Norwegian F-35As take up QRA duties in Iceland

gc · by gc » 01 Mar 2020, 06:39

Sad to see the Norwegian commander talk so much about the large logistical tail without going more into the unique capabilities that the F-35 brings to the air policing role. Hope the large logistical tail is related to relative inexperience on the platform and improves with time. Wonder if this bad publicity will swing the Finland’s H-X programme against the F-35.

https://youtu.be/ftBs1pjcrDw

hythelday · by **hythelday** » 01 Mar 2020, 09:57

If F-35 has a large logistical tail then it has a large logistical tail. No reason to think that it is always better than everything else in every possible dimension.

Finns will be given the most reliable info from first hands, they don't need to base their evaluations on some verbal accounts. If they select F-35 nontheless then you know that other benefits of F-35 outweigh this.

magitsu · by **magitsu** » 01 Mar 2020, 14:35

The locals and a few members of the international av/mil press took notice when LM arrived with not one but two C-17s to support the F-35A eval in Finland. Which Boeing turned into a pr win the next week by bringing everything inside the Omega DC-10 tanker for 1 E, 1 F and 1 G.

Though last summer in Switzerland LM managed with just one C-17 for 4x F-35A.

The publicity doesn't matter, but it could be an indication. The project staff knows way better what the actual logistical requirements are and how they compare.

Finnish/Norwegian state owned company Patria acquired Norway's fighter maintainer (AIM) last year, so Finland probably has some extra ways of learning what the operational requirements are and how they are trending looking forward.

notkent · by **notkent** » 01 Mar 2020, 21:09

Or it could be that LM has more money and a better chance of winning.

Don't think that what was brought to the demo reflects anything in real life.

magitsu · by **magitsu** » 01 Mar 2020, 21:59

notkent wrote:Don't think that what was brought to the demo reflects anything in real life.

One of the most absurd statements ever.

usnvo · by **usnvo** » 02 Mar 2020, 03:05

notkent wrote:Or it could be that LM has more money and a better chance of winning.

Don't think that what was brought to the demo reflects anything in real life.

The real world is an interesting place and what, at first glance seems like an issue, actually isn't.

This is just spitballing, but the F-35A uses different ground support equipment than the F-18C/D, unlike the F-18E/F/G. So outside of the few pieces of equipment unique to the Super Dupers, Boeing didn't have to bring anything since the Finns already had it. Lockheed on the other hand had to bring everything from bomb loading trays for the internal bomb bays to 270VDC power for the F-35A.

And while this seems to be a favorable thing for the Boeing Jet, it actually isn't because no one in Europe, outside of the Swiss and Spaniards, is going to have any of that equipment and it is only a matter of time before the other F-18C countries get rid of their F-18s as well, most likely not upgrading to F-18E/Fs. But numerous nations, like Denmark, Norway, The Netherlands, Poland, Italy, etc. will have F-35A ground support equipment. So when the Finns go somewhere else, they won't need a huge logistical tail to support their aircraft.

So initially the Finns will have an easier time, and support equipment will br cheaper, but it will get progressively worse over time while it will only get easier with the F-35A.

krorvik · by **krorvik** » 02 Mar 2020, 16:27

Nice shot, showing likely QRA load.

She's HOT.

XanderCrews · by **XanderCrews** » 02 Mar 2020, 21:30

gotta wonder why he was talking about a larger logistical tail while showing people out in the snow armed with Rifles :wink:

I never saw one of these, without some of those fellows in the foreground next to it.

XanderCrews · by **XanderCrews** » 02 Mar 2020, 21:34

usnvo wrote: most likely not upgrading to F-18E/Fs.

The US Navy has bought their last batch. The end is nigh. Any potential new F-18E/F operators have a narrow window now. wait even 3 years, and the choice gets made for you.

optimist · by **optimist** » 03 Mar 2020, 01:58

New aircraft on its first show? I would think they would even take the kitchen sink. What is now and in a couple of years time, may be different. As they sort things out.

spazsinbad · by **spazsinbad** » 04 Mar 2020, 05:01

XanderCrews wrote:gotta wonder why he was talking about a larger logistical tail while showing people out in the snow armed with Rifles

I never saw one of these, without some of those fellows in the foreground next to it.

I'll never ever forget my first encounter of MARINES with RIFLES outdoors (outside the TRACKER hangar at that time) at NAS Nowra and being told to piss off and not gawk at the INTRUDER parked there (for exercises) c. 1969. Yes SIR No SIR!

sprstdlyscottsmn · by **sprstdlyscottsmn** » 04 Mar 2020, 17:03

krorvik wrote:

Nice shot, showing likely QRA load.

She's HOT.

I see no image

**EDIT** I saw no image in the original post, but it shows up in my reply...

steve2267 · by **steve2267** » 04 Mar 2020, 17:22

Whaddya figure, four AIM-120's internally along with the Sidewinders?

notkent · by **notkent** » 04 Mar 2020, 18:39

magitsu wrote:One of the most absurd statements ever.

Thanks - always like to be the best at something.

sprstdlyscottsmn · by **sprstdlyscottsmn** » 04 Mar 2020, 18:45

steve2267 wrote:Whaddya figure, four AIM-120's internally along with the Sidewinders?

probably, since the six-pack isn't produced yet.