Eurofighter Typhoon

Military aircraft - Post cold war aircraft, including for example B-2, Gripen, F-18E/F Super Hornet, Rafale, and Typhoon.
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weasel1962

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Unread post30 Jul 2020, 07:07

Depends on the engines. If it got a pair of F-135s, the tempest would have a distinct advantage from a load perspective.

This would help.
https://www.rolls-royce.com/media/press ... ramme.aspx
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madrat

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Unread post30 Jul 2020, 12:56

They make it sound like Tempest would sit in wait... as if technology turning to rust isn't a real phenomenon. What happens when you go to reactivate the fleet and everything fails to activate due to operational neglect?

Sounds like Typhoon 2.0 only without a pilot.
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marauder2048

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Unread post30 Jul 2020, 20:55

madrat wrote:They make it sound like Tempest would sit in wait... as if technology turning to rust isn't a real phenomenon. What happens when you go to reactivate the fleet and everything fails to activate due to operational neglect?

Sounds like Typhoon 2.0 only without a pilot.


At least for the earlier, smaller conceptions of UCAS, the aircraft were designed to be dismantled and stored
in environmentally controlled crates.

For a larger fighter, you are looking at an environmentally controlled hangar with the aircraft on some sort
of keep-alive, low-power, fluid circulator mode.
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nutshell

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Unread post30 Jul 2020, 22:59

weasel1962 wrote:Depends on the engines. If it got a pair of F-135s, the tempest would have a distinct advantage from a load perspective.

This would help.
https://www.rolls-royce.com/media/press ... ramme.aspx


If the Tempest mounts 2x F135, then it has to be either a huuuge bird or even funnier looking than the x32.

...and there you go all the 200bln euro we got from the eu's recovery found lol.
We didnt break the bank enough with the JSF!
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sprstdlyscottsmn

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Unread post30 Jul 2020, 23:35

Two F135s, with their planned thrust growth, would be "unlimited power"
"Spurts"

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boff180

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Unread post04 Sep 2020, 19:46

https://www.defensenews.com/global/euro ... c-warfare/

Britain moves forward with its own Typhoon radar primed for electronic warfare

Although Britain and its partners have undertaken substantial work together on common AESA development work through the Euroradar consortium, the Mk2 is effectively a completely different product from the Mk1 forward of the common power supply.


In a joint statement BAE and Leonardo said the multi-functional array radar technology based on AESA was revolutionary will provide game-changing capabilities.

“It has significantly more transmit-receive elements than other radars, making Mk2 the most capable fighter AESA radar in the world, maintaining the same power and precision of traditional radars but also enabling the simultaneous operation of its wide-band electronic warfare functionality,” said the companies.
Andy Evans Aviation Photography
www.evansaviography.co.uk
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mixelflick

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Unread post05 Sep 2020, 14:01

Very sad the way the whole Typhoon story went down..

With the "help" of the US State Dept/Hillary Clinton, Libya was going down the crapper fast. It was an interesting battlefield, with many aircraft of the so-called 4++ generation either debuting or it was still early in their combat history. While the Rafale and other platforms excelled, Typhoon was an aircraft searching for a mission. With little to no air superiority to achieve, it couldn't play due to being ill equipped in the "strike fighter" role. Translation? It couldn't drop bombs. I think something got rushed into theater, but even then they couldn't designate targets - other platforms had to do that.

Air Combat magazine did a feature about 2 years ago, I remember. You'd swear they were in bed with Typhoon's handlers, because every other sentence was "and now the Typhoon (tranche whatever) has true multi-role capability". It read like a sales brochure. What I could never figure out was why it took so long to get it an AESA/more capable radar. Just weird, especially given that issue was often cited for why it didn't sell.

Which is really too bad, because there's not many aircraft that can hang with the F-22, at least WVR. The excess power, its ability to turn, super-cruise and then when it got Meteor.. Fantastic airframe/kinematics and certainly looks the part. It'll be curious to see how Quatar's Typhoons stack up in service there, especially given all the other types flying shoulder to shoulder..
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spad_s.xiii

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Unread post05 Sep 2020, 15:56

I wonder if the new Typhoon-radar will be GaN-based?
Not that many fighter radars that are GaN-based, yet, although it´s been 5 years since Raython and Saab got the Aviation Week´s award for bringing GaN to radar and EW-systems.

Interesting that UK continue to invest a lot into Typhoon instead of buying more F-35:s.
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hornetfinn

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Unread post07 Sep 2020, 15:24

spad_s.xiii wrote:I wonder if the new Typhoon-radar will be GaN-based?
Not that many fighter radars that are GaN-based, yet, although it´s been 5 years since Raython and Saab got the Aviation Week´s award for bringing GaN to radar and EW-systems.

Interesting that UK continue to invest a lot into Typhoon instead of buying more F-35:s.


GaN is a possibility as there are now several radars that use the technology, even airborne ones. It would create interesting situation as Eurofighter Typhoon with GaN AESA could easily have significantly longer effective range than even the current F-22 while potentially having a lot better EW resistance and LPI features. That would make it a very fearsome interceptor especially with Meteor missiles. Of course that doesn't change the fact that it will have comparatively huge RCS and does not have IFDL/MADL equivalent datalink. It is also (at least currently) far behind when it comes to sensor fusion. But it would make the comparison a lot more interesting.

Of course I'm expecting F-22 and F-35 to get GaN radars at some point in the future. Currently their performance is likely more than good enough in the near future.
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hythelday

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Unread post07 Sep 2020, 18:16

Austria negotiating sale of 15 Typhoon jets to Indonesia

By Tom Dunlop, September 7, 2020
https://ukdefencejournal.org.uk/austria ... indonesia/

Tanner (Austira MoD) said she had directed the General Staff to prepare for negotiations with Jakarta.

