F-35 Luneburg lens radar reflector

shep1978 · by **shep1978** » 25 Oct 2010, 18:49

The F-22 has one and I assume the F-35 will too so is there any information on it yet? Where will it be fitted and are there any contracts out there for them?

(Not exactly thrilling I know but it did make me curious enough to ask. *Watches as thread sinks to the bottom of the page* )

fiskerwad · by **fiskerwad** » 25 Oct 2010, 19:50

I saw some being sold on the HSN channel last night.
https://www.fushigiball.com/Index.dtm

(Watch the thread traffic pick up now, Shep.)
fisk

popcorn · by **popcorn** » 25 Oct 2010, 23:19

With thousands of these things going to be built, will it really be necessary?

geogen · by **geogen** » 26 Oct 2010, 05:28

I'm pretty sure it won't need one. At most, maybe just config the thing with a couple of underwing smoke-winders?

shep1978 · by **shep1978** » 26 Oct 2010, 08:24

popcorn wrote:With thousands of these things going to be built, will it really be necessary?

I would have thought the fact there will be so many produced actually increases the need for air traffic control to be able to clearly see them?

And Geo, why wouldn't it need a Luneburg lense at all? If world wide ATC has a requirment that F-22 and B-2's not to mention the now retired (or maybe not but thats another new story) F-117 flew with them then I would imagine they'd want the F-35 to also have them. Wouldn't carrying smoke winders under wing instead be more of a logistical and financial headache?

outlaw162 · by **outlaw162** » 26 Oct 2010, 15:55

On going implementation of ADS-B may make this a moot point.

OL

shep1978 · by **shep1978** » 27 Oct 2010, 10:23

outlaw162 wrote:On going implementation of ADS-B may make this a moot point.

OL

Is ADS-B is being fitted to the F-35?

outlaw162 · by **outlaw162** » 27 Oct 2010, 15:15

If it has the latest Mode-S Extended Squitter transponder, it has ADS-B "Out" capability. This is independent of secondary and primary ATC radar returns with faster update rates.

From some of the avionics graphics presented here, it would appear to have this as a part of ATM package with a CDTI. At this point in time, it would be near-sighted not to have it.

OL

geogen · by **geogen** » 28 Oct 2010, 07:25

Interesting as usual, OL.

FWIW, a quick search came up with the following fbo presolicitation. Not sure if there's any relation in this case, but hey, the internet is pretty amazing no matter how you slice it.

Solicitation Number:
R2619 Notice Type:
Presolicitation Synopsis:
Added: Sep 20, 2010 12:27 pm
Sources Sought Synopsis, U.S. Air Force Combat IdentificationMk XIIA / ADS-B Transponder1. Introduction

This sources sought synopsis is being released by the United States Air Force, Electronic Systems Center (ESC), HSJK....

2. Intent

The Government is interested in conducting information exchanges with industry regarding the development and certification of Mk XIIA Identification Friend or Foe (IFF) transponders with embedded support for 1090 MHz Extended Squitter (1090ES) Automatic Dependent Surveillance - Broadcast (ADS-B) OUT, ADS-B IN and a secure variant of ADS-B based on Mode 5. There is particular interest in incorporating these capabilities in the USAF's current and anticipated inventory of Mk XIIA capable APX-119 transponders....

3. Mk XIIA / ADS-B Transponder

DoD, and USAF in particular, have contracted with commercial entities for the development and procurement of Mk XIIA / Mode S IFF transponders to upgrade its fleet of aircraft from Mk XII to Mk XIIA in accordance with DoD directives. Many USAF platforms will be upgrading their current Mk XII / Mode S APX-119 transponders to an Mk XIIA capability and/or procuring a significant number of new Mk XIIA / Mode S APX-119 transponders over the next few years...

The Federal Aviation Administration (FAA) has mandated ADS-B OUT capability for aircraft flying in most US airspace by 2020 as a key part of their NextGen air traffic management strategy. Earlier adoption will allow aircraft to gain certain airspace advantages, such as reduced separation and improved routing for fuel reduction. Currently there is no mandate for ADS-B IN adoption, however significant operational advantages will be available to aircraft with ADS-B IN and associated applications by 2020...

https://www.fbo.gov/index?s=opportunity ... e&_cview=0

shep1978 · by **shep1978** » 28 Oct 2010, 11:41

Heh, its actually quite interesting this, i'm suprised. Seems though its a 2020 thing, what about before 2020?

outlaw162 · by **outlaw162** » 29 Oct 2010, 04:08

2020 is the mandate. Smart money worldwide will have both IN & OUT before then. Mode-S is already required and out there for TCAS (ADS-B IN).

Civil 1090 upgrade is cheap & easy like most of my ex-girlfriends. Military secure system will cost slightly more like my wife.

OL

doge · by **doge** » 25 Dec 2019, 03:15

Has a close-up photo of the F-35's Luneburg lens/radar reflector ever been posted on F-16.net? :roll:

I'll post it because I found it.

(There is a strange shaped object inside. wow)

sprstdlyscottsmn · by **sprstdlyscottsmn** » 25 Dec 2019, 04:53

h-bomb · by **h-bomb** » 25 Dec 2019, 10:46

doge wrote:Has a close-up photo of the F-35's Luneburg lens/radar reflector ever been posted on F-16.net?
I'll post it because I found it. (There is a strange shaped object inside. wow)

That is funny it looks like a sprinkler head for fire suppression system...

hornetfinn · by **hornetfinn** » 30 Dec 2019, 09:21

h-bomb wrote:
doge wrote:Has a close-up photo of the F-35's Luneburg lens/radar reflector ever been posted on F-16.net?
I'll post it because I found it. (There is a strange shaped object inside. wow)

That is funny it looks like a sprinkler head for fire suppression system...

This device might actually work in somewhat similar manner to sprinkler head. I think the idea here is that this device also rotates and creates realistic RCS fluctuation instead of having fixed RCS. Fixed RCS would make it possible to determine real RCS of F-35 which would definitely be undesirible. However it's interesting that this device is not under cover but the cover is cut so that it's visible. This makes me think that it might rotate using air pressure. Of course it might be just a propeller which us used to rotate real Luneburg lenses inside the cover.