Forum: Air Force Life

I agree with TC that "Everybody" does not need this in residence. There are instructors already deployed to the AOR who can/could give resistance academics for those individuals, who by the nature of their job or position are likely targets or vulnerable to kidnapping. I think all commanders, convoy personnel, couriers and contracting/purchasing personnel are reasonable additions to those who attend SV-80/82.

On a side note this idea smacks of empire building on the part of those who run SERE.

Also for those who never had the chance to serve with Col Andrews (he was one of my SQ/CCs) his callsign is B.A. ostensibly for Bill Andrews, more intimately for Bad A$$. Then Capt Andrews was hit on the head with a hammer by his Iraqi captors during interrogation for each unsatisfactory answer. He has permanent nervous tics to this day. His return to flying duty was a testament to his skill as a pilot and his determination.

Lastly: All aspects of the RT portion of SV-80 are classified. Please don't talk about them here or on any other public forum.

Arctus wrote:

Lastly: All aspects of the RT portion of SV-80 are classified. Please don't talk about them here or on any other public forum.

Exactly. Everyone who goes through the course has their "war stories" to tell about the experience, but an open forum such as this is no place to do that.

Here is an example of how talking about what you learned in SV-80 is a bad thing. When I was getting qualified to instruct HRC courses, one of the instructors told us a story about a young Airman who upon completing SV-80, thought it would be a good idea to go on his MySpace page and tell the world all the cool things he learned. Any one familiar with the Tap Code? Well thanks to this Airman, it is now open source after he posted the specifics on how to use it on his MySpace page. When I went through the course for the first time (back in '02) this Tap Code was classified, but now you can find it on Wikipedia, for Christ sake.

Needless to say, keep your SV-80 stories limited to your squadron building between individuals with a need to know (i.e. people who have been through the course). Sorry for grand standing here.

Anyway, I have already given my opinion on the matter, and I still feel that this course is not for everyone. We have HRC for people deploying, and that is for all intents and purposes a very watered down version of the course, and is really all the training some of these people need (services?).

Sorry, I did not think that I said anything that wasn't common knowledge, but at any rate my previous reply has been deleted.

I wasn't trying to offend you Elli, but anything that goes on at SV-80 (especially the RT portion) should only be "common knowledge" to those of us who have been through the course. It is common to people like us (flyers or personnel in a flying squadron) 'cause we are around it all the time. At any rate, thank you for taking down your post.

Trust me donk it takes alot more than that to offend me. I guess I am always used to being around people who have been through the courses so saying what I wrote tends to be no big deal. However after going back and reading my post I could see how it could give a tiny glimpse into RT. That is why I removed it, not becasue I was offended. In fact I thought everybody was very calm about it. And I truly thank for for bringing it to my attention.

Hey, no problem. Don't get me wrong, I love hearing SV-80 stories as much as the next person (that has been through the course). I always get a kick out of some of the stuff I hear while conducting refresher training, and I would love to hear (and share) some of your SV-82 stories if we ever meet in the proper environment.

The basic tap code is not classified; it is available in a number of books writen buy the guys who were "there". Some of the other things that go along with it are classified, though.

What are you talking about? The tap code was considered classified (how to use it and what not), and in '02 it was taught as such. All the Airman had to posted was the sheet with the numbers and letters, and that was enough to compromise it. He also posted how he was taught to use it, but just posting the image with the letters and numbers was enough to warrant action. I don't know why they taught just the basics of the code as classified, though, if like you said, it has been open source for quite some time.

I'm not arguing, but that is how they taught it when I went through. And, when I went through the instructor course, they treated the security incident very seriously. I can only think that they would teach the whole thing as classified so you don't disclose any of it.

The vietnan POW's have been talking about the TAP code ever since they have been out. Unless the Air Force came up with something new and high tech TAP code wise, the cat has been out of the bag for a while now.

Don't mean to step on your toes, donk14N; There are aspects of it that are classified, which is why the whole thing was treated as such. As I'm sure you've heard, any material in a classified document (or course, etc) assumes the classification of the highest classified item in the document. So technically, you're right- in that instance, the basic tap code was classified because of the classification of the other things taught with it. But, the tap code, all by it's lonesome, is not. As akruse21 said, it has been out there since those folks got out. I first learned it in high school (late 90's), reading books from some of the big names (Risner, Alverez, and others) who did the real deal.

I do remember hearing about the myspace incident when I went through...it and a number of other security breaches were pounded into us. I remember having to "check" a few pipeliners now and then for chatting when they shouldn't have, but most of the prior-service types there with me knew better.

I've read books that included the Tap Code for many years now. However, there is something else, which is still classified. I don't remember how it went exactly anyway, so I guess it's ok. If someone else knows what I'm referring to, please keep it to yourself.

They gave me a little card with the tap code and the Code of Conduct for us to keep in our wallets back when I went through in 00.

Donk14N? Does that mean you're intel? If so, you shouldn't need VPRGUY to tell you how things are classified, that's like day 1 of training isn't it???

Quote:

They gave me a little card with the tap code and the Code of Conduct for us to keep in our wallets back when I went through in 00.

We got the same just a couple months ago.

Donk and flanker -- I don't mean to be knocking anyone or their understanding of classified materiel. Just using donk's response as an example, more for the benefit of others than for donk himself.

Forum: Air Force Life

SERE training for the whole Air Force