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Re: DT-III aboard USS America

Unread postPosted: 24 Nov 2016, 21:43
by gabriele
Gun pod and AMRAAM are two rather eye-catching absences. If i'm not mistaken, the AMRAAM is never visible in any of the photos with the weapon bays open.

Re: DT-III aboard USS America

Unread postPosted: 25 Nov 2016, 04:27
by spazsinbad
I don't know about AMRAAMs for this test DT-III - they were in DT-II were they not?

Re: DT-III aboard USS America

Unread postPosted: 25 Nov 2016, 04:56
by count_to_10
sferrin wrote:
count_to_10 wrote:Not that I have any info on this, but those temperatures seem more appropriate for the combustion chamber. 3200 F in particular is enough to melt steel and nickle.

Go read the attachment. (Just for reference, the Shuttle SSME exhaust temp is over 6,000 degrees. That should give you enough of a hint.)

My mistake -- I thought we were talking about non-afterburner temperature.

Re: DT-III aboard USS America

Unread postPosted: 25 Nov 2016, 05:12
by spazsinbad
Good Lad (whoever it is) looking at the Vertical Landing Aid whilst VLing ZOOMzoom: ... 5/sizes/o/ (2.1Mb)

Re: DT-III aboard USS America

Unread postPosted: 25 Nov 2016, 14:52
by spazsinbad
Better qual example of photo on previous page of this thread: ... 24x663.jpg
Marine Corps' Proof of Concept Sea Trials [for dyslexics 'trails']
23 Nov 2016 Combat Aircraft

"Photo: Four F-35B Lightning II aircraft perform a flyover above the amphibious assault ship USS America (LHA 6) during the Lightning Carrier Proof of Concept Demonstration. LMCO/Andy Wolfe"

Source: ... ea-trials/

Re: DT-III aboard USS America

Unread postPosted: 25 Nov 2016, 15:28
by spazsinbad
More on 'TIE [me kangaroo] DOWN [sport]' with relevant 12 PDF pages attached:
15 Dec 2010 USN

When a heavy weather spot requirement has been determined by the Commanding Officer, the ACHO [Aircraft Handling Officer] shall ensure the following:
1. A maximum number of aircraft shall be spotted on the hangar deck in such a manner to permit access to fire
stations at all times.
2. Remaining aircraft on the flight deck shall be spotted fore-and-aft as far from deck edge and the fantail as
possible and no farther forward than the bow JBDs.
3. The bow catapult JBDs shall be raised to assist in decreasing wind over deck.
4. Chocks shall be secured to wheels with 21-thread (or greater) manila line to prevent them from working free.
5. Maximum tiedowns shall be applied and parking brakes shall be set.
6. Deflating of struts and/or tires shall be accomplished as directed.
7. Fuel load adjustments shall be made as directed.
8. Aircraft integrity watches shall be doubled to function as two-man teams (buddy system).
During heavy weather, aircraft integrity watches shall not venture onto
the flight deck without permission from the ACHO or his representative."

Source: ... htDeck.pdf (2.1Mb)

Re: DT-III aboard USS America

Unread postPosted: 26 Nov 2016, 04:50
by spazsinbad
Screenshot of an Italian Observer BigWig on the Goofers - they'll be up with the Bs soon I guess....

Re: DT-III aboard USS America

Unread postPosted: 26 Nov 2016, 20:32
by spazsinbad
SEGUE... talking about concrete on previous page brings to light how important it is to US Military overall.
Concrete may just be the most important weapon in modern warfare
24 Nov 2016 Leo Shane III

"Forget MRAPs, Predator drones or even the M16. Concrete has become the most effective weapon of the modern battlefield, according to one scholar at West Point’s Modern War Institute....

ORIGIN: ... -concrete/

...No other weapon or technology has done more to contribute to achieving strategic goals of providing security, protecting populations, establishing stability, and eliminating terrorist threats.”...

...But the heavy use of concrete also come with questions about how seriously the military has looked at supplies and costs of the product...."

