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Newbie Joined: Nov 07, 2005 Posts: 7 Status: Offline

I am working for LM here in Thumrait, and looking for F-16 Avionics and E/E, specifically Block 50/52. Oman is a friendly country, but remote. LM has good benefits, and we need these staffed yesterday. I know things were said about Thumrait in the past have been not good. The site is very remote, but LM is trying to improve the situation. It is unaccompanied, but pays very well. In the future there may be more slots opening.

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Enthusiast Joined: Aug 24, 2007 Posts: 86 Status: Offline

Why does everyone from LMAero keep coming onto these boards and asking for applicants? I've known *several* people with terrific (!) F-16 records who applied for everything under the Middle Eastern sun with that bunch, and NEVER heard a word. Their website SAYS they're hiring, but apparently not if you've been outta da service more than 1 week.

Thrilled you and JoeBlow love your assignments, and I'm sure you're good people from your posts; However, the LM recruiters must not be on your wavelength, as they seem to prefer "recency" of experience to depth. (present company excepted)

Personally, I much prefer the civilian, commercial A&P lifestyle. Twice the pay, for half the work. (probably why all our airlines are broke) ahem! Rolling Eyes

Could you e-mail me with more info? markbowman@hotmail.com I am currently working in Iraq as DOD Contractor. Thx

Newbie Joined: Nov 07, 2005 Posts: 7 Status: Offline

To Oldjay:Why does everyone from LMAero keep coming onto these boards and asking for applicants?

I am new to LM Aero, and have taken this assignment because I have goals and thrilled to be work with LM. I came on this board because this is a premier F-16 board. If your friends applied in the past, I can't account for it, but I can state what I know for the future. I am working a resume right now for a QA slot. You must understand LM is a HUGE company, much like the AF was and it moves just as well when it comes to paperwork.

I've known *several* people with terrific (!) F-16 records who applied for everything under the Middle Eastern sun with that bunch, and NEVER heard a word.

Once again, it depends on the requirements of our customers. Their positions are met when they need it, not when we need it. The customer can add and subtract projected slots or positions based on the country's fiscal commitment.

Their website SAYS they're hiring, but apparently not if you've been outta da service more than 1 week.

An assumption. We have talented mechanics that have been off the F-16 much longer than a week. The customer looks at recency of experience to determine whether the applicant would be an asset to help move the customer's country to their goals. LM supplies the experience and know-how to accomplish the customer's mission. I am not spouting the company line, but as former crewchief, this is the reality of the situation.

Thrilled you and JoeBlow love your assignments, and I'm sure you're good people from your posts; However, the LM recruiters must not be on your wavelength, as they seem to prefer "recency" of experience to depth. (present company excepted)

I am too early to say that I love my assignment, but I am learning to adapt and go with my mind open and willing to learn about new culture and a global market.

Personally, I much prefer the civilian, commercial A&P lifestyle. Twice the pay, for half the work. (probably why all our airlines are broke) ahem!

I worked in the civilian market, and if you are getting twice the pay and half the work God bless you. In the my general aviation or corporate world experience, when you got out you started at the bottom no matter what level of mechanic you were in the AF. If you don't have an A&P, which the AF is in it infancy of pushing mechanics to get, you may pull lower wages, depending on where you live. I know guys that took huge pay cuts, just because they needed to put food on the table. They didn't have the luxury to be near a airline hub or company that wants to hire. Yes, airline A&P mechs get paid alot, as well as, pilot salaries and pensions, and that is one of many reasons why ticket prices and overall costs are high for the industry. Its the world we live in and love.

And what do the airlines hand out with the regularity of that huge paycheck? LAYOFFS! I work with alot of former airline guys, from Delta, Eastern, etc. Being someone with out an A&P I'll tell ya, you can pretty much forget a job in the civilian side. If you do happen to find one expect to be making wages not much higher than fast food. With no license you are pretty much useless to most places. You can't sign anything off, without someone with a license holding your hand. Pretty much a 3 level. I will say I did enjoy my year in general aviation. Lots of Variety. I applied to LM aero when I got out for 2 years. Never heard a word. I was applying for any aircraft maint. job they had.

juvat67 wrote:

I am working for LM here in Thumrait, and looking for F-16 Avionics and E/E, specifically Block 50/52. Oman is a friendly country, but remote. LM has good benefits, and we need these staffed yesterday. I know things were said about Thumrait in the past have been not good. The site is very remote, but LM is trying to improve the situation. It is unaccompanied, but pays very well. In the future there may be more slots opening.

