F-35 Auto-GCAS Team to Receive 2018 Collier Trophy

Unread postPosted: 09 Apr 2019, 23:52
by rheonomic
Didn't see this posted when I searched...
National Aeronautic Association wrote:The National Aeronautic Association (NAA) is pleased to announce that the Automatic Ground Collision Avoidance System (Auto GCAS) Team has been named the recipient of the 2018 Robert J. Collier Trophy for “… successfully completing a rapid design, integration, and flight test of critical, lifesaving technology for the worldwide F-35 fleet.”

The Collier Trophy is awarded annually “…for the greatest achievement in aeronautics or astronautics in America, with respect to improving the performance, efficiency, and safety of air or space vehicles, the value of which has been thoroughly demonstrated by actual use during the preceding year.” The list of Collier recipients represents a timeline of air and space achievements, marking major events in the history of flight.

“I am so proud of the entire Auto GCAS Team and their commitment and dedication to saving lives through this revolutionary technology,” expressed Mark Wilkins, Senior Aviation Safety Analyst, Office of Secretary of Defense for Personnel Readiness and Safety. “We are truly honored to be recognized with such a prestigious award and deeply humbled considering the aviation greats who won previously.”

“I want to congratulate the Auto GCAS team on winning the 2018 Collier Trophy,” said Greg Principato, President and CEO, NAA. “The Collier Trophy was established more than a century ago to encourage the best minds in this country to continually find ways to advance and improve aviation. The Auto GCAS team, comprised of elements of the U.S. Air Force, to include the Air Force Research Laboratory, Lockheed Martin, the F-35 Joint Program Office, NASA, and the
Defense Safety Oversight Council; is a sterling example of a project that brought together the best minds from many disciplines. The result is a game changing advance in safety that has already changed military aviation and can one day change the game for everyone.”

The Collier Trophy Selection Committee, comprised of 30 aviation and aerospace professionals, convened on April 4, 2019 to hear presentations from 11 nominees.


PDF Announcement

Re: F-35 Auto-GCAS Team to Receive 2018 Collier Trophy

Unread postPosted: 11 Apr 2019, 19:07
by steve2267
With the apparent first fatality in an F-35 with the tragic loss of the JASDF Lightning... and how expensive that pilot and aircraft were... one wonders if this Auto-GCAS software update might get pushed out to the fleet toot-suite without waiting for the full Block 4 update?

Re: F-35 Auto-GCAS Team to Receive 2018 Collier Trophy

Unread postPosted: 11 Apr 2019, 20:25
by marauder2048
There was no reason to bundle it with Block 4 especially as it was initially envisioned as a Block 3F effort.

Re: F-35 Auto-GCAS Team to Receive 2018 Collier Trophy

Unread postPosted: 11 Apr 2019, 20:38
by quicksilver
marauder2048 wrote:There was no reason to bundle it with Block 4 especially as it was initially envisioned as a Block 3F effort.


3F clean-up. Post-SDD.

Re: F-35 Auto-GCAS Team to Receive 2018 Collier Trophy

Unread postPosted: 11 Apr 2019, 20:52
by SpudmanWP
marauder2048 wrote:There was no reason to bundle it with Block 4 especially as it was initially envisioned as a Block 3F effort.


No, it was originally Block 4

Image

Re: F-35 Auto-GCAS Team to Receive 2018 Collier Trophy

Unread postPosted: 11 Apr 2019, 21:51
by marauder2048
SpudmanWP wrote:
marauder2048 wrote:There was no reason to bundle it with Block 4 especially as it was initially envisioned as a Block 3F effort.


No, it was originally Block 4




At that stage of the program, yes. But once the JPO steering board elected to accelerate its
introduction it was being looked at as quicksilver says: 3F clean-up but pre-Block 4.

The motivation there being to decouple it from the Block 4 approval process which even
then was looking to be protracted.

Re: F-35 Auto-GCAS Team to Receive 2018 Collier Trophy

Unread postPosted: 11 Apr 2019, 22:22
by spazsinbad
Some forum links to outside links for the FAST TRACKING of installation of AUTO-GCAS for the F-35 fleet five years earlier:

viewtopic.php?f=58&t=13143&p=406094&hilit=GCAS#p406094 [fast track]
&
viewtopic.php?f=58&t=13143&p=405998&hilit=GCAS#p405998 [5 yr early]
&
viewtopic.php?f=58&t=12237&p=396793&hilit=GCAS#p396793 [auto-GCAS before 2020]

Re: F-35 Auto-GCAS Team to Receive 2018 Collier Trophy

Unread postPosted: 28 Apr 2019, 06:01
by spazsinbad
F-35 AGCAS recommended for fielding
26 Apr 2019 Giancarlo Casem, 412th Test Wing Public Affairs

"EDWARDS AIR FORCE BASE, Calif. -- The 412th Test Wing recently published the technical report on the F-35 Automatic Ground and Collision Avoidance System and have recommended it for fielding; seven years ahead of schedule.