Source: ... te-weapons

Re: DT-III aboard USS America

Unread postPosted: 27 Nov 2016, 02:21
by spazsinbad
Regardng missile testing....
FY 15 DOD PROGRAMS F-35 Joint Strike Fighter (JSF)
Dec 2015 DOT&E

"...Air-Ship Integration and Ship Suitability Testing page 74
"... ▪ The [F-35B test] aircraft did not have the appropriate flight clearances to carry or employ any ordnance. Ordnance
evolutions were limited to maintainers uploading and downloading inert bombs and missiles on the flight deck...."

page 76
"... - Ordnance evolutions included uploading and downloading of inert AIM-120 missiles, and GBU-12 500-pound laser
guided and GBU-32 1,000-pound Global Positioning System-guided bombs...."

Source: ... Report.pdf (0.35Mb)

Re: DT-III aboard USS America

Unread postPosted: 27 Nov 2016, 07:36
by spazsinbad
UhOh More Chains....
Jul 2000 USN

“...When the ship is not at flight quarters or during heavy weather conditions, the Air Department is required to maintain a security/integrity watch on the flight deck and hangar deck to ensure that each aircraft remains properly secured. The watch must be especially alert for loose or broken jury struts, tie-downs, battens, chocks, engine intake/exhaust and canopy covers, any leakage, or hazardous conditions. Extreme caution is necessary when you handle aircraft in heavy weather....”

Source: ... Airman.pdf (10.5Mb)

Re: DT-III aboard USS America

Unread postPosted: 27 Nov 2016, 12:35
by count_to_10
There is something I don't get about the way the F-35B takes off from one of these ships -- why do they rotate on the deck instead of rolling off and then pulling up? It seems like they are wasting deck space, so there must be some reason I'm just not seeing.

Re: DT-III aboard USS America

Unread postPosted: 27 Nov 2016, 14:37
by quicksilver
In simple terms, by the time the jet reaches the end of the deck, it has to achieve an expected end-speed while generating the necessary combination of lift from traditional aerodynamic surfaces and the propulsion system that allow it to fly without exceeding the limits for maximum sink rate off the bow. You'll notice there is time necessary to pitch the jet to the required/desired AoA, and during that time there is still substantial weight on the MLG (although in the CQ periods, it looks like they are working with some excess end-speed because you can see a little daylight under the MLG at bow exit).

For STOVL aircraft, there are also significant differences in the pitching moments generated over a hard surface in comparison to what occurs in free air (off the front of the deck). Managing stability and control within the bandwidth they have available in those circumstances are also prime considerations.

Re: DT-III aboard USS America

Unread postPosted: 27 Nov 2016, 16:12
by spazsinbad
On Page 6 this thread how Rusnok describes STO onboard: viewtopic.php?f=22&t=52450&p=356752&hilit=Rusnok#p356752
"...There are three ways to conduct a short take off (STO) in the F-35B: stick STO, button STO – and auto STO. “That’s a completely automated way to STO the aircraft off the flight deck. You punch in a distance and the aircraft will auto rotate to its optimal fly-out condition. It’s all based on distance: we know where the aircraft is spotted [before it starts its take-off run] and where it should start its actual rotation,” explained Rusnok. “Unlike a Harrier, which launches off the end of the ship flat, the F-35 rotates at about 225 feet from the bow, sits on two wheels until it gets to the end of the ship and actually takes off, a much different process to a Harrier. From a pilot perspective, you lose some sight of the front of the ship; in a Harrier you can see all the deck. But that’s all part of optimising a 35,000lb aeroplane to get off the ship compared to the Harrier, which is only 16,000 to 25,000lb.”

With stick STO the pilot controls the take-off by pulling back on the stick, holding it there and then rotating to the optimal pitch angle to fly off. In button STO, the pilot uses a trim switch which rotates the aircraft when pushed in, activating it when the aircraft passes the yellow STO rotation line positioned 225 feet from the bow of the ship.

“That was a temporary marking applied on the flight deck for this trial and is now being permanently installed on the ship with lighting,” explained Rusnok. “It’s based on optimising the performance of the aircraft and its flying qualities, so we can get the aeroplane off with the maximum amount of nozzle clearance and performance. The STO line is our visual cue to either pull the stick aft or hit the button; or if you’re on automated STO you should start seeing the aeroplane’s flight controls moving by the line, otherwise the pilot can intervene and pull back on the stick. We’ve never had to intervene.”...

...The closest we would spot from the bow is 400 feet, so about 175 feet before we would actually start rotating the aeroplane [at the STO rotation line]; so very, very quick.”

