What is the maximum weight F-15's wing station rated for?

Military aircraft - Post cold war aircraft, including for example B-2, Gripen, F-18E/F Super Hornet, Rafale, and Typhoon.
  • Author
  • Message
Offline

eloise

Elite 1K

Elite 1K

  • Posts: 1487
  • Joined: 27 Mar 2015, 16:05

Unread post29 Oct 2018, 08:13

I always thought that F-15 wing pylon is rated for the maximum of 5000 lbs, similar to F-35.
2.PNG

However, i found out today that that f-15 can carry Silver sparrow on wing pylons, that missile weight 3130 kg (6900 lbs)
sparrow missile.PNG

silver sparrow.PNG

silver sparrow 2.PNG

spparrow 4.PNG

which mean the max rating is higher, so does anyone have a station rating chart for F-15?
Offline

weasel1962

Elite 1K

Elite 1K

  • Posts: 1092
  • Joined: 07 Jun 2012, 02:41
  • Location: Singapore

Unread post29 Oct 2018, 11:11

Just checked the flight manual, no "per pylon" max ratings indicated. Just states the various F-15 stores configuration of which the heaviest is the 4+k lb 600 gal tanks (5k with the BRU-47). What I do know is that the BRU-46 /47 bomb racks are only rated up to (and including) 5,000 lbs (GBU-28). Including the SUU, that's maybe 5400+ lbs. That means either the Israelis have developed a stronger rack which appears to be the case, the BRU-46/47 is not maximising F-15 potential or the missile is 5k lbs or below. Won't be surprised if its a specially modified F-15 e.g. wth another screw to hang the extra weight.
Offline

gtg947h

Active Member

Active Member

  • Posts: 195
  • Joined: 07 Apr 2008, 16:52

Unread post29 Oct 2018, 13:32

weasel1962 wrote:Just checked the flight manual, no "per pylon" max ratings indicated. Just states the various F-15 stores configuration of which the heaviest is the 4+k lb 600 gal tanks (5k with the BRU-47). What I do know is that the BRU-46 /47 bomb racks are only rated up to (and including) 5,000 lbs (GBU-28). Including the SUU, that's maybe 5400+ lbs. That means either the Israelis have developed a stronger rack which appears to be the case, the BRU-46/47 is not maximising F-15 potential or the missile is 5k lbs or below. Won't be surprised if its a specially modified F-15 e.g. wth another screw to hang the extra weight.


Or they may just be operating with g limits (or other limitations) while carrying the target. I can't imagine they're going to engage in a lot of hard maneuvering on a target launch mission; it should be a (relatively) benign profile compared to ACM.
Offline
User avatar

sferrin

Elite 3K

Elite 3K

  • Posts: 4748
  • Joined: 22 Jul 2005, 03:23

Unread post29 Oct 2018, 15:22

gtg947h wrote:
weasel1962 wrote:Just checked the flight manual, no "per pylon" max ratings indicated. Just states the various F-15 stores configuration of which the heaviest is the 4+k lb 600 gal tanks (5k with the BRU-47). What I do know is that the BRU-46 /47 bomb racks are only rated up to (and including) 5,000 lbs (GBU-28). Including the SUU, that's maybe 5400+ lbs. That means either the Israelis have developed a stronger rack which appears to be the case, the BRU-46/47 is not maximising F-15 potential or the missile is 5k lbs or below. Won't be surprised if its a specially modified F-15 e.g. wth another screw to hang the extra weight.


Or they may just be operating with g limits (or other limitations) while carrying the target. I can't imagine they're going to engage in a lot of hard maneuvering on a target launch mission; it should be a (relatively) benign profile compared to ACM.


I'd think this is the most likely case.
"There I was. . ."
Offline

eloise

Elite 1K

Elite 1K

  • Posts: 1487
  • Joined: 27 Mar 2015, 16:05

Unread post29 Oct 2018, 20:05

gtg947h wrote:
Or they may just be operating with g limits (or other limitations) while carrying the target. I can't imagine they're going to engage in a lot of hard maneuvering on a target launch mission; it should be a (relatively) benign profile compared to ACM.

Is the rating value for each station is the maximum value that station can carry in level flight or very slight maneuver like 1.5G?
Offline

eloise

Elite 1K

Elite 1K

  • Posts: 1487
  • Joined: 27 Mar 2015, 16:05

Unread post29 Oct 2018, 20:10

weasel1962 wrote:.That means either the Israelis have developed a stronger rack which appears to be the case, the BRU-46/47 is not maximising F-15 potential or the missile is 5k lbs or below. Won't be surprised if its a specially modified F-15 e.g. wth another screw to hang the extra weight.

A normal F-15D was used as far as i know.
Black Sparrow and Blue Sparrow both lighter than 5000 lbs, but silver sparrow is 6900 lbs.
Silver and Blue sparrow have similar shell so iam not 100% sure which one the F-15 carry here
Offline

gtg947h

Active Member

Active Member

  • Posts: 195
  • Joined: 07 Apr 2008, 16:52

Unread post29 Oct 2018, 21:51

eloise wrote:
gtg947h wrote:
Or they may just be operating with g limits (or other limitations) while carrying the target. I can't imagine they're going to engage in a lot of hard maneuvering on a target launch mission; it should be a (relatively) benign profile compared to ACM.

