F-15X: USAF Seems Interested

Military aircraft - Post cold war aircraft, including for example B-2, Gripen, F-18E/F Super Hornet, Rafale, and Typhoon.
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sferrin

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Unread post01 May 2019, 13:16

131stfwfan wrote:The folks in St. Louis are excited to see Eagles in Air Force markings again.


Again? When did the USAF stop using Eagles? As for excitement, you'll note the USAF is notably NOT excited about more Eagles. It doesn't want them. They're being forced on the USAF. Why is that a good thing?
Last edited by sferrin on 01 May 2019, 18:25, edited 1 time in total.
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sferrin

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Unread post01 May 2019, 13:17

eloise wrote:B-52 out last B-58, B-1 and B-2
I feel F-15 will out last F-14, F-16, F-18, F-22 and F-35


Only in a Warbirds demo.
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Unread post02 May 2019, 01:17

sferrin wrote:
131stfwfan wrote:The folks in St. Louis are excited to see Eagles in Air Force markings again.


Again? When did the USAF stop using Eagles? As for excitement, you'll note the USAF is notably NOT excited about more Eagles. It doesn't want them. They're being forced on the USAF. Why is that a good thing?



QUOTE:

Secretary of the Air Force Heather Wilson

She later told the IG that she never had a discussion with Shanahan about buying the F-15X, a Boeing-made jet.

https://www.defensenews.com/pentagon/20 ... -shanahan/
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Unread post02 May 2019, 01:19

eloise wrote:B-52 out last B-58, B-1 and B-2
I feel F-15 will out last F-14, F-16, F-18, F-22 and F-35



Keep dreaming.......... :doh:
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eloise

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Unread post02 May 2019, 04:46

Corsair1963 wrote:
eloise wrote:B-52 out last B-58, B-1 and B-2
I feel F-15 will out last F-14, F-16, F-18, F-22 and F-35



Keep dreaming.......... :doh:

Dreaming imply I want that to happen, I really don't
But as you see, F-22 production chain is already scraped, it receives minimal upgrades.
New F-15 is still being made, it is the biggest fighter currently in USAF inventory, so it is very useful to carry hypersonic weapons, i don't think it will retire anytime soon.
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Unread post02 May 2019, 08:29

eloise wrote:
Corsair1963 wrote:
eloise wrote:B-52 out last B-58, B-1 and B-2
I feel F-15 will out last F-14, F-16, F-18, F-22 and F-35



Keep dreaming.......... :doh:

Dreaming imply I want that to happen, I really don't
But as you see, F-22 production chain is already scraped, it receives minimal upgrades.
New F-15 is still being made, it is the biggest fighter currently in USAF inventory, so it is very useful to carry hypersonic weapons, i don't think it will retire anytime soon.


Production of the F-15 line will end in 2023. Unless, the USAF acquires the proposed F-15EX. Yet, it's prospects don't look so good at the moment...
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sferrin

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Unread post02 May 2019, 11:46

Corsair1963 wrote:
sferrin wrote:
131stfwfan wrote:The folks in St. Louis are excited to see Eagles in Air Force markings again.


Again? When did the USAF stop using Eagles? As for excitement, you'll note the USAF is notably NOT excited about more Eagles. It doesn't want them. They're being forced on the USAF. Why is that a good thing?



QUOTE:

Secretary of the Air Force Heather Wilson

She later told the IG that she never had a discussion with Shanahan about buying the F-15X, a Boeing-made jet.

https://www.defensenews.com/pentagon/20 ... -shanahan/



So who exactly is forcing the USAF to buy F-15s it doesn't want?
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mixelflick

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Unread post02 May 2019, 12:41

Corsair1963 wrote:
eloise wrote:B-52 out last B-58, B-1 and B-2
I feel F-15 will out last F-14, F-16, F-18, F-22 and F-35



Keep dreaming.......... :doh:


The F-15 has outlasted the F-14. Very questionable it will outlast the Viper, as its a newer airframe and there are many more of them. The way the Navy buys SH's, it will never be retired so no way its outlasting them.

The F-22 and 35 will be in service LONG after the last Eagle is gone. PCA will replace any existing F-15 airframes, and the F-22 will be kept around to complement it. Production has ended but upgrades are ongoing. It's projected to fly for another 30 years at least, which is far longer than any F-15 in USAF service.

Even assuming new F-15EX builds, that aircraft will be obsolete the day it leaves the showroom floor. Unless they're talking about keeping it around for homeland defense missions, it's days will be numbered as soon as its bought. I love the F-15 man, but its best days are behind it. Let it retire with its 104-0 air to air combat record and let it go out on top.

Like ageing athletes trying to make a comeback, the F-15 will only tarnish its legacy if it tries to hang around too long..
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wrightwing

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Unread post02 May 2019, 18:46

eloise wrote:

Dreaming imply I want that to happen, I really don't
But as you see, F-22 production chain is already scraped, it receives minimal upgrades.