The Auto GCAS is a tool that utilizes a suite of sensors, on-board monitors and flight data to determine if a plane is on course for a probable ground collision. Based on the plane’s trajectory, speed, and lack of input from the pilot, the system then calculates the best way to recover to a safe trajectory.

“The 461st Flight Test Squadron is passionate about identifying, developing, and implementing technology that will benefit the warfighter,” said Lt. Col. Tucker Hamilton, 461st FLTS commander and F-35 Integrated Test Force director. “With respect to Auto GCAS, we knew how important this technology was for the warfighter and did everything in our power to accelerate it; protecting those that go into harm's way.”

The effort to test the system on the F-35A was headed by the Test Wing’s 461st Flight Test Squadron at Edwards Air Force Base, California, as part of the F-35 AGCAS Team. The whole team consisted of engineers and pilots from the Air Force, the F-35 Joint Program Office, NASA, Lockheed-Martin and the Defense Safety Oversight Council.

Further support was provided to the team by a group of congressmen. In November 2017, Hamilton provided a brief of the program to Rep. Kevin McCarthy and then-Rep. Steve Knight. The support of both California congressmen helped shed light to the importance of the program and accelerate its development by seven years.

“Following our briefing with Colonel Hamilton, Rep. Steve Knight and I sent a letter, along with our colleagues Rep. Paul Cook and Rep. Ken Calvert, to then-Secretary of Defense James Mattis, urging him to work with the F-35 Joint Program Office to prioritize the incorporation of AGCAS as quickly as possible,” McCarthy said.

McCarthy said a driving factor for him and Knight was the bottom line: AGCAS saves lives....

...“AGCAS reflects the good work being done every day by our military personnel and their civilian counterparts at places like Edwards Air Force Base,” McCarthy said. “These proud men and women strive to test and evaluate our nation’s finest technology. I am proud of the visionary leadership being displayed by Brig. Gen. John Teichert (412th Test Wing commander) and Brig. Gen. Christopher Azzano (AFTC commander). Under their command, I am confident that the team at Edwards will continue to advance our community’s proud aerospace legacy.”"

Photo: "An F-35 Lightning II launches an AIM-120 missile released from an internal weapons storage bay over a controlled sea test range in the Pacific Ocean.The 412th Test Wing recently published the technical report on the F-35 Automatic Ground and Collision Avoidance System and have recommended it for fielding; seven years ahead of schedule. (U.S. Air Force photo by Christopher Okula)" https://media.defense.gov/2019/Apr/26/2 ... 5-1140.JPG (2.3Mb)


Source: https://www.edwards.af.mil/News/Article ... -fielding/

Re: F-35 Auto-GCAS Team to Receive 2018 Collier Trophy

Unread postPosted: 01 May 2019, 23:07
by spazsinbad
From a post on a different topic [ viewtopic.php?f=54&t=55440&p=418152&hilit=Sidekick#p418152 ] the quote below was at the end so repeated here also:
"...[Tony ‘Brick’ Wilson, LM F-35 TEST PILOT] also said the company, working with the Air Force Research Lab, has developed and installed on the F-35A — six years ahead of schedule — the Auto Ground Collision Avoidance System (AGCAS). The AGCAS has “saved eight pilots’ lives,” Wilson said. He said the AGCAS will be installed later on the F-35B and on the F-35C in 2021." https://seapowermagazine.org/lockheed-d ... x-shooter/ 01 May 2019

Re: F-35 Auto-GCAS Team to Receive 2018 Collier Trophy

Unread postPosted: 02 May 2019, 01:07
by quicksilver
To read the press release from the testers you'd a thunk they did all the work from idea to implementation. IIRC, it was
LM/AFRL/NASA in origins.

But, very good stuff for the end users. Rare that each of the bureaucracies with some kind of equity in this kinda thing all marched in the same direction at the same time -- with urgency (knock me over with a feather) -- for a common end.

Well done. They should do so more often... :applause:

Re: F-35 Auto-GCAS Team to Receive 2018 Collier Trophy

Unread postPosted: 02 May 2019, 11:45
by mixelflick
Amen.

Dunno what they're spending on this but whatever it is, it's well worth it. Going to save many lives (and airframes). Had the F-22 had this, we'd have a few more of them around (and at least one pilot). Ditto for the F-15C. One where I live went down on a cross country flight a few years ago. Oddly enough, the official accident investigation gave no cause.

Plunged from 30,000ft or so. The pilot declared an emergency, but no other communication from him after that. The report noted he was incapacitated, but never found out why. He left behind a beautiful wife and two young girls...

https://www.airforcetimes.com/news/your ... -15-crash/

Re: F-35 Auto-GCAS Team to Receive 2018 Collier Trophy

Unread postPosted: 29 May 2019, 17:57
by spazsinbad
UhOH the LIGHTINGS are back.... Someone needs to devise a spallchucker wot changes anything into a LIGHTNING! ASAP.
AFMC team receives prestigious award for life-saving aircraft technology
28 May 2019 Whitney Wetsig, Air Force Research Laboratory Corporate Communications

"ARLINGTON, Va. (AFNS) -- The Automatic Ground Collision Avoidance System, or Auto-GCAS, team won the 2018 Robert J. Collier Trophy, an award bestowed annually by the National Aeronautic Association that recognizes “the greatest achievement in aeronautics or astronautics in America, with respect to improving the performance, efficiency and safety of air or space vehicles."

