Turkish fighter jet (F-16) crashes after training flight

Unread postPosted: 12 Dec 2016, 23:10
by airforces_freak
Image

Turkish fighter jet crashes after training flight
The pilot ejected from the F-16 and was uninjured.
By Doug G. Ware | Dec. 12, 2016 at 1:50 PM
http://www.upi.com/Top_News/World-News/ ... 481566708/

ANKARA, Turkey, Dec. 12 (UPI) -- A Turkish fighter jet crashed after a training missions Monday, military officials said.

The F-16 was returning from the training sortie and attempting to land at a military base in Diyarbakir when it crashed, officials said.

The pilot ejected before the plane went down.

The cause of the crash wasn't immediately known. No injuries were reported.

Turkey has been part of military operations in northern Syria, where they have targeted Islamic State militants and Kurdish forces.

Diyarbakir is about 80 miles north of the Syrian border.


This brings Turkey's viper fleet to 239.

We do not know whether the aircraft was a Block 30 which underwent a Turkish indigenous modernization program or a CCIP/Advanced Block 50+.

As a result of the numerous attrition losses of late the Turkish Air Force may order another squadron of vipers as a stop-gap measure until it "commissions" its F-35 in 2018. However, a further F-16 order is more likely in light of Mr. Trump's recent statements on the JSF program. The Turkish Aerospace Industries F-16 production line has also not yet been decommissioned as it delivered its last F-16 Block 50+ only a year ago. Thus, reactivating this line would be quite easy.

The Turkish Air Force which usually has 500 combat aircraft in its fleet had had this size drop to 300 aircraft when it decided to retire the majority of its F-4 Flying coffins but was then unable to replace them with new F-16's due to the financial crisis at the time.

Re: Turkish fighter jet (F-16) crashes after training flight

Unread postPosted: 12 Dec 2016, 23:46
by Lieven
Thanks for the post! We added an article on http://www.f-16.net/f-16-news-article5039.html

Early rumors stated it was the same pilot who ejected on September 2nd, 2014 in the same area. That seems to be false though.

Re: Turkish fighter jet (F-16) crashes after training flight

Unread postPosted: 12 Dec 2016, 23:56
by airforces_freak
Lieven wrote:Thanks for the post! We added an article on http://www.f-16.net/f-16-news-article5039.html

Early rumors stated it was the same pilot who ejected on September 2nd, 2014 in the same area. That seems to be false though.


No probs Lieven.

There are strong rumors from sources close to TuAF circles that this was the product of a MANPAD rather than a training mission going wrong.

Re: Turkish fighter jet (F-16) crashes after training flight

Unread postPosted: 13 Dec 2016, 00:47
by geokav
airforces_freak wrote:There are strong rumors from sources close to TuAF circles that this was the product of a MANPAD rather than a training mission going wrong.


So..., someone was hiding in the bushes and fired a surface to air missile against the F16...???
It would be nice if you can bring some more information about this mishap.

Re: Turkish fighter jet (F-16) crashes after training flight

Unread postPosted: 13 Dec 2016, 03:25
by airforces_freak
geokav wrote:
airforces_freak wrote:There are strong rumors from sources close to TuAF circles that this was the product of a MANPAD rather than a training mission going wrong.


So..., someone was hiding in the bushes and fired a surface to air missile against the F16...???
It would be nice if you can bring some more information about this mishap.


F-16's are also susceptible to MANPADS during take-off and landing.

The timing of the incident grossly corresponds to the timeframes the TuAF were conducting bombing missions in Northern Iraq against PKK targets.

The chatter is that the aircraft sustained a hit. This could be from MANPADs or 12.7mm or 14.5mm Anti-Aircraft gun rounds which the PKK have in their "inventory".