Why are you trying to sell us on LM aero? They have people that get paid for that.

cutlassracer wrote:

And what do the airlines hand out with the regularity of that huge paycheck? LAYOFFS! I work with allot of former airline guys, from Delta, Eastern, etc. Being someone with out an A&P I'll tell ya, you can pretty much forget a job in the civilian side. If you do happen to find one expect to be making wages not much higher than fast food. With no license you are pretty much useless to most places. You can't sign anything off, without someone with a license holding your hand. Pretty much a 3 level. I will say I did enjoy my year in general aviation. Lots of Variety. I applied to LM aero when I got out for 2 years. Never heard a word. I was applying for any aircraft maint. job they had.

You reading this brothers and sisters ... so true ...Layoff is the key word.

I did all the Emery Riddle Classes for an A&P and took my general and passed with a 90%. Then 911 happened and I seen what the airliners did with the pilots and maintainers and I did not pursue it any further. Since then talked with allot of ex-contractors in civil aviation (including LM ) who became civil servants. Everyone bailed or had to bail because they thought their job was in jeopardy or got laid off. The only guy that had a good thing to say about a contractor was the dude that worked for GE.

Contracting is about money, but government, federal, and state jobs you are still serving this GREAT COUNTRY. I'm not saying contracting is bad because these companys make this country great but only tend to hire the best on paper education. I truly believe experiance is better than education.

LM called me (once, and I only applied a couple of times) and I still was at the HEATH for 2 more months ... so they said they needed someone now? I guess I could of went AWOL ...

****** a$$ Holes

There are some things you should understand about working for LM Aero...foremost among them is that LM Aero Fort Worth is a lot different than LM Aero Greenville. LM Aero Greenville hires the hourly types for those overseas assignments, and they put together a package that includes some kind of housing allowance, transportation allowance, and typically some kind of bonus to offset the cost of living (might be per diem or some percentage therof). LM Aero Fort Worth hires Field Service types, plant employees, and engineers, along with the other administrative and support personnel required.

The biggest mistake most people make in trying to get hired by Lockheed is to submit a resume and sit back and wait. When your resume goes to Lockheed, it gets scanned into a big bit bucket, and if it does not contain the right keywords, YOU WILL NEVER GET A PHONE CALL. The best way is to read the requisition, see what the keywords are, and put them in your resume. If you know someone who works for Lockheed, so much the better...they may be able to get you the hiring manager's name, and you can send your resume directly to them. If they like what they see, they will call HR and tell them to pull your resume and call you for an interview.

Depending on the importance of the job, you may get an in-person interview or a telephone interview. Most people blow it in the telephone interview. The guy that calls you does not want to hear simple "yes" or "no" answers to his questions. That phone call is the first screening in a long process, and the interviewer is waiting to see what you have to say. In short, BLOW YOUR OWN HORN if Lockheed calls you. Use common sense, they all know that the Air Force will still keep flying sorties without you. Even if they ask you a totally unrelated question, you need to work in some of your qualifications and skills, and what you can do for them. I knew a brilliant Flight Controls guy that I worked hard to get an interview for, and when they called him on the phone, he basically grunted his way through the interview, answering most questions with "yup" or "nope". They still hired him, but not in the position he applied for. This guy had everything going for him, but he didn't interview well, and he was sunk.

If someone from Lockheed calls you, get their name and phone number! Give them a call every now and then or send an e-mail. Things sometimes happen at the last minute and if you happen to call at the right time, who knows?

Be warned, working for a defense contractor is subject to a lot of things. Contract dates slip at the last minute, leaving you holding the bag. Or your DOS may not be just right...if they like you, they will work with you. When I was hired on at Palmdale, I told them I couldn't report for work for six weeks, and they had no problem with that.

Broadcast your security clearance loud and clear, and keep any security clearance paperwork you may have. Keep your training records (I have all of mine from 1982 on) to prove you are who you say you are. Remember those cheesy certificates USAF gave you when you completed a training class? Keep them all!

Do you work with a Lockheed Tech Rep? Get to know him very well, and let him know your intentions of working for Lockheed when you get out. If you are worth something, they will be glad to help. I know of at least two guys working in Field Service now who were recommended by Tech Reps. Their recommendation carries a lot of weight. I have helped people that I know get jobs with Lockheed; these were people I had personally worked with, and that I had no problem with recommending.

Is education important? Yes and no. If you want to be an engineer, you better have that degree. But it is possible to work for Lockheed in an engineering position and not have a degree too. If you read the requisitions, you will see that most of them say that experience can be substituted for education in most cases. But you better walk into that interview with proof of your experience!

Be prepared to understand that your primary objective is to get your foot in the door. Your first job for Lockheed may not be a glamorous one, but if you do it well you will get some respect and recognition, and you can move up.

Don't give up if this is what you want..

Best Regards.