The NAA selected the Auto-GCAS team for “successfully completing a rapid design, integration and flight test of critical, lifesaving technology for the worldwide F-35 (Lighting II) fleet.”

The winning team comprises representatives from the Air Force Research Laboratory, Lockheed-Martin, the F-35 Joint Program Office, NASA, the Office of the Secretary of Defense, the Defense Safety Oversight Council and other U.S. Air Force entities.

AFRL’s Aerospace Systems Directorate at Wright-Patterson Air Force Base, Ohio, led the development of Auto-GCAS while members of the F-35 Integrated Task Force at Edwards Air Force Base, California, led the flight-test program.

Kevin Price, AFRL program manager and retired Air Force F-16 Fighting Falcon pilot, says the team is honored and especially grateful for the resulting public awareness. Price explains that the “greatest reward comes from the knowledge that pilots have come home from missions” safely due to the development and transition of Auto-GCAS.

We are “most proud” of the “precious lives and combat resources (that) have been preserved through this revolutionary, life-saving technology,” he said.

Auto-GCAS relies on GPS and a digital terrain database. The system employs complex algorithms and scans the digital terrain around an aircraft’s current and projected area to initiate an automatic recovery at the last instant to avoid a ground collision when needed.

Auto-GCAS saves pilots’ lives by preventing the most common reason for crashes: Controlled Flight Into Terrain. According to Air Force statistics, CFIT is responsible for 75% of all F-16 crashes. The leading causes of CFIT are spatial disorientation, target fixation and G-force induced loss of consciousness.

Mark Wilkins, a senior aviation safety analyst for OSD personnel readiness and safety praises the “entire team and their commitment and dedication to saving lives through this revolutionary technology.” He described this award as “deeply humbling considering the aviation greats who won previously.”

Since being fielded on F-16 Block 40/50 aircraft in 2014, Auto-GCAS has saved seven aircraft and the lives of eight Air Force pilots. Today, more than 600 F-16 Block 40/50 aircraft have the capability. Development efforts are in the works to field the system on an additional 330 Pre-Block 40 aircraft in 2021.

In April 2019, the 412th Test Wing at Edwards AFB, recommended that Auto-GCAS be fielded on the F-35 following a series of flight tests. The Pentagon estimates that this technology will potentially save 40 pilots as well as 57 F-16s and F-35s through 2040.

Greg Principato, NAA president and CEO, said that Auto-GCAS is “a game-changing advance in safety that has already changed military aviation and can one day change the game for everyone.” The NAA committee, comprised of 30 aviation and aerospace professionals, selected Auto-GCAS over 10 other nominees. The Collier Trophy, which is on display at the Smithsonian National Air & Space Museum, will be presented during a formal ceremony on June 13, in Washington D.C...."

Photo: "The Collier Trophy, on display at the Smithsonian Museum. (Courtesy photo)" https://media.defense.gov/2019/May/23/2 ... 6-1009.JPG (0.8Mb)


Source: https://www.af.mil/News/Article-Display ... echnology/

Re: F-35 Auto-GCAS Team to Receive 2018 Collier Trophy

Unread postPosted: 29 May 2019, 19:53
by quicksilver
Hmmm...

Interesting that a USG entity has a “corporate” communications department. Some in the syscoms think of themselves confused it seems.

Re: F-35 Auto-GCAS Team to Receive 2018 Collier Trophy

Unread postPosted: 29 May 2019, 20:40
by outlaw162
It still amazes me that people think the primary purpose of this engineering miracle is to save lives.

It's a side bar compared to saving a $100,000,000 aircraft. Pilots are a dime a dozen....good ones maybe 20 cents/dozen. Pilots would fly the machines with or without auto-GCAS....consistently good pilots generally would not need saving.

Realistically, the crux of the matter here is that the folks in command positions want to avoid fatal class 'A's to keep their commands, and as well, the folks paying for the machines want something pilot-proof.

Re: F-35 Auto-GCAS Team to Receive 2018 Collier Trophy

Unread postPosted: 29 May 2019, 22:24
by magitsu
Well, the pilots aren't exactly cheap either. 7 million is spent on each for the jet training alone. But you are right about the saving of face/commands. There are high expectations overall, for example said pilots won't be staying unless enough of this kind of "easy" safety measures are implemented. 100 million planes without pilots would be ultimately useless.

They are "dime a dozen" only at the time of selection. Losing a trained one can be recouped only in 5-10 years. For the society it's a loss of at least 30 years. Which is much more time than it takes to produce another jet.

Re: F-35 Auto-GCAS Team to Receive 2018 Collier Trophy

Unread postPosted: 29 May 2019, 22:47
by marauder2048
outlaw162 wrote:It still amazes me that people think the primary purpose of this engineering miracle is to save lives.

It's a side bar compared to saving a $100,000,000 aircraft.