One of the big test points for DT I was to ensure adequate nozzle clearance in all the different test conditions. The engine nozzle swings down and back up during the take-off in accordance with inputs from the aircraft control laws.

“It’s all automated,” said Rusnok. “The pilot is not in the loop whatsoever – either they’re pushing the button and letting the aeroplane do its own thing or pulling back on the stick to help it. Monitoring systems cue when something is wrong, so you have to rely on them to keep you safe because the flight controls are being moved unbelievably quickly.”

Maj Rusnok said the take-off was very much like that ashore, with very little sink off the end of the deck...."

Also a new feature may be noticed during F-35B STOs:
VX-23 Strike Test News 2014
02 Sep 2014 VX-23

"...Centerline tracking during short takeoffs (STOs) was drastically improved with the combination of an improved NWS schedule and the use of the Three-Bearing Swivel Nozzle (3BSN) for yaw control...."

Source: ... oad&id=820

NOT only But ALso.... These quotes would be on the forum in places various - search on human names for efficient search.
Navy Sees Few Anomalies in F-35B Ship Trials
31 Oct 2011 Amy Butler

"...Though vertical landings are quite similar to those of the Harrier, the STO operations do vary for the F-35 owing to the
different lift qualities of the F-35s’ stealthy, supersonic-capable design. For testing on the Wasp, the nozzles and control surfaces actuate with 225 ft. of runway remaining on deck, creating an angle of attack and allowing for the wings to produce enough lift for takeoff from the deck, [Marine Corps Col. Roger] Cordell says. The Harrier’s rotation line is at the bow, owing to its wing design creating the required lift without the corresponding angle-of-attack change. Cordell says that the testing equipment at the ship’s bow has also not detected any problems with the F-35’s nozzle clearance as it takes off...."

Source: ... avy&next=0

And again from our resident STOVL expert 'quicksilver':
"The nozzle is angled down to ensure directional control (via NWS) is maintained during the takeoff roll until rotation. You should also note that the nozzle rotates upward momentarily at the point where the takeoff rotation occurs. Such movement instantaneously alters the vertical component of lift between the lift fan and the main engine exhaust thereby contributing to the pitch rotation."

Source: viewtopic.php?f=57&t=25401&p=269833&hilit=rotation#p269833

01 May 2010 Greg Goebel

"...The "smarts" of the F-35 will be particularly appreciated by pilots flying the F-35B STOVL version. Short takeoffs in the Harrier are a troublesome affair that require the pilot to have "three hands": one for the throttle, one for the stick, and the third for the lever that controls the direction of the Harrier's swiveling exhaust nozzles. An F-35B pilot, in contrast, flies the plane with stick and throttle, with the software handling the fine details of short takeoff: the pilot will simply press a "button" on the PCD to con-vert from vertical to forward flight or the reverse.

While the Harrier has reaction control thrusters driven by engine bleed to provide low-speed maneuverability, the F-35B simply modulates the four points of its vertical-lift system -- the pivoting exhaust, the two wing exhaust ducts, and the lift fan -- to provide control. This trick would be difficult or impossible to do manually....”


An OLDie but Goldie X-35Bie...
Nov 2002 Kevin M. McCarthy, JSF Program Office/Naval Air Systems Command

“...The STO deck run starts at brake release, which typically occurs at the maximum thrust that the brakes can hold. This is an input. The engine spool-up characteristics from this throttle setting to maximum power are considered during the acceleration portion of the deck run. Weight on main and nose gear is calculated, and must be monitored to maintain adequate deck handling characteristics....

...STO demonstrations were a critical aspect of the flight test program as well. The X-35B performed two different technique STOs; 1) fixed nozzle and 2) auto-STOs. The fixed nozzle STOs are self-explanatory, and were used for the initial flight test STO maneuvers. For these maneuvers, the demonstrated performance was very consistent with predicted levels. The flight test auto-STOs featured a deck run nozzle angle (34/28 fan/main) and flyaway nozzle angle between 40/40 and 60/60, depending on aircraft weight. The auto-rotation was pilot actuated at the desired rotation speed....”