The US Congress (NATIONAL DEFENSE AUTHORIZATION ACT FOR FISCAL YEAR 2017) had authorised the US to arm the YPG/SDF with MANPADS: See http://docs.house.gov/billsthisweek/201 ... -S2943.pdf and http://www.kurdistan24.net/en/news/e357 ... s-in-Syria

If it is confirmed that it was in fact a US supplied manpad to the YPG/SDF that hit this aircraft this will cause a massive crisis of confidence between the two countries.

This incident will also have massive implications for civilian aviation in the region if it is confirmed that a MANPAD was responsible.

Re: Turkish fighter jet (F-16) crashes after training flight

Unread postPosted: 13 Dec 2016, 03:39
by airforces_freak
Open sources in Turkey are reporting that:

(1) the Pilot has confirmed in an interview that she sustained a direct hit.
(2) the aircraft crashed into a field next to Diyarbakir Airbase.

If the above is true, a MANPAD attack during takeoff or landing is more plausible.

Re: Turkish fighter jet (F-16) crashes after training flight

Unread postPosted: 13 Dec 2016, 04:08
by saberrider
airforces_freak wrote:Open sources in Turkey are reporting that:

(1) the Pilot has confirmed in an interview that she sustained a direct hit.

So the pilot is a woman?

Re: Turkish fighter jet (F-16) crashes after training flight

Unread postPosted: 13 Dec 2016, 04:48
by airforces_freak
saberrider wrote:
airforces_freak wrote:Open sources in Turkey are reporting that:

(1) the Pilot has confirmed in an interview that she sustained a direct hit.

So the pilot is a woman?


Many pilots in the Turkish Air Force are females.

Image
Maj. Esra Ozatay is even a Squadron Commander.

Image

Re: Turkish fighter jet (F-16) crashes after training flight

Unread postPosted: 13 Dec 2016, 07:40
by Bjorn
If anyone knows a serial, that would be nice to update our aircraft database.

Greets,

Re: Turkish fighter jet (F-16) crashes after training flight

Unread postPosted: 13 Dec 2016, 09:04
by airforces_freak
Update: aircraft belongs to the 181 Filo (Pars).

Re: Turkish fighter jet (F-16) crashes after training flight

Unread postPosted: 13 Dec 2016, 11:02
by mafaky
1) Its yet unclear if the surviving pilot is a male or female. It's only confirmed that the pilot is a lieutenant.
2) It's yet unclear if the lost F-16 is a Block 40 or 50+ one. 181 Pars squadron normally flies with Block 40.
3) If the pilot is a female one, she definitely is not the pilot named "Burcu" who survived another mishap several years back, again at Diyarbakır AFB. Ms. Burcu is not in TuAF any longer, she's flying as FO in Pegasus Airlines; the Turkish LCC.

Re: Turkish fighter jet (F-16) crashes after training flight

Unread postPosted: 13 Dec 2016, 11:09
by airforces_freak
mafaky wrote:1) Its yet unclear if the surviving pilot is a male or female. It's only confirmed that the pilot is a lieutenant.
2) It's yet unclear if the lost F-16 is a Block 40 or 50+ one. 181 Pars squadron normally flies with Block 40.
3) If the pilot is a female one, she definitely is not the pilot named "Burcu" who survived another mishap several years back, again at Diyarbakır AFB. Ms. Burcu is not in TuAF any longer, she's flying as FO in Pegasus Airlines; the Turkish LCC.


Photo's floating around of the wreckage show Conformal Fuel Tanks which thus confirms that this aircraft is a Advanced Block 50+ recently commissioned.

Your statement on Lt (Ret.) Şefika Burcu Arpacı is correct. She is no longer a commissioned officer in the TuAF. HOWEVER, a recent Presidential degree called for the immediate return of former TuAF pilots to serve in the Air National Guard due to a pilot shortage after the purge of 300 pilots who took part in the 15 July coup attempt. Hence, there may still be some truth to these allegations by some circles. We will need to wait and see.

News reports indicate that a female was taken to hospital after the crash.