She said the “exit from the Eurofighter system” is the declared goal and the sale is in the best interest of taxpayers.


And also Austiran original source:

https://translate.google.com/translate? ... %2F2223112

Asia Deal: This is how Tanner wants to get rid of Eurofighter

What began two months ago with a mysterious letter from Indonesia is now developing into Austria's best chance of actually getting rid of the unloved Eurofighters: Minister Klaudia Tanner has now replied to her Indonesian counterpart Prabowo Subianto for the first time and announced that she wants to enter into specific sales negotiations with him . At the same time, she ordered her General Staff to prepare everything for the recommended sale. In the direction of Indonesia it was said: "We are happy to accept your interest in purchasing the fifteen Austrian Eurofighters to modernize your air fleet."


Compared to the “Krone”, Klaudia Tanner confirmed her will to get rid of the Eurofighter after only 15 years of operation: “After an intensive examination, the General Staff confirmed the authenticity of the letter and recommended that we take advantage of any sales option,” said Tanner. “Now we are informing Indonesia that we will examine the sale legally and hold talks with everyone involved. That is our responsibility to all taxpayers - and the exit from the Eurofighter system is our declared goal. However, it is also clear that any sale is very complex and difficult due to the Darabos gag agreement. "


Ouch.
Another chance for Gripen, or will Austria get rid of fast jets altogether? Swiss tender seems too far ahead already to make a joint procurement, and then again the Swiss are probably not interested anyway. German ambassador should make another bombastic pitch for more new Eurofighters to replace old Eurofighters, like he did in Finland. :D
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madrat

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Unread post07 Sep 2020, 22:11

They cannot save money by selling and buying something new. It's an obvious ploy to disarm their air forces.
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spad_s.xiii

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Unread post08 Sep 2020, 01:32

Well, they say that their Eurofighters CPFH is 70 000 Euro and Austria can save 2 billion Euro until 2035, if they change to a cheaper aircraft. Also talked about renting. Talks about this has been going on almost since the delivery of the Typhoons.
Maybe they can share with the Swiss outside of office hours: https://www.thelocal.at/20140621/hungar ... rian-skies
"The move to radically cut defense spending and rely on allies increases the likelihood that Austria will experience what happened in Switzerland earlier in the year, when a hijacked Ethiopian plane was forced to land in Geneva - escorted by French fighters, since Swiss military planes only fly during regular office hours."
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hornetfinn

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Unread post08 Sep 2020, 12:02

madrat wrote:They cannot save money by selling and buying something new. It's an obvious ploy to disarm their air forces.


Eurofighter Typhoon seems to be rather expensive to maintain and support like they found out in Danish competition (more expensive than either F-35 or Super Hornet). It seems that Austria should've really bought F-16s or JAS Gripens instead of EF Typhoons in the first place as those are definitely cheaper to operate.

I think Austria will find that replacing Typhoons with any real fighter jet is going to be expensive. Maybe they should go for Aermacchi M-346FA or KAI FA-50 which seem to be about half the price of "real" fighter jets and definitely have significantly lower operating costs. Boeing/Saab could also make a fighter version of T-7 Red Hawk. Just put something like Leonardo Grifo-E or Elta ELM-2052 in it to give decent capabilities. I'd put some money on BVR missiles also and even some air-to-ground munitions. Something like MICA or Derby missiles would likely be good alternative in such a small aircraft and give them decent punch.
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loke

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Unread post08 Sep 2020, 12:41

hornetfinn wrote:
madrat wrote:They cannot save money by selling and buying something new. It's an obvious ploy to disarm their air forces.


Eurofighter Typhoon seems to be rather expensive to maintain and support like they found out in Danish competition (more expensive than either F-35 or Super Hornet). It seems that Austria should've really bought F-16s or JAS Gripens instead of EF Typhoons in the first place as those are definitely cheaper to operate.

I think Austria will find that replacing Typhoons with any real fighter jet is going to be expensive. Maybe they should go for Aermacchi M-346FA or KAI FA-50 which seem to be about half the price of "real" fighter jets and definitely have significantly lower operating costs. Boeing/Saab could also make a fighter version of T-7 Red Hawk. Just put something like Leonardo Grifo-E or Elta ELM-2052 in it to give decent capabilities. I'd put some money on BVR missiles also and even some air-to-ground munitions. Something like MICA or Derby missiles would likely be good alternative in such a small aircraft and give them decent punch.

Hungary and Czech republic have demonstrated that they can do QRA (and training) with 14 Gripen C/D, in a quite affordable manner. Austria should be able to do the same. More expensive than a trainer, but should be possible for a country the size of Austria. The Czech republic defense expenditure was only 1.78 Billion USD in 2015, increased to 2.7B USD in 2018.

Austria: spending was very low at 2.67B USD in 2015, but has increased annually since then and was 3.37B USD in 2018.

Of course Austria may decide to prioritize other things than air force; perhaps a navy...? :D

https://www.macrotrends.net/countries/C ... nse-budget

https://www.macrotrends.net/countries/A ... nse-budget
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mixelflick

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Unread post08 Sep 2020, 14:54

As much as I hate to say it, this is one instance where Gripen might make sense.

If there were more Gripens in service I'd even entertain buying used (if I were Austria). Won't ever happen though, Gripen is a niche aircraft for smaller countries with very finite resources. Will be interesting to see how Brazil does with their E's..
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