Enthusiast Joined: Aug 24, 2007 Posts: 86 Status: Offline

Appreciate the inside info, LM guys, but it still simply proves my point- The hiring "system" over in Greenville or Worth or wherever is simply so arcane & unwieldy, what's the point? Sure, nothing good in life comes easy, buuuut, *just* like ya said, if the company "filter" is as clunky as their website software, who needs it? And yes, the two guys sitting out here on our 757s night after night grooming their 623s for those UAE and Oman slots NEVER heard a word. Oh, well... I'm sure there's plenty of "networked" folks from Plans & Scheduling, Debrief, Support, & MOC who are flocking to the big sandbox. Who needs these two decent mechanics who love turning a wrench, but don't like e-mail? That's the way their game is played... Think we'll go drink coffee now, fold our collective arms, and pout. Bang Head

Enthusiast Joined: Aug 24, 2007 Posts: 86 Status: Offline

cutlassracer wrote:

Being someone with out an A&P I'll tell ya, you can pretty much forget a job in the civilian side. If you do happen to find one expect to be making wages not much higher than fast food. With no license you are pretty much useless to most places. You can't sign anything off, without someone with a license holding your hand. Pretty much a 3 level. I will say I did enjoy my year in general aviation. Lots of Variety. I applied to LM aero when I got out for 2 years. Never heard a word. I was applying for any aircraft maint. job they had.

Why would you not have an A&P...?

Well, when I finally got off my lazy butt and went to the FAA to get the permision slips to test, they wouldn't give a slip for powerplant. Have tons of engine experience, but according to that particular bean counter it didn't count. Guess 623's meant nothing to that moron. Would have been nice if the AF was helping with A&P's when I was in. Since I'm am civil service now, I don't need one.

Enthusiast Joined: Aug 24, 2007 Posts: 86 Status: Offline

cutlassracer wrote:

Well, when I finally got off my lazy butt and went to the FAA to get the permision slips to test, they wouldn't give a slip for powerplant. Have tons of engine experience, but according to that particular bean counter it didn't count. Guess 623's meant nothing to that moron. Would have been nice if the AF was helping with A&P's when I was in. Since I'm am civil service now, I don't need one.

Weeeell, this is getting slightly off subject at top, (Oman, LM, etc) but a good point. More than almost ANY other topic on this planet, the particular FAA examiner/inspector you talk to at the local FSDO will completely make up his own mind. Totally arbitrary. I realize alot of the FAA dudes on here are feeling the adrenaline surge now to begin typing, but it is true. This is not an opinion, but a fact. Best advice I can give from 10 years ago, find another examiner! Remember, it doesn't matter where you go / school / test, just get the slips and pass der ting. I got all my stuff BEFORE getting out, so Tuition Assistance covered most all of it (Yes! Once again, depends on who you talk to in the Education Office, or VA) but MANY people had been downtown to this "guy" and had the exact same story you did. I talked to my branch Chief, who had his A&P, and directed me to another office in town. Nicest guy I ever met! Done in 10 minutes. Asked me to describe a UC change, stopped after about a minute. Said he'd seen enough BSers with zero engine time before, knew whether or not guys knew anything... Anyway, don't know if you still want it or not from your previous post, but if so, don't let this one bureaucrat stop what you've EARNED at his desk. Find another examiner, treat it like an interview, and send me that case of Lowenbrau with no postage due.
Beer

Newbie Joined: Oct 25, 2007 Posts: 4 Status: Offline

need any crewchiefs?

Enthusiast Joined: Aug 24, 2007 Posts: 86 Status: Offline

oldjay wrote:

Appreciate the inside info, LM guys, but it still simply proves my point- The hiring "system" over in Greenville or Worth or wherever is simply so arcane & unwieldy, what's the point? Sure, nothing good in life comes easy, buuuut, *just* like ya said, if the company "filter" is as clunky as their website software, who needs it? And yes, the two guys sitting out here on our 757s night after night grooming their 623s for those UAE and Oman slots NEVER heard a word. Oh, well... I'm sure there's plenty of "networked" folks from Plans & Scheduling, Debrief, Support, & MOC who are flocking to the big sandbox. Who needs these two decent mechanics who love turning a wrench, but don't like e-mail? That's the way their game is played... Think we'll go drink coffee now, fold our collective arms, and pout. Bang Head

Appreciate Aerotek for proving me right... Applause

Newbie Joined: Nov 07, 2005 Posts: 7 Status: Offline

Guys, dog me all you want, but gotta plug for my program again. I need a 7 level Phase experienced crewchief, with at least 5 years in Phase. Doesn't have to be sequential, could be total over your career, but I need one here in Thumrait. There has been some turnarounds with the program, and it really is not as bad as you think. Please let me know if you are interested.

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