Re: Turkish fighter jet (F-16) crashes after training flight

Unread postPosted: 13 Dec 2016, 11:18
by airforces_freak
Update: The pilot is most definitely a male.

Footage taken by Kurdish villagers at the site of crash. Scroll to 4:25 to see pilot.


Re: Turkish fighter jet (F-16) crashes after training flight

Unread postPosted: 13 Dec 2016, 13:44
by geokav
airforces_freak wrote:Open sources in Turkey are reporting that:

(1) the Pilot has confirmed in an interview that she sustained a direct hit.
(2) the aircraft crashed into a field next to Diyarbakir Airbase.

If the above is true, a MANPAD attack during takeoff or landing is more plausible.


Every aircraft in the world are vulnerable during take off and landing. There is no information if it was a two seater or a single seat aircraft, but this isn't the issue. The problem is that if it really been hit by a missile, then you have a very serious problem...

Re: Turkish fighter jet (F-16) crashes after training flight

Unread postPosted: 13 Dec 2016, 13:53
by airforces_freak
geokav wrote:
airforces_freak wrote:Open sources in Turkey are reporting that:

(1) the Pilot has confirmed in an interview that she sustained a direct hit.
(2) the aircraft crashed into a field next to Diyarbakir Airbase.

If the above is true, a MANPAD attack during takeoff or landing is more plausible.


Every aircraft in the world are vulnerable during take off and landing. There is no information if it was a two seater or a single seat aircraft, but this isn't the issue. The problem is that if it really been hit by a missile, then you have a very serious problem...


AFAIK F-16's operated by the 181 filo are single seaters.

The possibility of this being a MANPAD has Turkish Defence circles alarmed. One needs to note that Sabiha Gokcen Airport in the heart of Istanbul came under rocket-propelled grenade attack just only a few months ago and also that a Turkish Cobra was shot-down by a MANPAD as well more recently.

If this is confirmed it will also have massive geopolitical implications. Turkish Crash Investigators are conducting a meticulous investigation as we speak. Their objective is to find the cause and if it is due to a direct hit identify the weapon used and country of origin.

Re: Turkish fighter jet (F-16) crashes after training flight

Unread postPosted: 15 Dec 2016, 09:47
by airforces_freak
UPDATE:

Plane is from 181 filo (Pars)- Panther
PKK Claims shootdown

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PKK claims shootdown of Turkish F16
http://www.kurdistan24.net/en/news/b5b1 ... urkish-F16

ERBIL, Kurdistan Region (Kurdistan24) - Kurdistan Workers' Party (PKK) claimed on Wednesday to have shot down the Turkish F16 warplane that crashed near the Kurdish city of Diyarbakir two days ago.

In a statement on its website, the PKK's armed wing People's Defence Forces (HPG) said one of its militant teams targeted the jet taking off from Turkish Air Force's 8th Main Jet Base at the Diyarbakir Airport around 19:30 on December 12.

Warplanes used for daily bombing runs on Kurdistan Workers' Party (PKK) targets in mountainous areas usually take off from the same airport also used for civilian purposes.

"The operation was conducted with the use of special methods," read the statement without elaborating further how the PKK which fights Turkey in a four decades-long warfare for Kurdish rights.

It said the shootdown of the jet was in response to "bombings in the mountains of Kurdistan" and accused the Turkish ruling Justice and Development Party (AKP) and the media of "twisting" facts.

The jet crashed some 2 miles from the airport's runway, according to a press release by the Turkish General Staff published hours after the incident.

The army also added the cause was still unknown, as the pilot flying the aircraft who survived the crash with no wounds by ejecting himself from the cockpit was on a training mission.

Deputy Prime Minister Numan Kurtulmus told reporters in an Ankara press conference on Wednesday that the incident was under investigation to determine whether it was caused by a technical failure or "external factor."


If confirmed this is going to strain US-Turkey relations a lot.

Re: Turkish fighter jet (F-16) crashes after training flight

Unread postPosted: 15 Dec 2016, 18:19
by geokav
airforces_freak wrote:If confirmed this is going to strain US-Turkey relations a lot.