Which is why it was first applied to practically the cheapest FBW fighter in the US inventory?

outlaw162 wrote: Pilots are a dime a dozen....good ones maybe 20 cents/dozen. Pilots would fly the machines with or without auto-GCAS....consistently good pilots generally would not need saving.


So that whole pilot shortage crisis is a myth? Some very skilled pilots killed themselves while
strafing during CAS which is why there is a very specific Auto-GCAS mode with the tightest tolerances
that gets applied when the pilot selects the gun for employment in the air-to-ground master mode.

Re: F-35 Auto-GCAS Team to Receive 2018 Collier Trophy

Unread postPosted: 29 May 2019, 22:53
by quicksilver
“Realistically, the crux of the matter here is that the folks in command positions want to avoid fatal class 'A's to keep their commands...”

Ok, brah...tell us how that would work. ‘They’ all got together and engineered this technically and politically in order to save ‘their’ collective back sides? Help us understand the ‘who’ and in which ‘command positions’ made this happen.

Re: F-35 Auto-GCAS Team to Receive 2018 Collier Trophy

Unread postPosted: 29 May 2019, 22:59
by outlaw162
That's a little dramatic.

The point is, for 7 mil you can turn just about anybody into a pilot....and they are plenty of folks who would give anything for the opportunity.

Whether or not they will ever need auto-GCAS is a bell-curve problem, pilot-wise....but the bell curve doesn't apply to the aircraft, no matter the cost. As a pilot, you're very skilled until you're not.

Re: F-35 Auto-GCAS Team to Receive 2018 Collier Trophy

Unread postPosted: 29 May 2019, 23:09
by marauder2048
outlaw162 wrote:Whether or not they will ever need auto-GCAS is a bell-curve problem, pilot-wise....but the bell curve doesn't apply to the aircraft, no matter the cost. As a pilot, you're very skilled until you're not.


Do you have actual evidence that propensity for target fixation (the leading cause of CFIT during CAS) correlates
with pilot skill level or is even normally distributed?

Re: F-35 Auto-GCAS Team to Receive 2018 Collier Trophy

Unread postPosted: 29 May 2019, 23:10
by SpudmanWP
marauder2048 wrote:Which is why it was first applied to practically the cheapest FBW fighter in the US inventory?

Two reasons:
1. Biggest return on investment. Because the F-16 is used in the largest number of any US fighter, the cost to develop is spread across the most airframes making it the cheapest per plane solution to implement. By being the largest group of fighters also means that it will save the largest amount of pilots which is good PR.

2. The F-16 is already FBW which will make development & integration easier than say an F-15.

Re: F-35 Auto-GCAS Team to Receive 2018 Collier Trophy

Unread postPosted: 29 May 2019, 23:17
by outlaw162
Do you have actual evidence that propensity for target fixation (the leading cause of CFIT during CAS) correlates
with pilot skill level or is even normally distributed?


Does 5800 hours in fighters count?

And everything in life is "normally distributed"....some things more skewed in a particular direction than others. (800 on the math SAT here)

Re: F-35 Auto-GCAS Team to Receive 2018 Collier Trophy

Unread postPosted: 29 May 2019, 23:31
by quicksilver
“Does 5800 hours in fighters count?”

You didn’t answer his question. Nor mine...

Re: F-35 Auto-GCAS Team to Receive 2018 Collier Trophy

Unread postPosted: 29 May 2019, 23:59
by quicksilver
“Realistically, the crux of the matter here is that the folks in command positions want to avoid fatal class 'A's to keep their commands...”

“But you are right about the saving of face/commands.”

Spoken like those who have never been there...

Re: F-35 Auto-GCAS Team to Receive 2018 Collier Trophy

Unread postPosted: 30 May 2019, 00:13
by outlaw162
You didn’t answer his question. Nor mine...


to answer 'his', CFIT is an oxymoron....if you hit the terrain, I'm not sure 'control' is the operable word.

to answer 'nor mine', you need to ask the right question, not a flamboyant diatribe. 'Is the system specifically directed at saving pilots or saving the aircraft?' It appears that as a CO you would feel much more comfortable with your pilots having auto-GCAS....and less confident having to depend solely on individual 'skill'. I think you answered your own question.

Re: F-35 Auto-GCAS Team to Receive 2018 Collier Trophy

Unread postPosted: 30 May 2019, 00:24
by marauder2048
outlaw162 wrote:
Do you have actual evidence that propensity for target fixation (the leading cause of CFIT during CAS) correlates
with pilot skill level or is even normally distributed?


Does 5800 hours in fighters count?


Nope. Because:

Spatial disorientation-implicated accidents in Canadian forces, 1982-92.

