F-16 and AGM-88 HARM for SEAD missions

[oldiaf]

Before the introduction of block 50 F-16CJ , were the F-16 of earlier blocks able to carry the AGM-88 ? And if so why it was not employed during desert storm and the USAF relied on F-4G ?

[slapshot!]

Before the introduction of block 50 F-16CJ , were the F-16 of earlier blocks able to carry the AGM-88 ? And if so why it was not employed during desert storm and the USAF relied on F-4G ?

The 52nd TFW (primarily the 23 TFS) out of Incirlik used Block 30 F-16's teamed with F-4G's to Attack SAM sites in northern Iraq. This was before the HTS and Block 50 came out, so the F4G was the only plane configured with the ability to track down sites, the F16's supported with more HARM's, or even CBU's in order to destroy the sites.

Years later (1993-94-ish) these units converted completely to the Block 50 (F16CJ) and that is where we are now.

[oldiaf]

Before the introduction of block 50 F-16CJ , were the F-16 of earlier blocks able to carry the AGM-88 ? And if so why it was not employed during desert storm and the USAF relied on F-4G ?

The 52nd TFW (primarily the 23 TFS) out of Incirlik used Block 30 F-16's teamed with F-4G's to Attack SAM sites in northern Iraq. This was before the HTS and Block 50 came out, so the F4G was the only plane configured with the ability to track down sites, the F16's supported with more HARM's, or even CBU's in order to destroy the sites.

Years later (1993-94-ish) these units converted completely to the Block 50 (F16CJ) and that is where we are now.

So these block 30 F-16s didn't use HARM in DS1991 ?

[slapshot!]

Before the introduction of block 50 F-16CJ , were the F-16 of earlier blocks able to carry the AGM-88 ? And if so why it was not employed during desert storm and the USAF relied on F-4G ?

The 52nd TFW (primarily the 23 TFS) out of Incirlik used Block 30 F-16's teamed with F-4G's to Attack SAM sites in northern Iraq. This was before the HTS and Block 50 came out, so the F4G was the only plane configured with the ability to track down sites, the F16's supported with more HARM's, or even CBU's in order to destroy the sites.

Years later (1993-94-ish) these units converted completely to the Block 50 (F16CJ) and that is where we are now.

So these block 30 F-16s didn't use HARM in DS1991 ?

They did use them, just without the HTS. I don't know about their effectiveness in doing so.

[eloise]

normal RWR on F-16 cant geo-locate the SAM radar, it can only give the direction of the threat, thus HARMs can only be used in self protect( SP) or target of opportunity (TOO) mode, thus missiles range is short
ASQ-213 hts can locate the exact location of ground radar, thus HARMs can be used in pre brief (PB) mode => missiles will be lofted and reach much further distance

[sferrin]

Before the introduction of block 50 F-16CJ , were the F-16 of earlier blocks able to carry the AGM-88 ? And if so why it was not employed during desert storm and the USAF relied on F-4G ?

I read in a book, don't recall which off the top of my head, that when the opening bell rung on Desert Storm they had 200+ HARMs in the air pretty much at the same time. They had plenty of shooters. F-4s, A-7s, F/A-18s, EA-6s, etc.

[popcorn]

Before the introduction of block 50 F-16CJ , were the F-16 of earlier blocks able to carry the AGM-88 ? And if so why it was not employed during desert storm and the USAF relied on F-4G ?

I read in a book, don't recall which off the top of my head, that when the opening bell rung on Desert Storm they had 200+ HARMs in the air pretty much at the same time. They had plenty of shooters. F-4s, A-7s, F/A-18s, EA-6s, etc.

Yup, Poobah's Party.

[oldiaf]

Before the introduction of block 50 F-16CJ , were the F-16 of earlier blocks able to carry the AGM-88 ? And if so why it was not employed during desert storm and the USAF relied on F-4G ?

I read in a book, don't recall which off the top of my head, that when the opening bell rung on Desert Storm they had 200+ HARMs in the air pretty much at the same time. They had plenty of shooters. F-4s, A-7s, F/A-18s, EA-6s, etc.

Apart from F-4G .... The Navy took the lead in this sort of missions ... No suprise the HARM was a Navy project in the first place

[sferrin]

Before the introduction of block 50 F-16CJ , were the F-16 of earlier blocks able to carry the AGM-88 ? And if so why it was not employed during desert storm and the USAF relied on F-4G ?

I read in a book, don't recall which off the top of my head, that when the opening bell rung on Desert Storm they had 200+ HARMs in the air pretty much at the same time. They had plenty of shooters. F-4s, A-7s, F/A-18s, EA-6s, etc.

Apart from F-4G .... The Navy took the lead in this sort of missions ... No suprise the HARM was a Navy project in the first place

A piece of early artwork for the then future HARM showed one homing in on a Soviet Kresta I cruiser; presumably to be followed up with PGMs once the fire control radars were offline.

[oldiaf]

Only 13 were equipped with AGM-88 in DS and they were based in Turkey with 12 F-4G

[sluggo357]

Here is what the Hunter/Killer team looked like leaving the tanker for Iraq during Desert Storm... sorry it is so grainy as it is a scan of a print. I wish I had the color negative for this shot. I have all kinds of others... but not this one.

[oldiaf]

Who fired more HARMs in DS ... The USN/USMC or the USAF ?

[jessmo111]

Does anyone know when these F-16sCjs will finally be phased out and replaced by F-35s?
Im also surprised that the USAF doesnt have a weapon that can travel to a sam radar faster than a SDB
The harm wont fit into the F-35s internal bay.

[oldiaf]

Does anyone know when these F-16sCjs will finally be phased out and replaced by F-35s?
Im also surprised that the USAF doesnt have a weapon that can travel to a sam radar faster than a SDB
The harm wont fit into the F-35s internal bay.

Seems the AF will no longer perform SEAD missions ?!! Only the Super Hornets and Growlers will carry the HARM ?!

[slapshot!]

F16CJs are the youngest of the fleet and will probably start being phased out the middle of the next decade (just a guess). The F35 will use its better sensors to be more of a DEAD platform (Destruction of Enemy Air Defense) since it will be able to locate the enemy systems. So the F35 will probably just use ehatever it is packing (CBU, SDB, GBU-12, etc.) to knock out whatever it is aiming for.