Is this your personal opinion, or from those known circles around TuAF ?
Well..., nothing will happen, simple as that...

Re: Turkish fighter jet (F-16) crashes after training flight

Unread postPosted: 15 Dec 2016, 23:01
by airforces_freak
geokav wrote:
airforces_freak wrote:If confirmed this is going to strain US-Turkey relations a lot.


Is this your personal opinion, or from those known circles around TuAF ?
Well..., nothing will happen, simple as that...


Turkish Government officials.

A lot can happen actually.

Firstly there will be internal pressure to abandon the West and join the Eastern bloc if it is confirmed US Supplied weapons were used in this attack. Turkey warned the US congress that ISIS has no airforce and as such there was no need to arm the SDF/YPG with MANPADS. It would merely be used by PKK forces against Turkey. And it seems as though this has occurred.

Turkey can arm Turkish backed Rebels in Syria in reply with Turkish MANPADS or even anti-aircraft weapons which would be a great threat to all aircraft in the area.

Turkey can also increase its support to Russia.

Re: Turkish fighter jet (F-16) crashes after training flight

Unread postPosted: 15 Dec 2016, 23:57
by geokav
airforces_freak wrote:Turkish Government officials.
A lot can happen actually.
Firstly there will be internal pressure to abandon the West and join the Eastern bloc if it is confirmed US Supplied weapons were used in this attack. Turkey warned the US congress that ISIS has no airforce and as such there was no need to arm the SDF/YPG with MANPADS. It would merely be used by PKK forces against Turkey. And it seems as though this has occurred.

Turkey can arm Turkish backed Rebels in Syria in reply with Turkish MANPADS or even anti-aircraft weapons which would be a great threat to all aircraft in the area.

Turkey can also increase its support to Russia.


I assume that joining east again, is like going back home...

"I have no further questions Your Honor..."

Re: Turkish fighter jet (F-16) crashes after training flight

Unread postPosted: 16 Dec 2016, 06:21
by airforces_freak
geokav wrote:
airforces_freak wrote:Turkish Government officials.
A lot can happen actually.
Firstly there will be internal pressure to abandon the West and join the Eastern bloc if it is confirmed US Supplied weapons were used in this attack. Turkey warned the US congress that ISIS has no airforce and as such there was no need to arm the SDF/YPG with MANPADS. It would merely be used by PKK forces against Turkey. And it seems as though this has occurred.

Turkey can arm Turkish backed Rebels in Syria in reply with Turkish MANPADS or even anti-aircraft weapons which would be a great threat to all aircraft in the area.

Turkey can also increase its support to Russia.


I assume that joining east again, is like going back home...

"I have no further questions Your Honor..."


Message received.

You only assume? It's a fact. It would take Turkey back at least 50 years to when Truman fought for Turkey and Greece joining the North Atlantic Treaty Alliance.

BUT how long should the Turks bend over when their ally is not acting like an ally? We can look at it from Washington's eyes as much as we like but we also need to look at the Turkish perspective. Turkish citizens are being butchered by Western arms and their aircraft are being downed by Western made MANPAD, as punishment for seeking to prevent the partitioning of their former imperial possessions (Iraq and Syria)...which is evoking some really bad memories for the Turks (WWI partitioning of the Ottoman Empire). The Turks are so paranoid that they think the US is making plans to invade and partition their country. Paranoia can lead to radical and erratic behavior.

Mr. Putin is merely seizing the opportunity. And if you think that Mr. Putin will stop at Turkey you are grossly mistaken! If the US does not get its act together, stop the post-election tension at home and focus on its foreign policy it is set to loose a lot more allies to Mr. Putin.

Re: Turkish fighter jet (F-16) crashes after training flight

Unread postPosted: 16 Dec 2016, 21:21
by botsing
So it is not clear what really happened but it must be a MANPAD that was made and supplied by the USA?