Cheung B1, Money K, Wright H, Bateman W.
Author information
Abstract
In a recent survey of CF18 aircrew human factors, 44% of pilots reported experience with spatial disorientation (SD), of whom 10% had experienced more than 3 episodes. In order to investigate further, we have completed a retrospective study of SD-implicated category A accidents (where an aircraft is destroyed, declared missing, or damaged beyond economic repair) in the Canadian Forces (CF) during 1982-92. An overview of all SD occurrences (including accidents and incidents) across aircraft types is also presented. Information was gathered concerning the genesis and severity of disorientation so that research effort and pilot training could be appropriately implemented. Mishap investigation summaries involving category A accidents where SD was implicated were obtained from the CF Directorate of Flight Safety and reviewed. We also examined in detail the Board of Inquiry Reports of these accidents. The role of disorientation in these accidents was assessed. There were 62 category A accidents between 1982-92 and, in 14, SD had been assigned as a possible cause factor in the accident records. When divided into the categories of Recognized SD (RSD), Unrecognized SD (USD), and Incapacitating SD (ISD), all but two fell into the category of USD (the pilots were unaware of the disorientation). Of the SD accidents, 11 involved a total loss of 24 lives. The majority of the accidents happened during the day, and pilots' cumulative flying experience did not appear to be a significant factor.
According to our assessment, there were two episodes of vestibular origin, involving the somatogravic illusion. Three episodes of disorientation occurred over frozen lakes, one over glassy water, and one over ocean.(ABSTRACT TRUNCATED AT 250 WORDS).




outlaw162 wrote:And everything in life is "normally distributed"..



Uh..no. Particularly for cognitive abilities. This has long been known in psychometrics.

https://psycnet.apa.org/record/2013-13782-004

Re: F-35 Auto-GCAS Team to Receive 2018 Collier Trophy

Unread postPosted: 30 May 2019, 00:29
by quicksilver
outlaw162 wrote:
You didn’t answer his question. Nor mine...


to answer 'his', CFIT is an oxymoron....if you hit the terrain, I'm not sure 'control' is the operable word.

to answer 'nor mine', you need to ask the right question, not a flamboyant diatribe. 'Is the system specifically directed at saving pilots or saving the aircraft?' It appears that as a CO you would feel much more comfortable with your pilots having auto-GCAS....and less confident having to depend solely on individual 'skill'. I think you answered your own question.


You still didn’t answer. You made the claim that a-gcas is about saving commands. Explain it to us.

Re: F-35 Auto-GCAS Team to Receive 2018 Collier Trophy

Unread postPosted: 30 May 2019, 00:52
by quicksilver
:whistle:

Re: F-35 Auto-GCAS Team to Receive 2018 Collier Trophy

Unread postPosted: 30 May 2019, 01:01
by outlaw162
I think I may have flown against you at the WTI....or maybe your dad. :D

Re: F-35 Auto-GCAS Team to Receive 2018 Collier Trophy

Unread postPosted: 30 May 2019, 01:20
by quicksilver
outlaw162 wrote:I think I may have flown against you at the WTI....or maybe your dad. :D


Then you should know better. AGCAS helps preserve assets and investments that are vital to the nation’s security interests.

:salute:

Re: F-35 Auto-GCAS Team to Receive 2018 Collier Trophy

Unread postPosted: 31 May 2019, 00:39
by outlaw162
I particularly enjoyed playing air-adversary for the AV-8 Helo-escort scenario at 29 Palms. :D

But a serious question(s) for someone with command experience. Is an evaluation board required for any pilot involved in an auto-GCAS event? Or is it a given that any AGCAS event was unavoidable?

Are involved pilots automatically re-instated to unquestioned flight status? Or (gasp) are some sent to multi billets? (or worse). Is this basically a freebie? If so, how many freebies do you get?

At Niagara we had a young guy pitch-up a Guard F-101 in the flare and end up with gear collapsed in the in-field. He was given the opportunity to transfer to heavies up at White Plains....partly because he wanted nothing more to do with the VooDoo, but primarily because NYANG had put so much money into his flight training.

Can a commander always afford to put someone involved in an AGCAS event back in the same cockpit?

Non-event? Is this too new to even ask about and TBD? Just curious.

BTW in the F-4 it was fairly straightforward. You just put someone who had a 'bad day' in the backseat....and gave 'em a chance to work their way back to the front seat. That's both depressing and motivational.

Re: F-35 Auto-GCAS Team to Receive 2018 Collier Trophy

Unread postPosted: 31 May 2019, 04:14
by quicksilver
“Is this too new to even ask about and TBD?”

I am unfamiliar with details of the sw implementation, but I don’t think it’s even installed in operational jets yet.

Re: F-35 Auto-GCAS Team to Receive 2018 Collier Trophy

Unread postPosted: 31 May 2019, 06:08
by XanderCrews
outlaw162 wrote:It still amazes me that people think the primary purpose of this engineering miracle is to save lives.

It's a side bar compared to saving a $100,000,000 aircraft. Pilots are a dime a dozen....good ones maybe 20 cents/dozen. Pilots would fly the machines with or without auto-GCAS....consistently good pilots generally would not need saving.

Realistically, the crux of the matter here is that the folks in command positions want to avoid fatal class 'A's to keep their commands, and as well, the folks paying for the machines want something pilot-proof.



The pilot I talked to was the opposite. He said all the old school guys (command) want to fly the airplane, and the young pilots having grown up with technology are more of the "theres an 'app' for that right?"

YMMV

Re: F-35 Auto-GCAS Team to Receive 2018 Collier Trophy

Unread postPosted: 31 May 2019, 16:58
by outlaw162
Yes, and nowhere is that attitude more prevalent than the airline business.

