join the BF4C Facebook group. I would have put this in the Basement Dweller thread, but it's locked.
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optimist

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Unread post07 Aug 2020, 08:38

It won't be that much fun. His new boss will have him locked up under a non disclosure agreement, on just about every US platform. He can say F'All under his own name.
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XanderCrews

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Unread post07 Aug 2020, 18:58

optimist wrote:It won't be that much fun. His new boss will have him locked up under a non disclosure agreement, on just about every US platform. He can say F'All under his own name.



He seems to be popping up more often, hes on one of the pprune forums and he is being careful what he says but he is still saying things

believe me Bill is an expert at "cheeky"-- he will qualify, he will imply, he will insinuate, but he will not "say" I ran afoul of him when he "heavily implied" the F-35 had a kill switch wherein the US could "inert" any F-35 operator should it be needed. I went no holds barred about how full of it he was and was banned.

So implying=fine

People in the know telling him he is spreading lies= ban hammer

to say he is "biased" is an understatement
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optimist

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Unread post07 Aug 2020, 19:23

Posting in a low observable manner on an anonymous forum, wouldn't be an issue. Writing under his own name or an identifiable alias would be another matter. He's done.
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XanderCrews

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Unread post08 Aug 2020, 03:07

optimist wrote:Posting in a low observable manner on an anonymous forum, wouldn't be an issue. Writing under his own name or an identifiable alias would be another matter. He's done.



Bolded portion is his actual screen name :wink:
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