Minimal upgrades? F-22s are currently slated to receive massive upgrades. New computers, new displays, helmet sights, new sensors, improved threat libraries/NCTR/IFF, DAS-lite, radar upgrades, increased use of AI, etc....
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Unread post03 May 2019, 00:20

Holmes admitted in congressional testimony today that the total SLEP (longeron, fuselage and wing replacement)
would be all of $10 million/aircraft.


That's substantially lower than any of the previously public released estimates. It's no wonder that
new builds were not in the initial FY2020 budget submission and the SLEP was.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=2870&v=7du-vfIWl2A
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Unread post03 May 2019, 01:27

marauder2048 wrote:Holmes admitted in congressional testimony today that the total SLEP (longeron, fuselage and wing replacement)
would be all of $10 million/aircraft.


That's substantially lower than any of the previously public released estimates. It's no wonder that
new builds were not in the initial FY2020 budget submission and the SLEP was.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=2870&v=7du-vfIWl2A


Even that low number is a terrible waste of money. At the end of the day, all you have is an aircraft that is good for intercepting the occasional Russian off of California or chasing down some errant pilot who didn't see a notam or not very good at navigating. I understand some eagles have finally - finally - gotten a mfd that allows them to actually use their radar to fuller potential, but time to let c/d fleet rest and hand over their mission to the E which has years more life in them until they can be swapped out by 35s. So many of all these issues stem from bush/obama/gates slashing the raptor buy. Thank you Washington DC for cutting defense and increasing illegal immigration.
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marauder2048

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Unread post03 May 2019, 05:40

I think $10 million/aircraft for another 20 years is totally reasonable especially
since they are still spending money on AESA'ing the fleet.

You still have the cost per flying hour of a big twin but I would hope that some
of the air policing role could eventually be assumed by an armed version of T-X.
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Unread post16 May 2019, 02:38

Debate is still going strong about acquiring the F-15EX. :?

Congress Likely to Follow as House Seeks More F-35s, F-15Xs (2)

Posted May 14, 2019 By Travis J. Tritten

Still Committed to F-35

But for most lawmakers, the announcement drew more fire than support.

One Senate group with two Appropriations defense subcommittee members—Susan Collins (R-Maine) and Lisa Murkowski (R-Alaska)—sent a letter to President Donald Trump to urge against more F-15s.

Gen. Joseph Dunford, chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, tried to allay critics’ concerns by saying the Pentagon is committed to building up the F-35 fleet as quickly as possible. “We’ll still be flying F-35s as fast as we can,” Dunford told a Senate Appropriations defense panel.

But the Pentagon hasn’t done a good job explaining its strategic choice to buy new F-15s instead of investing in more advanced fighters, said Byron Callan, a defense analyst at Capital Alpha Partners. “It just kind of came out of left field. There’s a lot to answer for on how this whole thing has unfolded,” he said.

In the end, Congress is likely to keep the F-35 purchases relatively flat—around the 90 or so aircraft funded in the past two years—and also find money for the F-15X program in next year’s defense budget, Callan said.

“I’d be very surprised if the funding was zeroed out,” Callan said, adding that the fate of the F-15X in the future might still be in question. Lawmakers could find funding in the Pentagon’s maintenance or research budgets to fund the aircraft, he said.

Richard Aboulafia, a military analyst at Teal Group, said he expects Congress to increase the number of F-35s but possibly not as much as the last two years, in part due to the military’s request for the F-15X. “But you have to debate it and get vocal about it to get maximum credit,” he said.

No Half Measures

Some lawmakers said the investment is necessary.It makes no sense to buy a non-stealthy fourth-generation fighter and pay for it by using money we’d use to buy a fifth-generation stealthy fighter,” said Sen. John Cornyn(R-Texas), who signed a letter this year opposing more F-15s. Cornyn has an F-35 production facility in his state.

Cornyn said there won’t be enough money this year to buy both the needed F-35s and F-15Xs. The aircraft are in direct competition, he said. “We put our eggs in the F-35 basket. We ought to keep them there.”

Aboulafia said the Air Force also doesn’t appear enthusiastic about the White House’s request to buy F-15Xs, despite the fact its requests might only last as long as Trump’s administration. “I meet very few people outside of the Trump administration who are enthusiastic about adding these planes,” he said.

The reality is Congress remains locked in a partisan battle over spending limits for defense and non-defense programs. Without a deal on the caps, none know just how much the military may receive for either aircraft— or—when it might get the appropriated funds.

https://about.bgov.com/news/congress-li ... -f-15xs-2/
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Unread post16 May 2019, 03:09

marauder2048 wrote:I think $10 million/aircraft for another 20 years is totally reasonable especially
since they are still spending money on AESA'ing the fleet.

You still have the cost per flying hour of a big twin but I would hope that some
of the air policing role could eventually be assumed by an armed version of T-X.


Agreed on all points. An armed T-X derivative would be an outstanding "low" to the F-35. If executed properly, it could handle both air policing and light attack, while allowing the ANG force structure to be rebuilt. Bluntly, there are very few missions executed by F-16s in the last twenty years that an armed trainer couldn't have done just as well.
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Corsair1963

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Unread post16 May 2019, 03:43

sferrin wrote:

So who exactly is forcing the USAF to buy F-15s it doesn't want?



OSD is who.... :?
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