Maybe it's a good thing, maybe not. The 2 MAX crashes are pretty good examples of 'systems designed to make things safer by taking the pilot out of the loop' gone awry.

Had a young airline guy in the right seat as a test subject doing fairly complicated RNAV arrivals in an A-330 sim. We alternated PF on each run. On one run I clicked off the auto-pilot to hand fly. With all seriousness, he commented, "I get nervous when people do that." Sign of the times.

Except for the AOA limiter on the F-16, every mil aircraft I flew would have allowed me to get myself in as much trouble as I could dream up. The only thing between me and disaster was me.

So once again, maybe it's a good thing as far as preserving both assets....ejections generally only preserved the 7 mil asset, not the 100 mil one....but it could also be a step in the career path to commissary officer for some pilots. If I had to take control of the aircraft from the checkee on a checkride, trainers, fighters or heavies, it was a bust. This has parallels to that.

(Wasn't 'psychometrics' the movie with Janet Leigh in the shower? :shock: )

Re: F-35 Auto-GCAS Team to Receive 2018 Collier Trophy

Unread postPosted: 31 May 2019, 18:45
by Gums
Salute!

Thanks, outlaw!

There's a situation for Hal to "suggest" something, and there might be a situation when Hal says, " Dave, I can't let you do that".

The problem with the GCAS and other "protections" is when the pilot atually knows better than Hal !!!!

E.G. I am dropping down to strafe in my Warthog, and I have done the same profile a thousand times when Hal decides I am gonna kill myself. And him! But his brain is in the cloud someplace and ready to take over in another system. I miss the bad guys and my grunt friends are toast.

The AF447 episode is more relevant than the current 737 fiasco. I have been a frequent poster on the latest, and my view from the fighter community has been accepted for the most part. AF447 was a different problem, and the 'bus "protections" had a fault that the accident clearly showed. As with the Viper, "you can't stall this plane", right? And as with the Viper, the pliot can figure out a way to beat the system with a little help from a programming fault. Hence, we could get into a deep stall and the 'bus crew that night could get "deeply stalled". They did not recognize a stall due to apparent good aero characteristics of the plane. Sat there for over three minutes watching the altimiter unwind while pulling back on the stick the whole way until impact.

Our cadre back in 1980 or 81 did not like the idea of GCAS unless we had override with the paddle switch coupled with an alert that Hal was about to take over. And then there's the mid-air version which I do not see in effect. We have good video of mid-airs that a collision avoidance and flashing "cross" in the HUD could have prevented. Oh well.

Any GCAS should use a lotta inputs other than strict velocity vector and calculated "pull" capability. Gee-loc comes to mind.

If you read the thousand posts about the 737 MCAS over on pPrune blog, you will be "educated".

Gums sends...

Re: F-35 Auto-GCAS Team to Receive 2018 Collier Trophy

Unread postPosted: 10 Jun 2019, 17:16
by SpudmanWP
Here is a detailed PDF on the F-35 AGCAS testing that just came out on June 7th, 2019.

I put it over on the Program Docs page.
viewtopic.php?p=421517#p421517

Re: F-35 Auto-GCAS Team to Receive 2018 Collier Trophy

Unread postPosted: 14 Jun 2019, 02:15
by rheonomic
Gums wrote:There's a situation for Hal to "suggest" something, and there might be a situation when Hal says, " Dave, I can't let you do that".

The problem with the GCAS and other "protections" is when the pilot atually knows better than Hal !!!!

Our cadre back in 1980 or 81 did not like the idea of GCAS unless we had override with the paddle switch coupled with an alert that Hal was about to take over.

Pilot can override GCAS with stick inputs and it can also be disabled with a HUD switch (I think for example you can watch the video of one of the saves where GCAS activates, pilot comes back to reality from GLOC, has an oh **** moment, and takes over with a much higher G pullout). It's pretty clear from the HUD when GCAS is about to take over also.
Gums wrote:And then there's the mid-air version which I do not see in effect. We have good video of mid-airs that a collision avoidance and flashing "cross" in the HUD could have prevented. Oh well.

That's still in the works (I think it's primarily for cooperative targets right now). Eventually ACAS and GCAS will be integrated together to become ICAS.
Gums wrote:If you read the thousand posts about the 737 MCAS over on pPrune blog, you will be "educated".

Part of the problem is that the team that designed MCAS were a bunch of ****** idiots; it's almost like they were deliberately trying to get everything wrong. MCAS is going to end up as one of those classic engineering "here's what not to do" cases in future textbooks...

Re: F-35 Auto-GCAS Team to Receive 2018 Collier Trophy

Unread postPosted: 19 Jun 2019, 17:57
by spazsinbad
Auto-GCAS team integrates life-saving system on F-35, wins Collier trophy
19 Jun 2019 NAVair

"Naval Air Station Patuxent River, Maryland--The F-35 Joint Program Office Auto Ground Collision Avoidance System team received the 2018 Robert J. Collier Trophy, June 13, for its rapid design, integration and flight test of critical, lifesaving technology for the global F-35 fleet during a ceremony at the National Air and Space Museum.

