Australia delays delivery of 12 F-35 fighters

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spazsinbad

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Unread post23 Mar 2014, 18:59

F-35 fighter purchase reasonable: report 24 Mar 2014 AAP

"AUSTRALIA is likely to push ahead with the acquisition of its first operational F-35 Joint Strike Fighter (JSF) aircraft, according to a report by an independent defence think tank.

In a report released on Monday, the Australian Strategic Policy Institute says it makes most sense for the federal government to commit to spending between $8 billion and $10 billion on 58 of the fighters, which are expected to enter service in 2020....

...Start-up costs to take on the JSF are predicted to be $2 billion, with a ongoing annual cost of about $200 million....

...As the government keeps a watchful eye on Australia's budget, the report suggests an option of reducing the F-35 order to 50, thus saving about $800 million on the initial cost...."

SOURCE: http://www.ntnews.com.au/news/national/ ... 6862761303
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Unread post24 Mar 2014, 03:05

ASPIbergerBabies Report mentioned above here: :devil:
Taking wing: time to decide on the F-35 Joint Strike Fighter 24 Mar 2014 Andrew Davies & Harry White
"The government is about to make a decision on whether to spend between $8 and 10 billion of taxpayer’s money on the new F-35 Joint Strike Fighter. It’s also an important call because it will cement the F-35 as the main instrument of Australian air-power for decades into the future...."

FROM REPORT PDF: ...Conclusions
On balance, the decision that appears to meet government priorities for capability, industry participation and alliance
management with the US seems to be a further purchase of the F-35.

Risks to both schedule and performance seem sufficiently under control to make that a responsible decision. Although the
development program could still throw up surprises, it looks like the F-35 will be ready in time to retire the vintage Hornet fleet as scheduled, and will perform as required. However, delays to date now mean that there’s little additional scope for further slippage in an Australian in-service date.

Moving to the acquisition of additional F-35s on top of the Super Hornets and Growlers currently in service or under order will necessarily mean that the costs of a mixed fleet are now unavoidable. One option for offsetting those costs is reducing the number of aircraft purchased. That would complicate the management of the fleet and its readiness, but it would still provide a good basis for an expansion with further F-35 buys of later block aircraft should the future strategic circumstances warrant it.

SOURCE: https://www.aspi.org.au/publications/ta ... ke-fighter

PDF: https://www.aspi.org.au/publications/taking-wing-time-to-decide-on-the-f-35-joint-strike-fighter/SI70_F35_decision.pdf (1.9Mb)
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F-35 combat radius with and without a single air-to-air refuelling ASPI.gif
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Unread post24 Mar 2014, 04:19

I would post this in support of Australia's FPDA allied operations (1000km/540nm range circles). Air cover over LHD/F-35 entry routes into SE Asia. Note the broad cover over Indonesia as well...

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Unread post24 Mar 2014, 19:23

This one has really gotten under old Eric's skin since he has made two consecutive rants about it...I can imagine I him foaming at the mouth. :D . For a real laugh, have a look how he references both himself and Carlo Kopp as his expert evidence. :lmao:

http://elpdefensenews.blogspot.com.au/2 ... leads.html

http://elpdefensenews.blogspot.com.au/2 ... eport.html
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Unread post25 Mar 2014, 01:57

gtx wrote:This one has really gotten under old Eric's skin since he has made two consecutive rants about it...I can imagine I him foaming at the mouth. :D . For a real laugh, have a look how he references both himself and Carlo Kopp as his expert evidence. :lmao:

http://elpdefensenews.blogspot.com.au/2 ... leads.html

http://elpdefensenews.blogspot.com.au/2 ... eport.html


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It begins! LOL
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spazsinbad

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Unread post25 Mar 2014, 08:10

Dr. Jensen (OzFed Pollie) FIGHTS Back with a counterrotatingassbackwardskissyourarsegoodbye SPUN of his own. :devil: An Example of FLUFF from the GetGo:
A Strong Critique of Lockmart's Spinning of Joint Strike Fighter

"...Head of the program with the Pentagon, Lt. Gen. Bogdan, says that we will be able to buy them for $90m each. This is misleading at best, a blatant lie at worst. Let’s put them to the test, offer $9 billion for a purchase of 100.

