Viper jammin'

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steve2267

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Unread post12 Feb 2020, 01:45

What Viper variants incorporated internal jammers? I know the Blk 60 for UAE had the ALQ-165 ASPJ, and Turkey and Greece apparently had some sort of internal jamming system installed, but did any other countries opt for internal jammers? Is the ALQ-165 pretty much the only internal jammer option available for the Viper? Will the F-16V Blk70/72s incorporate internal jammers, or will they have to haul an AN/ALQ-131(V) around if they want a jammer?

Just how good is the AN/ALQ-131(V)? I was thinking the -131 is pretty old, and therefore out-of-date, but perusing the Northrop Grumman webpage for the AN/ALQ-131(V), it sounds like NG has kept they -131 up-to-date with the latest jamming techniques.

TIA.
Take an F-16, stir in A-7, dollop of F-117, gob of F-22, dash of F/A-18, sprinkle with AV-8B, stir well + bake. Whaddya get? F-35.
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deltasierracharlie

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Unread post12 Feb 2020, 03:48

It seems* the Block 70/72 F-16s for Slovakia and Bahrain [will] have/use this here, the AN/ALQ-211 Advanced Airborne Integrated Defensive Electronic Warfare Suite:
https://www.harris.com/solution/advance ... ite-aidews

https://www.harris.com/sites/default/fi ... et-sas.pdf
...
DIGITAL RF MEMORY-BASED JAMMER
> Lightweight, small form factor, high performance
> Defeats pulse, pulse doppler and continuous wave threats
> Full frequency coverage
...

...
FEATURES
> Seamless integration with APG-83 radar
> Extensive built-in-test minimizes I-level support equipment and training
> Integrated modern digital RWR and jammer
> Flight-line reprogrammable
> Block cycle updates supported by the U.S. Air Force for international customers
> Combat-proven advanced electronic countermeasures (ECM) techniques
> Wingman interference mitigation
...


This AN/ALQ-211 EW system has both internal and pod-based variants, the ALQ-211A(V)4 and the ALQ-211A(V)9 respectively. And unless I'm interpreting something wrong, I think the ALQ-211A(V)4 includes the ECM part internally.


*the source:
https://www.dsca.mil/major-arms-sales/g ... ft-support
https://www.dsca.mil/major-arms-sales/s ... n-aircraft
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basher54321

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Unread post12 Feb 2020, 12:27

steve2267 wrote:What Viper variants incorporated internal jammers? I know the Blk 60 for UAE had the ALQ-165 ASPJ, and Turkey and Greece apparently had some sort of internal jamming system installed, but did any other countries opt for internal jammers? Is the ALQ-165 pretty much the only internal jammer option available for the Viper? Will the F-16V Blk70/72s incorporate internal jammers, or will they have to haul an AN/ALQ-131(V) around if they want a jammer?

Just how good is the AN/ALQ-131(V)? I was thinking the -131 is pretty old, and therefore out-of-date, but perusing the Northrop Grumman webpage for the AN/ALQ-131(V), it sounds like NG has kept they -131 up-to-date with the latest jamming techniques.

TIA.




Okay from what is available.

The Block 60 internal EWS suite was called "Falcon Edge" and was unique to that variant - no idea if anyone else procured it.

As mentioned above some systems have already been given for certain countries for new Block 70/72 - however the new Block 70/72 brochure advertises an internal EWS called "Viper Shield" - no other info.

The ALQ-165 ASPJ was the original internal Jamming system that was started in the late 70s but USAF pulled out of in 1989 after tests in an F-16A. It did AKAIK end up in some F-16s (South Korea) by the late 1990s when the issues were sorted out but that system is likely obsolete because it seems to have been replaced a long time ago by others.


The ALQ-184 is the digital version of the ALQ-119 and being podded is likely updated constantly via mostly software - same for the ALQ-131 if they are still used. Going back like 18 years F-16s were carrying the variant ALQ-131(V) - 14.



Also to add the ALQ-211 AIDEWs systems were in some of the Block 50/52+ including Iraq, Poland and listed for Morrocos block 72.

Other systems over the years
Carapace, ALQ-162 (in Pylons), ALQ-178 (Rapport) , EL / L 8212 (pod), ALQ-176 (Pod)
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Boman

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Unread post12 Feb 2020, 15:38

ALQ-211 is retrofitted to ALQ-131 pods, basically retaining the ALQ-131 shape but with new internals. :wink:
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basher54321

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Unread post12 Feb 2020, 17:33

Thanks Boman useful - I had noticed the pod version was a similar shape didn't realise that was the replacement. Most users seem to have gone internal.
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steve2267

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Unread post12 Feb 2020, 17:43

So when a USAF Viper dude goes off to fight... is he dragging an ALQ-131 or ALQ-184 around?
Take an F-16, stir in A-7, dollop of F-117, gob of F-22, dash of F/A-18, sprinkle with AV-8B, stir well + bake. Whaddya get? F-35.
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steve2267

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Unread post12 Feb 2020, 23:16

After reading https://www.harris.com/sites/default/fi ... et-sas.pdf, it appears that the L3Harris AN/ALQ-211 is what I was "after." It appears to be the modern equivalent to what the ASPJ (ALQ-165) was supposed to be. The AN/ALQ-211A(V)4 is mounted internally, and the AN/ALQ-211A(V)9 is mounted in a pod -- appears to replace the guts of the ALQ-131 pod.

I was just thinking that LM is up to the Block 70/72 of the Viper... seems a bit antiquated for a buyer of new Vipers to have to mount a jammer pod.
Take an F-16, stir in A-7, dollop of F-117, gob of F-22, dash of F/A-18, sprinkle with AV-8B, stir well + bake. Whaddya get? F-35.
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marsavian

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Unread post13 Feb 2020, 09:27

I was just thinking that LM is up to the Block 70/72 of the Viper... seems a bit antiquated for a buyer of new Vipers to have to mount a jammer pod.


It might be even more modern to update APG-83 to have EA/EW capability. After all it is based on the APG-81 ...
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steve2267

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Unread post13 Feb 2020, 16:58

marsavian wrote:
I was just thinking that LM is up to the Block 70/72 of the Viper... seems a bit antiquated for a buyer of new Vipers to have to mount a jammer pod.


It might be even more modern to update APG-83 to have EA/EW capability. After all it is based on the APG-81 ...


Who is to say it doesn't? That is most likely a function of software, and I've seen mentioned several times / several places that the APG-83 is software compatible with the 77/81. It may either be that no one has requested it, or it does not want to be advertised in some sensitive places.
Take an F-16, stir in A-7, dollop of F-117, gob of F-22, dash of F/A-18, sprinkle with AV-8B, stir well + bake. Whaddya get? F-35.
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marsavian

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Unread post13 Feb 2020, 18:21

No official literature says it does but yes in theory the APG-81 work on this should provide a template.

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