Automatic Ground Collision Avoidance System (Auto-GCAS) is a technology designed to save a pilot from crashing into the ground in the event of a sudden loss of consciousness or target fixation by activating and taking control from the pilot to return the plane to safe altitude.

Initial testing of the Auto-GCAS began in 2018 on the F-35A at Edwards Air Force Base, California. As Edward’s F-35 Integrated Test Force (ITF) issued its technical report recommending the system for the A variant to the Joint Program Office, the F-35 Pax River ITF began flight tests on the B variant in early 2019, followed by the C variant.

“The Pax ITF test team is working hard to ensure the fleet is provided an Auto-GCAS system that runs silently in the background while never impeding the warfighter’s maneuverability,” said Lt. Cdr. William Bowen, F-35 test pilot at the Pax River ITF. “In addition to evaluating Auto-GCAS performance, one of our main goals is to ensure the operator has confidence in the system so as to keep it turned on. Thus far, we have not identified any nuisances with the system interface and are satisfied with its performance.”

With the system’s successful flight tests complete on the A and B variants, the fleet will receive Auto-GCAS starting later this year, seven years ahead of schedule….

...The Pax River ITF is on schedule to wrap up testing on the C variant in June.
"


Photo: "F-35 test pilot Dan Levin, Pax River Integrated Test Force, flies an Auto Ground Collision Avoidance System (Auto-GCAS) test flight in an F-35C on a low level through West Virginia, June 17, 2019. Flying the low level helps stress the Auto-GCAS software to confirm there are no false collision warnings while flying as close to the ground as operationally representative. The F-35 Enterprise begins fielding Auto-GCAS on the F-35 fleet in 2019. US Navy photo" http://www.navair.navy.mil/comfrc/osbp/ ... 99-058.jpg (1 Mb)


ZOOM PIC: https://i.imgur.com/FX6YrEJ.jpg

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Source: http://www.navair.navy.mil/comfrc/osbp/ ... 92019-1122


http://www.navair.navy.mil/comfrc/osbp/ ... 99-058.jpg

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Re: F-35 Auto-GCAS Team to Receive 2018 Collier Trophy

Unread postPosted: 25 Jul 2019, 05:48
by spazsinbad
USAF F-35As gain safety feature seven years early
24 Jul 2019 Dominic Perry

"Lockheed Martin F-35As operated by the US Air Force have started to receive a ground collision avoidance system seven years ahead of schedule. Integration of the Automatic Ground Collision Avoidance System (Auto-GCAS) onto A-model aircraft has begun, the F-35 Joint Program Office has confirmed....

...Estimates suggest that the technology will prevent more than 26 ground collisions over the stealthy fighter's service life....

...When an impact is diagnosed as imminent, Auto-GCAS will prompt the pilot to take action. If the pilot fails to respond the system will assume temporary control to divert the aircraft to safety....

...Integration of Auto-GCAS onto the F-35 was originally scheduled for 2026. However, under an accelerated process, including evaluation by the USAF's 412th Test Wing at Edwards AFB, that timeline has been advanced. USAF F-35As will be first to receive Auto-GCAS, with the system then rolled out across the F-35B and F-35C variants operated by the US Marine Corps and US Navy, respectively."

Source: https://www.flightglobal.com/news/artic ... ly-459889/

Re: F-35 Auto-GCAS Team to Receive 2018 Collier Trophy

Unread postPosted: 25 Jul 2019, 06:59
by spazsinbad
Repeat of above PR stuff then an added bonus added from article to below.
Air Force F-35s Are Getting Ground Collision Avoidance Tech 7 Years Early
24 Jul 2019 Oriana Pawlyk

"..."To accelerate the technology, the Air Force Research Lab and Lockheed Martin conducted positive feasibility studies, and the F-35 Joint Program Office and Lockheed Martin then implemented an agile approach to develop the technology for integration on the F-35," Lockheed said in the statement.

The technology will next be tested and incorporated on the Marine Corps' F-35B and the Navy's F-35C models, according to the release. A timeframe was not provided.

"The safe and effective acceleration of this technology is a testament to the joint government and industry team partnering in an agile environment to deliver life-saving capability to our men and women in uniform, significantly sooner than planned," said Greg Ulmer, Lockheed Martin's vice president and general manager of the F-35 program.

Ulmer told Military.com in September the Auto-GCAS schedule would likely be expedited because Lockheed had begun an "agile construct" where an operator -- such as a pilot -- is "embedded as part of the development team."

Officials have previously noted Auto-GCAS is meant to be used as a backup, not a crutch.

"It's very important they do everything in their power to execute the mission without relying on any safety net to protect them," Lt. Col. Tucker Hamilton, F-35 Integrated Test Force director and 461st commander, said in November during the test trials. "They've got to execute not thinking it's there. They should execute with that mindset. And then if it saves them, it saves them," he said."

Source: https://www.military.com/daily-news/201 ... early.html

Re: F-35 Auto-GCAS Team to Receive 2018 Collier Trophy

Unread postPosted: 25 Jul 2019, 14:59
by outlaw162
They've got to execute not thinking it's there.