Like there is no, like none, possibility that IF a MANPAD was used that it could have been Iranian, Chinese, European or Russian made and supplied by something else than the USA?

Like, there has never been a delivery of Iranian made MANPADs to Yemen and Iraq for example? Or Chinese made MANPADs that were supplied to Syria by Sudan?

And all those MANPADS that were never delivered to Syria and Iraq never changed hands of course... All just honest freedom warriors...

https://warisboring.com/iran-backed-ter ... .a06pof4l7

https://www.bellingcat.com/news/mena/20 ... 0/draft-1/

Re: Turkish fighter jet (F-16) crashes after training flight

Unread postPosted: 17 Dec 2016, 15:27
by vilters
If I drive my Mercedes car into some innocent people? => Is Germany at fault? (Germany build the Mercedes car.)
The maker of the weapon is not important. The seller or retailer is not at fault.

The guy behind the trigger did it.

Tja, this happens when you fight your own people.
Disarm EVERYBODY in Turkey, and the fight will continue with sand and stones, and wooden planks.

PS : The same goes for Syria, North Irak, Iran, everywhere when government does not listen to their population.
You can soon add Congo to that list.

Listen to your people, and the fights stop automatically.
Pretty simple actually.
You only need your ears.

Re: Turkish fighter jet (F-16) crashes after training flight

Unread postPosted: 18 Dec 2016, 01:39
by botsing
airforces_freak wrote:bla bla

So you say that Turkey is too weak to acknowledge it could have been something else but a manpad? And even though Turkey is not sure what happened it was a manpad that was made and provided by the USA?

Man, you are easy prey to whatever politics is at play. Are you sure you are blind to this?

Re: Turkish fighter jet (F-16) crashes after training flight

Unread postPosted: 18 Dec 2016, 11:21
by airforces_freak
vilters wrote:If I drive my Mercedes car into some innocent people? => Is Germany at fault? (Germany build the Mercedes car.)
The maker of the weapon is not important. The seller or retailer is not at fault.

The guy behind the trigger did it.

Tja, this happens when you fight your own people.
Disarm EVERYBODY in Turkey, and the fight will continue with sand and stones, and wooden planks.

PS : The same goes for Syria, North Irak, Iran, everywhere when government does not listen to their population.
You can soon add Congo to that list.

Listen to your people, and the fights stop automatically.
Pretty simple actually.
You only need your ears.


Have you heard of micro-dotting and nuclear tracing? Well the Turks have been using the aforementioned to track weapons transfers to the PKK for the past 5 years. They also have Human Intelligence to also back up their position up.

Western weapons destined to the YPG/SDF somehow end up in PKK hands. Now even if this does not evidence the Wests intention to arm a terrorist group it shows that the Western States are grossly negligent. Congress blocks the sale of 12.5mm ammunition to Turkey yet a terrorist group miraculously can procure TOW ATGM's.

Re: Turkish fighter jet (F-16) crashes after training flight

Unread postPosted: 27 Dec 2016, 13:29
by pron
Not a crash this time, but a video released by the Hellenic Air Force on Friday shows intense dogfight between Greek and Turkish F-16 jets. The dogfight is believed to have taken place over Greece’s Karpathos island.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AiHHc6EXhPE

A lot of turkish planes have violated Greece airspace lately, or should we say at all times.

Re: Turkish fighter jet (F-16) crashes after training flight

Unread postPosted: 28 Dec 2016, 19:25
by geokav
pron wrote:Not a crash this time, but a video released by the Hellenic Air Force on Friday shows intense dogfight between Greek and Turkish F-16 jets. The dogfight is believed to have taken place over Greece’s Karpathos island.

<span class="skimlinks-unlinked">https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AiHHc6EXhPE</span>

A lot of turkish planes have violated Greece airspace lately, or should we say at all times.

Yes, we all know that, but what this has to do with this thread? Nothing I guess...