Source: ... 274d1857TR (1.7Mb PDF)

UhOh Agin...
07 Sep 2015 Maj M. Andrew “Tac” Tacquard

",,,F-35[B] Short Takeoff & Vertical Landing (STOVL) Mode-
The F-35B team continued to expand the STOVL envelope last year in the clean wing configuration and with symmetric and asymmetric external stores. The process began with flying qualities testing in semi-jet, short takeoff, and jet borne modes to clear the aircraft for takeoff and landings. The team completed testing at airspeeds as low as 70 knots with 24,000 lb of asymmetry and jet borne with 10,000 lb of asymmetry. Next year, the team will feature jet borne testing to 19,000 lb of asymmetry.

Flying qualities during asymmetric testing were nearly identical to symmetric testing from the pilot’s perspective...."


Re: DT-III aboard USS America

Unread postPosted: 27 Nov 2016, 17:51
by spazsinbad
AhHah - found the 'Engines' nosewheel tyre wobble quote....
02 Jun 2012 ‘Engines’(name supplied on request)

“The UK F-35B is required, and is perfectly able to, use a 'STO' technique to get airborne. The pilot will select 'powered lift' mode before it starts its take off run, & the aircraft will be partially jet borne & partially wing borne when it leaves the ramp. At the appropriate point as it flies away, the pilot selects back into 'conventional flight' mode.

The landing gear is fine. What you see on the video is the tyre flexing. The Harrier nose leg was massive because it was a 'bicycle' gear layout with the nose wheel taking around 50% of the weight of the aircraft. The F-35 has a conventional gear, with the front leg taking around 10% of the load. Oh, and I can testify that Harrier landing gears (outriggers & nose legs both) flexed plenty during deck ops. Stopped them breaking."

Source: ... 5b-51.html

Re: DT-III aboard USS America

Unread postPosted: 27 Nov 2016, 23:05
by spazsinbad
Many bomb photos in this article.... CHAINS & Bombs & Planes wot more could youse ask for?! :devil:
F-35B Completes DT-III on USS America
27 Nov 2016 Todd Miller

"...Pilots, engineers, maintainers and personnel from VX-23 (Air Test and Evaluation Squadron) of NAS Patuxent River, MD flew across the country with their two heavily instrumented F-35Bs for the shipboard DT-III late October through November 17, 2016.

They were joined by aircraft and personnel from VMX-1 (Marine Operational Test and Evaluation squadron) to support the maintenance phase of DT-III.

VMX-1 also participated in operational activity in preparation for the F-35Bs first shipborne deployment in about a year.

DT-III evaluated and validated the Short Take-off and Vertical Landing (STOVL) performance of the F-35B in high sea states, with full weapons loads (external & internal), with asymmetric loading (including taking off with a full load of externals, jettisoning one side and landing), live weapons and night operations.

Onboard maintenance activities involved the entire replacement of an engine, driveshaft and lift fan on one of the VMX-1 aircraft. After replacement, the VMX-1 aircraft was flown off the deck.

USMC VMX-1 Commanding Officer, Col. George “Sack” Rowell, noted that the F-35B will equal or exceed the shipborne operational capabilities of the AV-8B Harrier in high sea states. Flight operations took place in winds of up to 47 knots from various angles, a deck roll of 5° and deck pitch of 3°. Maintenance work was accomplished (albeit with challenges) while the ship was rolling 9°!

DT-III was a great success achieving primary DT-III flight test points as well as numerous additional milestones for the F-35B
• Shipborne integration of Autonomic Logistics Information System (ALIS) V.2
• Engine, driveshaft and lift fan removal and replacement aboard a L-Class ship
• Live ordnance operations with the F-35B aboard a ship (from ship to MCAS Yuma Range)
• F-35B integration with USN AEGIS validated
• Operational Test aircraft flew Block 3F software at-sea
• 1st Royal Navy pilot F-35B carrier qualified
• Joint Precision Approach and Landing System (JPALS) utilized for shipborne landing
• Use of night vision goggles (NVG) for landing [WUT?! I think HMDS III is meant but who can know - I wasn't there]

[ADDITION] GEEBUS Journalists are dangerous and incompetent - this is the text from 'bring_it_on' PDF from next page of this thread: "...DT-3 Accomplishments Developmental Test Points • Night Vision Camera (NVC)"

Source: ... 232016-jsf (PDF 0.4Mb)

• Link-16 Integration with a variety of aircraft..."

PHOTO: ... 60x640.jpg
& ... 60x640.jpg

Source: ... s-america/