Is that the same as 'They've got to execute thinking it's not there' ? :bang:

Re: F-35 Auto-GCAS Team to Receive 2018 Collier Trophy

Unread postPosted: 25 Jul 2019, 20:15
by blindpilot
outlaw162 wrote:
They've got to execute not thinking it's there.


Is that the same as 'They've got to execute thinking it's not there' ? :bang:


Actually no. Grammatically speaking, ... but also to the point. "Thinking it's not there" is thinking about it, acting as you consider it. Perhaps pulling up 500 feet earlier "just in case," since there's no safety net here ...

"Not thinking it's there," is acting without any consideration of the system, there or not,... acting with mission and purpose focus, without putting the system into the formula. Fly the D** plane, do the job ... Don't press the edge just to get the system to behave, don't lay off soft just to be safe. Fly the mission!

Just sayin'
BP

Re: F-35 Auto-GCAS Team to Receive 2018 Collier Trophy

Unread postPosted: 25 Jul 2019, 21:04
by outlaw162
Actually, acting 'not thinking it is there' is a logical fallacy, grammatically correct or not. To go about 'not thinking it is there', you have to cerebrally acknowledge that it is there, in order to not think it is. :D

In any case I imagine a GLOC'd pilot is neither thinking nor 'not thinking', although in cases other than GLOC, I can see a cerebrally conflicted pilot coming down the chute hoping he is able to follow the 'don't think about it' guidance.....but who's going to know either way how each pilot handles it? It's ostensibly intended as insightful, good-intentioned, practical guidance, as impractical and dumb as it is.

"Lieutenant, do you ever execute thinking it's there?"

"No sir, I never, ever execute 'thinking it is there'."

"Excellent mindset, lieutenant. And if it saves you, it saves you. Que sera, sera."

It was a pointless comment to make. That's not the way people fly fighters. They lie, cheat and steal and take advantage of everything available to them to succeed.

Re: F-35 Auto-GCAS Team to Receive 2018 Collier Trophy

Unread postPosted: 25 Jul 2019, 21:44
by quicksilver
I don’t know anything about AGCAS software mech. I do know they understand the potential behavioral consequences of ‘nuisance’ commands of the system and have devoted a significant amount of time in flight test toward understanding where the threshold is between ‘nuisance’ and ‘absolute need’ (my words).

I suspect there will be some kind of visual and/or aural warning of an impending actuation, just as there is in some manual warning mechanizations. In other words, the jet isn’t going to take control without plenty of warning first, lest it happen in the middle of counter missile ‘d’, or certain kinds of formation work or, an approach to the ship or some other common thing one might do in a fighter. I wouldn't be surprised if there were also some kind of challenge/response thing between the machine and its operator before it takes over — an appropriate response being one or more of several actions by the pilot that indicate to the jet that its operator is cognitively aware and in the appropriate degree of control given the jet’s attitude/altitude/airspeed etc and prox to the surface of the planet.

Re: F-35 Auto-GCAS Team to Receive 2018 Collier Trophy

Unread postPosted: 26 Jul 2019, 00:00
by blindpilot
outlaw162 wrote:Actually, acting 'not thinking it is there' is a logical fallacy, grammatically correct or not. To go about 'not thinking it is there', you have to cerebrally acknowledge that it is there, in order to not think it is. :D
....
"Excellent mindset, lieutenant. And if it saves you, it saves you. Que sera, sera."

It was a pointless comment to make. That's not the way people fly fighters. They lie, cheat and steal and take advantage of everything available to them to succeed.


Yeah this is probably pointless nuance, but seeking to understand the point that the 461st Commander was making.

Consider automobile systems.
Seat belts is a safety device that we use with some sense of "thinking that they are there." We think about fastening them .. We might even drive more or less carefully, based on that reality ... 4 year old in the back seat - "Dad fasten your seatbelt!" Dad - "I'll drive really safe to the 7-11 ...."

The airbag is a different device in this context. We rarely consider that we have one, if it is well maintained, etc. etc. It is just there. We drive "not thinking" about the airbag. I believe that's the mindset the Lt Colonel was going for.

FWIW,
BP

Re: F-35 Auto-GCAS Team to Receive 2018 Collier Trophy

Unread postPosted: 26 Jul 2019, 01:58
by outlaw162
I think your airbag analogy is sound and what the (Lt) Colonel really means is that he wants to see the majority of F-35 drivers go thru their entire career, racing down the Autobahn without ever having the airbag deploy, not having to be concerned that it's even installed. However....

It's interesting you use the automobile analogy, because I've always been of the bent that the thrust in auto safety has morphed progressively from emphasizing the operator to making cars more and more impervious to crashes, essentially tanks....because they've accepted that human nature doesn't allow for altering stupid behavior behind the wheel.

Fortunately a lot fewer people fly F-35s than drive cars. :mrgreen:

Re: F-35 Auto-GCAS Team to Receive 2018 Collier Trophy

Unread postPosted: 11 Aug 2019, 22:49
by jetblast16