MiG-23MLD vs F-16

Agreed, it will never be a fair fight but how would the F-16 match up against the ... ?
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WILZ

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Unread post05 Jan 2005, 21:21

Though it is a fast jet and has been beefed up with hot avionics and shooters... The jet is no match for the Viper... It is fat and heavy and bleeds off energy like a MFer. I am a John Boyd fan and the Viper is second to none. You can also talk about the F-15C and all the BS with it but the bottom line is when you have a group of Viper Drivers who can fly the right track, you can sneak by the Eagle(regardless of its big honkin eyes) and hose the SOB every time. When you see an Eagle loaded up with all those missiles, it puts a smile on a Viper drivers face... you can rate him every time.... Cheers... I hope that I started an argument...

and BTW... Imagine if the AF didnt mess with the Viper after it was introduced and left 320 SQ/FT of wings on the thing... instead of shrinking them to 300...
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DerLoos

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Unread post06 Jan 2005, 09:34

Yes, Flogger's absolutely no match for Viper as soon as it's a third-gen. fighter. More of that, what concerns fighter version, not the attack one, it's hardly a star of the generation. Numerous problems of first production series in addition to variable geometry wing problems were absolutely redundant for air superiority fighter while variable geometry appared to be an extremely fruitfuk idea for attack/close air support plane. Contraditory plane but gave us several succesful versions.
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JR007

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Unread post07 Jan 2005, 00:58

Check the <a href="f-16_forum_viewtopic-t-683.html">"MiG-29 vs F-16" thread</a> for some nice pics of Mig construction.
Burning debris never reversed on anyone…

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kubam4a1

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Unread post09 Feb 2005, 18:57

The newest MiG-23MLDs from the latest 80s are have even got R-73 with helmet-mounted sight SZCZEL-3U - older version of Szczel-3UM mounted on MiG-29A. Together with their all-weather capabilities and strenght of R-73 - they would IMHO BEAT the F-16A/B (excepting the MLU and ADF)
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JR007

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Unread post24 Feb 2005, 20:17

You can't hit what you can't see, and out of the Mig-23, all you can see is what is passing over your canopy. For those of you that have never been in a 23 pit...
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ACSheva

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Unread post25 Feb 2005, 01:50

Except the radar may see what you can't see...
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parrothead

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Unread post25 Feb 2005, 08:28

Shev, I believe JR was referring to the helmet mounted site referenced by kubam4a1 :wink: .
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JR007

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Unread post25 Feb 2005, 16:02

Yup, if you ain't got a visual, your helmet mounted doodad is worthless as tits on a boar hog...
Burning debris never reversed on anyone…

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kubam4a1

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Unread post26 Feb 2005, 10:42

JR007 wrote:Yup, if you ain't got a visual, your helmet mounted doodad is worthless as tits on a boar hog...

I agree, but F-16A/B (no ADF and no MLU) has no BVR capabilities, while MiG-23MLD has....So....
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MATMACWC

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Unread post26 Feb 2005, 21:26

So... so... so what??? The US doesn't fly F-16A/B into combat, case closed. Why not compare the F-86 vs. the F-22 if you're gonna say something like that!!!
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kubam4a1

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Unread post27 Feb 2005, 19:50

But...some other countries use old F-16A/Bs w/o BVR capabilities....
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MATMACWC

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Unread post03 Mar 2005, 02:19

This is a VERY bad argument. OK kubam4a1, you are right but... Any country that bought F-16 from the USA might be a friend of the... USA?? Mute point in my opinion...
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kubam4a1

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Unread post03 Mar 2005, 16:35

MiG-23MLD is NOT the newest fighter used by Russia's "friends". It is a historical comparison (mostly) I think...
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CheckSix

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Unread post04 Mar 2005, 09:34

kubam4a1 wrote:MiG-23MLD is NOT the newest fighter used by Russia's "friends". It is a historical comparison (mostly) I think...


Absolutely!
AIM-120 was introduced in the early 90s. Up to that point, MiG-23, especially the enlighted MLD variant is a potent adversary.
Of cause a newer F-16C is superiour, but that does not mean it kills th 23, because the MiG is really fast.
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Pumpkin

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Unread post04 Mar 2005, 22:12

kubam4a1 wrote:I agree, but F-16A/B (no ADF and no MLU) has no BVR capabilities, while MiG-23MLD has....So....


kubam4a1, I believe the closest encounters of your above mentioned will be between,

[1] PAF F-16A/B and V-VS MiG-23MLD. Though the BVR of the MLD might not have been fully exploited, due to ROE constraint. If you have not read this article on ACIG before, it will be a good read.

[2] IDF/AF F-16A/B and SyAF MiG-23 (Not sure if the 23s were MLD and BVR capable. There was a pretty interesting discussion on the Syrian MiG-23 on Aviation Forum).

cheers,
Desmond
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