F-16C Block50 vs Su-27SKM Dogfight Guns Only..

[fatcap]

I know we now have the JHMCS+9X but.. still interested in a classical guns only dogfight scenario between the modern Viper and the non-TVC Flanker..

Just assume that the pilots' skills are equal.. and they all kept tally on each other throughout the fight(I know that's not fair for the Viper driver).. Based on a pure performance comparison who do you think would win?

Viper's known for its ability to turn like no other in the classical 4th gen fighter arena(not talking about Rafale/Typhoon and such..), but is this view somehow outdated?

Thanx -___-

[sprstdlyscottsmn]

The flanker has the ability to rake the nose across the sky with a cobra, but that is usless in a gunfight. The speed retention and better power to weight ratio will see the viper come out on top.

[runi_dk]

My guess is 55% and 45%, with the favour to the Viper.

[fatcap]

lol im well aware of this cobra sh*t..
my guess is that the flanker's instantaneous turn rate is higher.. but that'd be less useful in a gunfight~
i hope viper would still have a sustained turn rate advantage over the flanker, as well as better acceleration and SEP~
dont think we need to compare roll performance:D

[sprstdlyscottsmn]

Instantaneous turn rates mean nothing if you bleed off speed too quickly, but your right, we all know who the rolling king is.

[callsignthumper]

I play ace combat 6 online, and love the block-52c that the game use's, that being said it is a game, and even though it has some realistic features, there is no g forceto contend with, and they have the high g turn bs, but with missles only, basicaly side-winders? The f-16 is stable at the lower speeds, and i find the gun, and missle only matchs in favor of the f-16 to almost any aircraft, including the su=47, which has a problem stalling when using the high g turn, in the fight, and i can also hold my own against the f-22, which also has stealth in the game, so it comes in, and out of the radar, which makes it hard to keep a lock onto. But for real life, i like the f-16, depends on the pilot, how much g's can he handle realy, if a jet has no problem pulling 10 g's, does it realy matter what jet it is??? Ive learned pilot skill makes ALL the differeance, because when i tangle with Rafaels, and su=33's, and Typhoons, and 47's its all about Attack angle, and when to turn into them.

[sprstdlyscottsmn]

Ace Combat, while pretty is not a flight simulator, it is an aviation arcade.

[callsignthumper]

Well i agree in the sense, that there is no "breaking point", and no g-force to contend with, but that just maks the super planes such as the Su-47, and F-22 that much more bad-ass. So it even's itself out. I take it by your comment, that your not any good at that game, which is the best way to hone in your dog fighting skills, because i dont see any other better games to fly against other people on a mass production. Go out and play it on-line. The planes are realistic in the sense, that f-16 is crapy, compared to the 22, and there is a HUGE differeance in the flight characteristics for each jet. With missles only, i can take it to any plane in the game with a A-10!!!!!! lol WHY, and its hard as hell, is because you have to play chess when dog-fighting. I'm pretty sure that most if not all active pilots in the US OF A, have ever seen air combat, let alone, much of anything else besides bombing. Ive flown realistic simulators, one with the super-turd in the navy sim full dne up cock pit, and huge screen, and aced its three programs with flying colors. Which included taking off, dog-fighting, and landing. Although very basic, first time in a real simulator, and passed the first time out in all three, plus being one of the top pilots in ace-combat . I believe that i could be a VERY effective pilot in the real world. I am also considering getting my private pilot license, as soon as im done my degree in business management. So basicaly like i said if your plane canhandle 10 g's then its realy up to pilot skill.

[sprstdlyscottsmn]

wow, we are doing the tango on so many threads now. I already have a pilots licence as well as an aerospace engineering degree so I have a good understanding of aircraft performance. As to Xbox games, I don't own one. There has never, I say again, never been a flight simulator for a console system. I play flight simulators on computer, and I play the best one there is, Falcon 4.0. I play both the new release Allied Force and the latest Open Falcon varients. Those games have the most advanced flight physics ever done for a combat simulator, as well as the most accurate avionics. I too have flown full spec simulators for hornet, viper, phantom, and apache. I was the only one in my class who could land on the carrier the first time and had a perfect kill ratio.... all that means NOTHING! Put me into a real F-16 and make me go to guns against as Isreali F-4 pilot and I would get wasted in seconds. Oh BTW, no fighter pulls 10G, they pull 9 if they are lucky, and only if they are low altitude and light weight.

[cchief16]

you probably have to be 12 to compare Ace Combat to real life.... just saying. now back to reality

[callsignthumper]

I love falcon 4.0 I played alot of Gold. Well im pretty sure that there are pilots who can pull 10 g's, even if there not allowed to try, anyways hey you can mock anyone you want, bottom line we all are on here, because of the love for fighter jets. You play Falcon 4.0, and i play ace-combat. Like you said, simulator/game is just that;" a program". Nothing can prepare us for real time combat like real time combat. Untill somone on here engages a enemy in real time combat, we are just a bunch of wanabes, with to much time on our hands.

[StolichnayaStrafer]

Untill somone on here engages a enemy in real time combat, we are just a bunch of wanabes, with to much time on our hands.

Uhm, speak for yourself. This Forum has a considerable amount of combat veterans, maintenance personnel, and engineers from the aerospace field. That being said, you need to learn how to better your interactions here. As a "civilian" member here such as myself, you need to show some respect and behave with some decorum.

For the record- judging by the quality of YOUR posting so far, YOU certainly have too much time on YOUR hands.

[callsignthumper]

I am a veteran, and i give props to fellow vets, especialy men who have been in the thick of things, and appreciate some of there personal sacrafices, which is honorable. Your right, i should have worded that post towards everyone on here who has never flown in combat.