Is the rating value for each station is the maximum value that station can carry in level flight or very slight maneuver like 1.5G?


The rating is typically a maximum nominal 1G load. So that 5000lb station may be able to carry that 5000lb at 9G, or at some reduced number (see F-16 limits for AG stores). On an F-15, I think the aircraft can go to full G limits (9?) with the tanks, though I could well be wrong. Assuming that's true (and assuming a tank is 5000lb), BotE says a 6900lb load would be limited to roughly 6.5G.

In either case, there will be a full engineering analysis done before carrying something like this that could tell you what your limits would be. The store itself might well have a limit, too, and that could be lower than what the aircraft structure could take.

Of course, there's a whole lot that goes into determining maximum loads. Johnwill could answer better than me as he did this stuff directly and I'm just on the periphery (I'm a systems guy, not structures/stress; I only sit next to those guys, and the airplanes I work on don't have external stores). But there's a whole lot more to it than just weight of the store and G limits. Aero loads, maneuvers, landing loads, asymmetric conditions, flutter, hung stores, taxi, and more can all wind up being a limiting case.
Offline

eloise

Elite 1K

Elite 1K

  • Posts: 1487
  • Joined: 27 Mar 2015, 16:05

Unread post30 Oct 2018, 10:12

gtg947h wrote:The rating is typically a maximum nominal 1G load. So that 5000lb station may be able to carry that 5000lb at 9G, or at some reduced number (see F-16 limits for AG stores). On an F-15, I think the aircraft can go to full G limits (9?) with the tanks, though I could well be wrong. Assuming that's true (and assuming a tank is 5000lb), BotE says a 6900lb load would be limited to roughly 6.5g

This is what i can find
F-15 with bombs.jpg
Offline

johnwill

Elite 2K

Elite 2K

  • Posts: 2048
  • Joined: 24 Mar 2007, 21:06
  • Location: Fort Worth, Texas

Unread post30 Oct 2018, 21:31

gtg947h wrote:
The rating is typically a maximum nominal 1G load. So that 5000lb station may be able to carry that 5000lb at 9G, or at some reduced number (see F-16 limits for AG stores). On an F-15, I think the aircraft can go to full G limits (9?) with the tanks, though I could well be wrong. Assuming that's true (and assuming a tank is 5000lb), BotE says a 6900lb load would be limited to roughly 6.5G.

In either case, there will be a full engineering analysis done before carrying something like this that could tell you what your limits would be. The store itself might well have a limit, too, and that could be lower than what the aircraft structure could take.

Of course, there's a whole lot that goes into determining maximum loads. Johnwill could answer better than me as he did this stuff directly and I'm just on the periphery (I'm a systems guy, not structures/stress; I only sit next to those guys, and the airplanes I work on don't have external stores). But there's a whole lot more to it than just weight of the store and G limits. Aero loads, maneuvers, landing loads, asymmetric conditions, flutter, hung stores, taxi, and more can all wind up being a limiting case.


gtg947h covered it very well. All I would add to the limiting conditions are ejection, arrestment and catapult. Other day to day factors that could limit loadings are runway length, temperature, altitude, brake energy, max gross weight, and so on. It's not rocket science, but it does require a lot of work to clear store loadings and determine the flight limits.
Offline

eloise

Elite 1K

Elite 1K

  • Posts: 1487
  • Joined: 27 Mar 2015, 16:05

Unread post08 Nov 2018, 04:30

X-51 wave rider is actually lighter (only 3942 lbs) and shorter (only 7.62m) than silver sparrow
X-51.PNG

MAU-12.PNG
Offline
User avatar

sferrin

Elite 3K

Elite 3K

  • Posts: 4748
  • Joined: 22 Jul 2005, 03:23

Unread post08 Nov 2018, 16:44

I think at least one of the reasons they used a B-52 is they had to drag that sucker up to almost 50,000 feet. Could an Eagle do that? Shame there aren't any B-58s still flying.

The Eagle has been used to launch another large missile however in the form of HyFly.

m02008093000001.jpg


untitled.png


No idea how much it weighed.
"There I was. . ."
Offline

garrya

Forum Veteran

Forum Veteran

  • Posts: 578
  • Joined: 25 Dec 2015, 12:43

Unread post09 Nov 2018, 03:03

sferrin wrote:I think at least one of the reasons they used a B-52 is they had to drag that sucker up to almost 50,000 feet. Could an Eagle do that? Shame there aren't any B-58s still flying.

The Eagle has been used to launch another large missile however in the form of HyFly.

m02008093000001.jpg

No idea how much it weighed.

Why does that missile look so flimsy and poorly made? is that a mock up?
what is the length of 600 gallons fuel tank?

Return to Modern Military Aircraft

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: carss, Google Adsense [Bot] and 14 guests