It is a complete misrepresentation, and Bogdan knows it. He is talking about the equivalent of buying a car for a certain bargain price, only to then be told, oh, but sire, the seats, carpet, air conditioning, power steering ABS brakes, battery, sound system, paint etc are all extra. Wonder what the ACCC would make of that?..."

(Source: Dr Dennis Jensen, MP; posted March 22, 2014)

SOURCE: http://www.defense-aerospace.com/cgi-bin/client/modele.pl?shop=dae&modele=verbatim&prod=152650&cat=4

A classic Oz Style Dummy Spit. Where to start. Poor old USMC Col. Chip Berke (only flying F-22/F-35 pilot at moment) gets the burk treatment. I think it IS a case of TOO Much Information for our Dr. Jensen but the soothsayers seven years ago got it right. What. :devil:
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Unread post25 Mar 2014, 09:47

Interesting...I had heard rumours that Jensen had been strongly advised to shut up re the F-35...by his own political party! Mind you, he isn't exactly welcomed within his party anymore and may well be expected to be come an independent in the near future.

Either way, the guy is a complete idiot and easily refuted. Mind you, like all these fools they aren't prepared to let facts sway their belief. I am sure that many of them refuse to believe the world is round or that man have landed on the moon...
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Unread post25 Mar 2014, 10:06

I am not suprised if the rumours are true GTX. I would have expected good ole Tony Abbott to tell Dr Jensen to shut up and get with the program by now. Dr Jensen running as an independent eh...that will be a sight to see :P
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Unread post25 Mar 2014, 17:33

spazsinbad wrote:Dr. Jensen (OzFed Pollie) FIGHTS Back with a counterrotatingassbackwardskissyourarsegoodbye SPUN of his own. :devil: An Example of FLUFF from the GetGo:
A Strong Critique of Lockmart's Spinning of Joint Strike Fighter

"...Head of the program with the Pentagon, Lt. Gen. Bogdan, says that we will be able to buy them for $90m each. This is misleading at best, a blatant lie at worst. Let’s put them to the test, offer $9 billion for a purchase of 100.

It is a complete misrepresentation, and Bogdan knows it. He is talking about the equivalent of buying a car for a certain bargain price, only to then be told, oh, but sire, the seats, carpet, air conditioning, power steering ABS brakes, battery, sound system, paint etc are all extra. Wonder what the ACCC would make of that?..."

(Source: Dr Dennis Jensen, MP; posted March 22, 2014)

SOURCE: http://www.defense-aerospace.com/cgi-bin/client/modele.pl?shop=dae&modele=verbatim&prod=152650&cat=4

A classic Oz Style Dummy Spit. Where to start. Poor old USMC Col. Chip Berke (only flying F-22/F-35 pilot at moment) gets the burk treatment. I think it IS a case of TOO Much Information for our Dr. Jensen but the soothsayers seven years ago got it right. What. :devil:
___________________

Just so there is no confusion about berk/burk:
"berk or burk (bɜːk). —n. slang (Brit) a stupid person; fool....."
:doh:
SOURCE: http://www.google.com.au/url?sa=t&rct=j ... 7204,d.dGI


Thank you for the defintion this Yank was confused. This Yank also hopes that Yank means "American" and not something more sexual down under. LOL :D

Bogdan said that its dogfighting capabilities were irrelevant, it would never dogfight. This is very similar to the F-4 Phantom of the 1960’s, where it didn’t have a gun, because the kills would all be done by missile. Then the ugly reality of Vietnam intervened, the missile and aircraft performance did not work as advertised, and a gun was quickly retrofitted.

Which begs the question, why does the JSF have a gun? Surely if there is to be no dogfighting, it is just so much lead, weight of gun and ammo that would be better used for fuel or additional missiles?



