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Sensor integration is all the rage these days. So which has the best sensors, which allow the pilot better situational awareness?

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F-22 as is vs F-35 envisioned? With the exception of radar the Lightning takes the cake. There are plans to upgrade the raptor sensor suite to that of the F-35 though

Thing is, theoretically the F-35's sensors and avionics should give it's pilot better SA seeing as how they are more integrated and overall more "advanced". However despite this the F-22 pilot will almost always enjoy better SA and have an advantage in combat due to the total package (i.e. entire aircraft) capabilities that the F-22 offers.

PhillyGuy wrote:

Thing is, theoretically the F-35's sensors and avionics should give it's pilot better SA seeing as how they are more integrated and overall more "advanced". However despite this the F-22 pilot will almost always enjoy better SA and have an advantage in combat due to the total package (i.e. entire aircraft) capabilities that the F-22 offers.

In what "aspect" does the F-22 have better Situational Awareness over the F-35??? Confused

Especially, considering many of the F-35 features will be back fitted to the F-22.............. Cool

The F-22 has more LO technology integrated into the airframe, a more capable radar in terms of aerial combat, better operating capabilities ensuring the engagement takes place from an advantage and what is the F-35's ALR-94 equivalent?

Elite 1K Joined: Jul 20, 2005 Posts: 1035 Status: Offline

Corsair1963 wrote:

Especially, considering many of the F-35 features will be back fitted to the F-22.............. Cool

Errr...no, thats not going to happen. Whoever told you that was slightly misinformed.

Elite 1K Joined: Jul 26, 2005 Posts: 1455 Status: Offline

I can see both fighters enjoying great SA. As Philliguy says, I can envision the F-22 having a better overall "picture" operating in the environment it was built for, Ie, A2A versus the environment the F-35 will do it`s work in-A2G.
The F-35 should be better suited and therefore have a better "picture" of the tactical picture on the ground. You have to remember that the F-35 main sensor is optimized for mud moving V the F-22`s radar which is the A2A king. I know other systems contribute to SA but it should be excellent for both fighters.

NB: Checksixx` I was also under the impression that the F-22 would receive advances made in the F-35 program, particularly concerning T/R module technology APG-81 to APG-77? I can`t recall where I read this...could be wildly wrong!

F-16.net Editor Joined: Sep 23, 2003 Posts: 2862

Corsair1963 wrote:

PhillyGuy wrote:

Thing is, theoretically the F-35's sensors and avionics should give it's pilot better SA seeing as how they are more integrated and overall more "advanced". However despite this the F-22 pilot will almost always enjoy better SA and have an advantage in combat due to the total package (i.e. entire aircraft) capabilities that the F-22 offers.

In what "aspect" does the F-22 have better Situational Awareness over the F-35??? Confused

Especially, considering many of the F-35 features will be back fitted to the F-22.............. Cool

Growth room. The 77 is a big aperture radar that has a longer A2A range than what one would expect from the limits of a small aperture 81. Extra empty space in the F-22 means more sensor upgrade options over the life of the program.

An EOTS like system can be funded for the F-22. There is space for it. It wasn't put in because of cost.

Side looking cheek arrays on the F-22, space for that too, not put in because of cost ( or cooling? or more blue screen of death worry? Laughing

).

F-22 has better battle space mobility meaning it can move that larger radar footprint around the battlefield faster for what ever use you want including more ISR data (ESM flavor anyway) per hour.

Ground moving target modes (someone correct me) are part of the F-22 block upgrade path. There are a lot more things that can be done with F-22 but the current funding climate is poor.

F-35, DAS and comes with a helmet and EOTS stock trim. Both F-22 and F-35 have good RWR/ESM stuff for targeting and ISR. The radar is the best (exportable) multimode radar you can get for the price. Growth room. Yeah it is open software which should mean excellent long term maintainability ( i.e. years from now you shouldn't have to do the space shuttle thing and go to a computer fair to look for 25 year old computer parts, open software hopefully means you can always use new computer hardware in future updates... less software updating for the purpose of running in a certain box.), I would expect everything is shoehorned in there and any attempt to beef it up may involve more cooling needs. Don't see where you would find the space to help that effort. What you see is what you get. Including, like the Super Hornet, and F-22, any insane crazy over-hype of electronic attack with the AESA has to consider that the current hardware and cooling may be near their limits just to do the original specified mission Wink

. The over-hyped portions of future electronic attack with the existing AESA hardware will have to be proven. And to a point a lot of that even if it is successful, you won't hear too much about it's real combat ability with electronic attack for obvious reasons. Most public info will be speculation by sales people and engineers.

F-35 is meant to be low price. Once Block III software is in place and running without crashing ( radar computers not the jet Laughing

) I think you will know more. On paper F-35 sensors aren't too bad and if everything works (tons of software) you get a pretty good total sensor package out of the box. Note part of situational awareness includes NCW ability to share info from off-board sensors so to be better informed about your battlespace. Currently, over the horizon coms are a red block in the plan meaning Team JSF hasn't made it public for what ever reason. Either that reason is OPSEC or it is the fact that they don't want to commit to putting in a system that has to be compatible with some of our older junk currently used in the NCW framework and have yet to decide what they want to put in the aircraft.

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Forum: F-22A Raptor

Which has better sensors: the F-22 or F-35(as envisioned)?