LOL Wut!? So "we thought in the 60s we wouldn't dogfight so we left a gun off, then we were wrong so we put on a gun! And now we don't think the JSF will dogfight, yet we put a gun on!!" doesn't that mean we learned the lesson?? Whats next? complaints of fire trucks that are equipped to shoot water and not gasoline?

Also: guns can be shot at ground targets. :doh:

jesus that article isn't just wrong, its incoherent and contradicts its own narrative.If you want to be a narrative writer rather than an analyst, can we a least take some creative writing classes?

http://treasure.diylol.com/uploads/post ... 126445.jpg

even if I didn't know anything about airplanes it makes no damn sense!!
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spazsinbad

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Unread post25 Mar 2014, 20:08

Correct. Yank = contraction from Yankee Doodle Dandy. Am I rong or am I rite? :devil:

Riming Slang: 'Septic' from 'Septic Tank'/ Yank. Clank.... Crickets chirping.... :D
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Unread post07 Apr 2014, 06:33

PM say in OzLand....
Prime Minister and Defence Minister – Joint Transcript – Press conference 04 April 2014

"...QUESTION:
Prime Minister, something that’s worked its way through the last two White Papers the previous Government produced, very comprehensive re•equipment program, and it was never fully funded and this created a serious problem and it was possibly a crisis of expectations. Are there any of those things that were locked in those two White Papers, such as 100 Joint Strike Fighters and 12 submarines, a fairly massive re-equipment program for the Army in terms of vehicles – are they all locked in? Do you remain committed to those things, or might those numbers shift?

PRIME MINISTER:
Look, in terms of the Joint Strike Fighters yes, we are committed.... we want more capable, not less capable armed forces going forward and we need to get out of this White Paper a new Defence Capability Plan which is affordable but also funded. And this was the big problem with the last two Defence White Papers; it was basically an equipment wish list rather than something that was affordable and funded.

QUESTION:
Are you close to a decision on JSF yet (indistinct)..?

PRIME MINISTER:
Look, the short answer is we’re on track to be making decisions and ultimately acquiring aircraft at the right time...."

SOURCE: http://www.minister.defence.gov.au/2014 ... onference/
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Unread post07 Apr 2014, 08:29

The formal announcement re the next 58 will be within the next 2 months.
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Unread post08 Apr 2014, 20:06

I wonder what the final 'as ordered' configuration will be for our Oz Growlies? I hope there will be room for upgrades etc.
Without New Orders, Boeing's F/A-18 Line Will Shut Down Within Two Years 07 Apr 2014 Dan Parsons

"...Negotiations are nearing completion on a 12-Growler order from Australia, said Morley. With a fleet of 24 [Super Hornets], that nation is the only country other than the United States that owns [X Number of] F/A-18s...."

SOURCE: http://www.nationaldefensemagazine.org/ ... a2&ID=1463
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Unread post08 Apr 2014, 20:40

spazsinbad wrote:I wonder what the final 'as ordered' configuration will be for our Oz Growlies? I hope there will be room for upgrades etc.
Without New Orders, Boeing's F/A-18 Line Will Shut Down Within Two Years 07 Apr 2014 Dan Parsons

"...Negotiations are nearing completion on a 12-Growler order from Australia, said Morley. With a fleet of 24 [Super Hornets], that nation is the only country other than the United States that owns [X Number of] F/A-18s...."

SOURCE: http://www.nationaldefensemagazine.org/ ... a2&ID=1463

Boeing are still pushing the Growler-Lite configuration, without ALQ-99 jammers, to other countries. Australia will be getting ALQ-99 pods from the US Navy, and upgrading them for their EA-18Gs. The Growler systems are being upgraded between blocks. The EW "processor" computer is quite modular and upgradable. My guess is that Australia will probably buy Next Generation Jammer pods when they become available.
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Unread post09 Apr 2014, 08:32

Yeah, it just kills me when some quote the current projected numbers as the final and end all. The F-35 will be produced for decades to come. The US originally procure more F-4's, F-15's, F-16, F/A-18's, etc. etc. than planned. Which, is true for many Air Forces. So, to say todays numbers are concrete and won't increase in the years to come is well "laughable". :doh:
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